There been same disscusion in I.T. forums for a while. People show more tendency to FreeLance(web-designers/programers) So people debating about pros&cons working in small/big company vs working on yourself. Only on this case we have 2 equally same jobs.

For I.T. self employment(poker equivalent)

• No boss/freedom
• Risk of not having constant customers(Variation in poker)
• Also this require some other skills : talking with clients, managing time of projects, etc. (In poker we also need other skills not related to playing the game)

For I.T. in company

• Higher career opportunities
• Higher maximum wage, as being self-employed IT worker has capped salary at some point
• Pay-check with no risk

Although this can hardly be compared to business as it doesnt require any $ bankroll/investments.

i am a poker pro because 12 to 13 years ago i discovered it, enjoyed it, and found myself to be pretty good at it relative to others at that time and then it snowballed. I won my first tourney i ever entered before I was 18 at a local bar for $410 #sickbrag

I certainly never once thought, "I want to be a poker pro so i don't have to contribute to society."

I am a poker pro because that is the niche I have found, pretty much no other reason. I can work quite hard in a lot of areas in my life(fatherhood, husband, chores, exercising). I wish to be as hard of worker in poker as I was in those other areas, I'd be making quite a bit more money per year.

Working in your bedroom is nice way of saying sleeping at the office.

Yup, man. After working ~10 years in corporate, I left a 6-fig career for poker because I didn't want to contribute to society any more.

So stupid. If the player is paying taxes, he's contributing. There are tons of players on 2p2 alone that are admitted fish who like gambling and lose regularly. As far as I'm concerned, pros are giving them the entertainment that they want. That is putting smiles on peoples faces and that is also contributing to society.

That's pretty much right, but it assumes self-employed = contract work,. When you are self-employed in IT that can also include working on your own projects so you're not salary capped in that case and if you get some extra income streams going then it can be lower variance than relying on a single employer.

Plenty of business doesn't really require high investment - often all you need to get started is a computer, a suit and your brain or mouth - things you already have. Certainly when I started my English school I just started with myself as the first teacher and personally delivered 20K leaflets advertising it. I always say capitalism is a bit of a misnomer these days, because so many businesses are not capital-intensive but business-model, idea or quality-intensive

Congrats on calling a pretty legit post "stupid" ....then making an incredibly stupid one yourself

"Pros give fish the entertainment they want and put smiles on their faces"

Poker wouldn't exist without pros. Right

Many pros don't pay taxes and freely admit to that ....like its a badge of honour / necessary path of their livelihood.

stopping 50k or was it 100k job after ten years. I would continue at least till later and retire to a cheaper country, see numbeo.com for the costs of living. And about doing better at poker, i would be happy to make 5k to 10k per year till i get the permanent residence and possibly nationality. After that aim of mine fails in about two years, i go to school for about two years and move in the uk, possibly a pension in a cheaper country, to get my dream one way or the other, poker having little to do with it, just trying to turn poker that profitable first, being my hobby anyway.

I read this three times, and I still have little idea what you're talking about.

Just random words.

Guessing what he mean to say in English wasn't close to that lol


Just wanted to say cheers to the charming well adjusted pro on here who didn't like my posts and sent me this PM. Would put a large amount of money this troll belongs to 'isolated, JudgeHoldem or p2 dog p2 (with ap0logies to those two it wasn't)

While that doesn't look good, we are not all evil non tax paying heathens

Sorry you are right and I almost put a disclaimer in that then forgot, I don't hate all pros. I'm a big fan of borg23's posts and others like him. Some professionals have a clue about how the majority have destroyed online poker and their behaviour in general.

Its a math thing though, would put the doucebag meter for pro poker players at around 90-95%. Like most areas of life, you can tell who they are by the way they communicate.

Actually after reading it a few times I think they are agreeing with you Amadan. It looks like they are saying that they wouldn't leave a 50k or 100K job and would stay until they retire. They would be happy to make 5K or 10K a year playing poker until they get something like citizenship somewhere (maybe the UK?). They think they will fail in 2 years and then go to school for 2 years (maybe they mean at the same time?) and then move to the UK to work until they can draw a pension and move to a country with a low cost of living. ... I think that's what they are saying.

