Agreed mark: re Patrick

From my perspective youve always been inspirational to me. I've always played short stack poker and switched from Nlh to PLO a few years ago when pf and flop edges left the nlh game. I've taken a similarish route to you, however Ive worked the whole way through, continued to play (with some longer breaks in between eg 6 months here and there), tied up my money property or my pension.

You are the most legendary short stack pro and congrats on all your poker success at the time.

A few more questions if you don't mind me asking:

- what made you want to completely quit rather than continuing being a live pro or bum hunt the Euro sites where PLO was thriving post Black Friday
- what was the motive behind putting your money in a pension rather than actively managing it
- do you still ever feel tempted to play, with the exception of this short return
- do you still keep in touch with friends in the scene and if so how does this make you feel about the decision you made

1) When I returned for a few months I barely enjoyed winning, and I hated losing. Mistakes would frustrate me for hours, even days and things I did well were forgotten quickly. I tried to make myself play, with the idea that it was a good use of my time. Though without the motivation to improve or reach some imaginary goal, I just hated it I made a conscious choice to be done, with emotional happiness as the driving force.

2) I have a 'self managed super' which basically means I fully control the money in my pension and can actively manage it. That being said I've bought into index funds with low admin fees, buy and hold, no trading. Overall equation was: Downside is can't spend it till I'm 60+, upside is I pay 15% tax till then.

3) No, not really. I like the idea of destination tournaments in cool locations, but mostly just to see people and catch up. The idea of winning a tournament seems exciting, but the actual poker played giving it a shot isn't appealing. I'm also about 4 years removed, so being profitable after rake is by no means a certainty, or even likely.

4) I definitely have some good friends from poker still. But it used to be 80% from poker and 20% from high school, university, etc... now it's probably 20% from poker (some of whom no longer play), and I've rekindled old friends from other walks of life. The guys who still play huge volume are hard for me to engage with as they are very focussed on one thing. The guys who have used poker as an avenue to do other things are fantastically interesting to me.


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Cool, Mark Vos well thread!

Thanks for posting and it is cool to see someone who has made their money in the game and walk away when on top.

pius says sup pat

1. Interesting response. A lot of my friends who were at the top realised it's impossible to achieve anything greater online and have moved to the nosebleeds live and enjoy the 'new' challenge

2. Explain the pension to me. So you pay 15pc tax on any income? Is there a tax free allowance and what happens when you want to draw money out? For me the only reason I'm putting money into a pension is that in the U.K., my employer matches 25pc and I don't get immediately taxed at source or any income until I start drawing it

3. You would beat midstakes PLO without doubt

4. Are any of them success stories now (outside of poker). I don't know any and would be interested to see if anyone knew of any?

2) For Aussie "superannuation" each year you can put 30k deductible from your income, so this is something everyone who can do, should do, it's tax free vs your highest taxed income. Beyond that you can put in post tax money if you want to.

Following that investment earnings within your super get taxed at 15% per year instead of your marginal tax rate if you invested personally.

You can not take the money out till you are 55+, unless you have a terminal illness I believe. The idea is that money will be there for me when I'm older just like everyone else who is contributing annually from their jobs.

4) Define success? Purely financially? Of my friends who used to play poker one has created startups that have become viable though not massive yet, one bets on sports, one became a teacher, one started a family and become a stay at home dad, one got a regular job in sales, one got a job at a hedge fund, all of these I consider successful when you consider that a number have had alternate and bad outcomes.

Happy to hear all is well outside of poker. I must have told that story about my first time ever at a bar 50+ times

Interesting in the uk maximum contributions which aren't taxable are 40k pa and you don't get taxed on any income until you start to draw from your scheme (same age 55 or older)

When you do:

- first 25pc is tax free
- any annuity income is treated as taxable income


4. Success in this example would be achieving the same level of accomplishment in other avenues as they did in poker. Poker players have fantastic minds and I entirely agree that these people are all successful. in retrospect I think it was a slightly moronic question by me! However, I guess what I'm trying to pick out is what are the alternative avenues other former successful poker players have pursued and succeeded at.

Overall I really appreciate your time and your detailed response. You really are awesome and I wish you success in the future.

Robert

Haha Soho right?

Congrats on your continued and exponential success inside of poker!


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This!

Cool thread, thanks for sharing. I (like so many others obv) remember railing those FTP games, wayyy back in the day when I was just starting high school

Best of luck to you with everything in the future

Haha yup, thanks man. Good luck with everything!

wut

It is terrific to have you posting in this thread.

I also have immense respect of your life choices. Brilliant and well done!

One question. What was the stock standard back in the day?

http://www.rakeback.com/full-tilt-poker/pros/red-pros/


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Ha ha. So it was 100%. I enjoyed my 27. Too bad those days are gone.

The big swing to FT came when Party Poker shut it down at UIGEA. The exodus began and everyone in the know moved to Fulltilt at 27. Of course, the pros like you played at that whopping 100% or better. Easy game.

Just think, on a typical 6max table the site got 6x 100% rake back, per table, across thousands of tables, 24 hours a day... and found a way to mismanage itself into the ground.

They would have been pulling well over a million dollars a day at their peak.


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No doubt. So sick. They had a gift from the heavens and then ultimately decimated it.

You got out well before the cluster ****. You moved on, pinched yourself, thanked your lucky stars, and realized if you kept it all together your future was set. You're a shining star dude!

If you ever make it to Vancouver I might buy you a beer. But the truth is it might have to be up the coast where the fishing is good.

+1

hi mark.

How old were you when you left South Africa? Did you ever play while you lived there? (online or live)

You mean that as a figure of speech? What did he say exactly? He doesn't seem like the angry type altogether.
Thanks for the cool thread.

When you title a thread then run out of interesting points 22 shy of your target..

I was 16 or 17, and no poker there except for a laugh with friends. I started playing poker online when I was 19 or 20.

No, literally.

I hadn't thought about it at all for months then next thing I knew Antonius had done an interview saying I told management untrue things, and that he wanted to MMA fight me.

At first I had no idea what it was even about, then I guessed it must be the two plus two post. He, nor anyone else at full tilt, ever spoke to me about it at all.

When you create a sham account and try to be funny but fail miserably. Seriously dude, this guy is a legend and is taking the time to come in here and answer interesting questions about poker and his life, gtfo

Lol 22 points fail

Got over yourself above poster

Think he can laugth at the joke you fube.