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Old 08-01-2012, 03:13 PM   #1
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http://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanva...winnings-back/

This article suggests possibilities that are so ridiculous I'm amazed they are even considering them. I know there is a PPA action thread but I think this deserves its own thread and immediate attention.

I believe they will do the right thing in the end, but just to make sure, everyone should contact the DOJ and politely raise any of these points:

1) It would be fundamentally unfair for the DOJ to facilitate non-Americans retrieving their whole balance while leaving Americans with any less. The DOJ exists to protect Americans. We pay taxes so that they protect us and bring justice to those who defraud us. To only give us deposits back would make them no better than the people who defrauded us.

2) Paying out deposits only would be fundamentally unfair, the fraud we were victims of deprived us of our full account balances, not just our deposits. But for the fraud, we would have our full account balances. If they want to live up to their name, the Department of Justice, they must make us whole.

3) You have more than enough money from this settlement to pay us off. No explanation will suffice for not making us whole.

4) Anything else you can think of.

Contact them through any or all of these options:

https://twitter.com/TheJusticeDept

https://twitter.com/SDNYnews

https://www.facebook.com/DOJ

SDNY Civil Division
(212) 637-2800

Department of Justice Main Switchboard - 202-514-2000

Office of the Attorney General Public Comment Line - 202-353-1555

Last edited by Kevmath; 08-01-2012 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:15 PM   #2
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

yes they will
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:15 PM   #3
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

Interesting read! They certainly couldn't give a person back their "total deposits". Article has statement from PPA why would they allow Stars to refund amounts on deposit.

/agree

Yes to at least some $$ returned

Last edited by BEANO52; 08-01-2012 at 03:20 PM.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:18 PM   #4
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

omg if the government ****s us again.....
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:18 PM   #5
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

US players are net losers, it would cost more to refund deposits rather than balances, not to mention the logistical nightmare of figuring all of that out. I will be absolutely shocked if compensation is based on anything other than current balances, with issues such as phantom deposits being the only exception. Notice that the deadline for US vs ROW categorization was set for June 29 and not April 14th, if they really wanted to punish US players, it would have been the other way around.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:18 PM   #6
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

0 on FT but did deposit over 3k, means victim
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:20 PM   #7
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

it's so upsetting that this is actually a semi-legitimate concern
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:21 PM   #8
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

So gross that this is even up for discussion. Going to be a sad day if I find out I've been waiting all this time for nothing.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:22 PM   #9
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

Hell yeah durrr could get his $50 deposit back while Guy gets millions, seems right.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:22 PM   #10
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

So what else could they potentially base payments on besides account balances?

Last edited by WildBobAA; 08-01-2012 at 03:23 PM. Reason: they could potentialy base it on how much someone deposited? lol wtf
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:24 PM   #11
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Pretty scary read :/
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:25 PM   #12
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

The writing was on the wall when they inserted the phrase "petition for compensation" in their settlement statement rather then just stating players would get paid their balances. It wouldn't surprise me to see some sort of very onerous petition process where it's up to the players to provide various proofs of deposit and banking records (many of which are now years old and no longer available for those who didn't save everything) to get any of their money back. Every dollar not paid to the players is another dollar in the pocket of the DOJ - they have huge incentive to shaft.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:28 PM   #13
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

lol, something else just hit me.

Suppose i had a deposit bonus of $500 match. Wonder how they would deal with that?

Over thinking... I'm sure it would be based on account balances only, obviously.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:28 PM   #14
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

Not trying to piss on the people hoping for a refund, but....

I've been practicing law for 15 years and the gov't has exceptionally solid grounds to not return winnings. You can argue until you're blue as to the legitimacy of the law, your interpretation of the law, etc. Until they're challenged in federal court, the only opinion that matters is the DoJ.

That's why the PPA is arguing inconsistency and impracticability as opposed to illegality.

I'd be shocked if the DoJ doesn't just pay out account balances but they definitely have the law on their side if they chose not to. It would take a few players with deep pockets (or big losses who can get lawyers on a contingency) to challenge if the DoJ does go that route.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:32 PM   #15
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Re: The Big Question For Full Tilt's U.S. Players: Will They Get Their Poker Winnings Back?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudd View Post
US players are net losers, it would cost more to refund deposits rather than balances, not to mention the logistical nightmare of figuring all of that out. I will be absolutely shocked if compensation is based on anything other than current balances, with issues such as phantom deposits being the only exception. Notice that the deadline for US vs ROW categorization was set for June 29 and not April 14th, if they really wanted to punish US players, it would have been the other way around.
I agree. Your last point is especially important. The only US players that relocated after BF to continue playing poker online were winners who presumably had more in their accounts then they'd deposited. If the government was trying to screw players out of their profits they could have made the date for moving April 14 instead of June 29 and all of those big winners who moved after BF would be out all their profits.
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