@Amadan

Do you know someone who wants to be a poker pro? I would really appreciate a solid yes or no just so I stop wondering that every time I open this thread.

my troll game aint that strong bro

We've been over this countless times before. Paying taxes doesn't contribute to society, they are transfer payments. And you'd be paying them either way, regardless of how you make your income (actually, you'll be much more likely to pay them if your income isn't from pro poker playing, because frankly many poker players are tax cheats). Mutually beneficial transactions without externalities contribute to society.

As for poker pros putting smiles on fish? Are you serious? I think if you ask the fish, they would be much happier playing poker without you being there. Fish smile more when they lose less often. Players like Negreanu or Hellmuth provide entertainment; anonymous regs destroy it.

Lol. I have played with many of these people you say provide entertainment, and while some do, there are some that are the biggest detestable pieces of **** I've ever played with and the rich recs do NOT enjoy their company.

As for contributing to society, if you're looking for only your job to do that, then you're doing it wrong.

Vast truths spoken here.

This is pretty much a tangent, but it is germane to the discussion of playing poker as a profession v. 'working' at a traditional job.

I would be interested in seeing a Venn diagram that shows us the subset in percentages of people who meet all of the following:

1. play poker for a living
2. are good enough at it to make a profit
3. have the skill needed make enough of a profit to consider it a 'nice' living. Maybe otherwise defined as an amount of money that is roughly equal to the potential 'real world' income likely
4. have the skill needed to make enough money that when you factor in the vacation, health insurance benefits, paid sick time, and other benefits, they still beat the 'real world'
5. who practice proper bankroll management so that life as a pro is sustainable
6. who are also disciplined enough to pay taxes such that tax-deferred investmetn/retirement vehicles are taken advantage of so that they have something to retire on
7. who won't ruin all of the above by blasting off money in the pits or lavish beyond-means lifestyle choices

My guess is that this subset of all poker 'pros' would be excruciatingly tiny, thereby maybe supporting the idea that choosing to be a poker pro as a career is really only a good idea for _very_ few people.

NOTE: all of that said, _plenty_ of people screw around doing all sorts of stuff for many years when they're done with schooling, and then go on a little later in adulthood to move into well-paid, satisfying careers. Hell, I didn't do anything even remotely useful or lucrative until I was into my 30's. There are plenty of young folks who make much more playing cards than I made [insert-lame-job-here] during that same time, then move on to a career with more stability, structure, and sustainability (given the above list of pitfalls). To those folks I say 'go for it.' But for people who are really meaning to have a career as a poker player, there is much to consider beyond being good enough to win.

^ I meet all the criteria above. To give a better idea where I come from, this response below was a post I made a few years ago (on my post 2+2 hack account) back when someone suggested that making 20/hr at poker would be fine long term. Might be of some use to people here if they're wondering briefly, what the mindset is (or needs to be) in order to give the best chances at succeeding in meeting this criteria.

Slavery was never abolished, it was only extended to include all the colors.

I don't mind my body being a slave, so long as my mind is the master.

Applies business and poker

And hookers. Being one that isn't a train wreck that is

I didn't mean in person, I thought that should've been obvious. The concept of poker pros providing entertainment by their mere presence in games they don't start is laughable beyond words. I meant that people like DN are TV personalities and not just poker players, and thus help create a form of entertainment known as poker TV.
The term "contribute to society" is really economic in nature, and not "I volunteer to change old people's diapers" thing. It really boils down to "are you earning your keep, or are you mooching off others".

Everything material in your life, and most of the services you're enjoying, are a result of someone else performing their job. When you make your money to buy these material goods and services, are you getting that money from creating these material goods and services for someone else, or are you doing it purely by making someone else get less of these goods and services? That's really what is meant by "contribute to society".

Are poker players slaves? Hell no, I work a slave job. Work to the point of exhaustion everyday and I can't afford food or rent. Slowly drifting into debt with zero opportunity for escape, 80k a year clicking buttons sounds like Nirvana. I get no days off ever and can't afford breakfast, you want to talk about slavery?

Try working until your feet are bleeding and someone gives you **** the instant you stop working, that's ****ing slavery.