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The "MoneyMaker" effect.... The "MoneyMaker" effect....

06-26-2015 , 09:50 PM
I think this should be considered a "view", and I ask for yours.

So, with the negativity concerning poker that has ran rampant lately (Bots, cheaters, MA in HS, VPN, "Grey area programs" etc), it got me to thinking about the "MoneyMaker Effect" which I hope is generally considered the start of the poker boom.

And it got me thinking about what do we need to happen for the next "boom" to hit. Obviously some legislation within the US would help, but what were the other factors of the boom?

I believe it was people realizing they could "do that". They could change their standard of living drastically in just a few days at a poker tournament. It gave them hope. All of this negativity (no I'm not accepting that 'it is the way it is') surrounding poker has made a lot of us jaded, and I believe it's causing our love for the game to dwindle.

If those of us who do this for a living don't love it, that spreads to those recs we need in our games for sustainability. And if they don't love it, or at least have fun and consider it viable entertainment, then our ecosystem will fail. We've already seen the dwindling of HS, which was a big draw 5 years ago for people to watch, and keep up on.

I personally am going to try and take a more positive view on poker, and try and understand my limits as my job, and becoming the best I can be so I can be "promoted" to higher stakes. I'm also going to try not to let those whose actions don't directly effect me, not bother me and figure it'll get sorted by those it concerns directly.

The Hastings thread has over 1k responses. I'd settle for 20 opinions on what can be done to create the next boom.

In before someone says "there won't be another boom", "Poker is Dead", or any other response in the same ilk. That's negativity, and if that's truly what you believe, then I ask "Why are you here?" So there's a question for those as well.
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06-26-2015 , 09:53 PM
you cant be in before anything if your the OP. truth is poker really isn't dead, but there will never be another boom. even 1/2 nl has gotten tough to beat ffs
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06-26-2015 , 09:56 PM
If there was another boom even to a smaller scale, 1/2nl may not be so tough to beat.

Just a disclaimer I tilted out of my mind about something secondary earlier today, and I literally am trying to figure out why I get so angry about something secondary yet when facing a huge problem or issue in my life I'm calm and logical. It lead me to post this thread, and try to dust off the negativity associated with something I truly love which is the battle.
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06-26-2015 , 09:57 PM
there won't be another boom

Last edited by xalas; 06-26-2015 at 09:58 PM. Reason: didn't want op to be a liar
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06-26-2015 , 09:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloatingOOP
you cant be in before anything if your the OP
Story checks out.
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06-26-2015 , 10:00 PM
Improvement in the economy. Not only would recreational players have more money to throw around but intelligent young men would do something worthwhile with their lives.
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06-26-2015 , 10:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloatingOOP
you cant be in before anything if your the OP. truth is poker really isn't dead, but there will never be another boom. even 1/2 nl has gotten tough to beat ffs
1/2 online maybe, but live.. lol
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06-26-2015 , 10:04 PM
I miss the good ol days of first hearing about poker. Getting excited to play a $5 or maybe even. $10 game with friends when I was 16. Ordering pizza and just clowning around. I really miss those days a lot.

I still enjoy playing but def don't have the butterfly's I once did. Only thing I get super excited for is going to Vegas to play 1-2 events per year.

Someone invent a time machine please.
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06-26-2015 , 10:25 PM
Another boom thread but....

I assume we are talking live poker and apologize but below is US centric

There doesn't have to be another boom, just more money coming in the game from new players vs going out via rake and from bad to good players

What will help drive that is more poker on prime time TV. Ala the days , HSP, PAD , NBC heads up, and even silly shows like poker celeb
showdown

None of that will happen until online sites start pumping money back into network TV shows

That won't happen till online comes back.
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06-26-2015 , 10:32 PM
Federal legal poker would be another boom. Most people who arent currently playing dont follow any of the scandals or drama.
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06-26-2015 , 10:33 PM
If it DOES happen it will be after everybody forgets about it for a while, at which point most of us will be old and gray (or dead and gone).
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06-26-2015 , 10:34 PM
1. More regulated online poker in the US

2. States pooling players around media markets - right now it doesn't make sense for online sites in NJ to buy a lot of ads on TV in Philly... If NJ/PA merged player pools, that would change. This would lead to more ad buys and...

3. More poker on major TV networks in prime time

4. More online satellites to major live events

5. Moneymaker II - Some unknown non-pro guy wins a big tourney and draws more rec players in... It's inevitable if 1, 2, 3 and 4 happen, it's just a matter of how long it takes.

None of that will lead to a boom as big as the Moneymaker effect, but it will help... Poker is always in a cycle of dying, which is offset by booms from time to time.
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06-26-2015 , 11:07 PM
To much information now.
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06-26-2015 , 11:10 PM
Tv poker is never going to be what it once was. No characters now like in the early days. Hang poker up in the wardrobe next to you're shell suit because neither of the two are coming back into fashion
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06-26-2015 , 11:57 PM
TV poker is dead with guys taking 2min to fold 83o and some guy speaking about ranges. Who wants to watch it?
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06-27-2015 , 12:09 AM
The next boom is called daily fantasy sports.
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06-27-2015 , 12:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PTLou
What will help drive that is more poker on prime time TV.
That would help.

But there are many more people on the internet now than there were then. And TV programming is more fragmented now. So it may be more cost effective to create the content on the internet.

What would it look like? How good could it be?
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06-27-2015 , 12:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gausspoker
TV poker is dead with guys taking 2min to fold 83o and some guy speaking about ranges. Who wants to watch it?
The tanking definitely doesn't help poker. But as far some 'some guy speaking about ranges', I've had the same idea myself. Maybe not going into a whole lot of specifics or in depth analysis, but appeal to the crowd who is smart/thinks they are smart, and provide some basic strat in an entertaining way not just a play by play, with a color commentator who makes jokes and does special interest pieces (although those are great to 'for the story').

I think the announcers could figure out a way to be entertaining and give some strat out (AJ Fenix does this). Joey could do this, although he hates talking strat but some basics I think are necessary as the novelty of poker has tarnished a bit.

Last edited by Snuffers; 06-27-2015 at 12:19 AM. Reason: No Edit, just No disrespect to chad/McEahren, or however you spell it, intended...
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06-27-2015 , 12:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffers
The tanking definitely doesn't help poker. But as far some 'some guy speaking about ranges', I've had the same idea myself. Maybe not going into a whole lot of specifics or in depth analysis, but appeal to the crowd who is smart/thinks they are smart, and provide some basic strat in an entertaining way not just a play by play, with a color commentator who makes jokes and does special interest pieces (although those are great to 'for the story').

I think the announcers could figure out a way to be entertaining and give some strat out (AJ Fenix does this). Joey could do this, although he hates talking strat but some basics I think are necessary as the novelty of poker has tarnished a bit.
I like the ranges talks, because I understand it. But if we are talking about poker boom, we want new people coming to the game and they have no idea what a range is. But I don't know maybe you are right, this is just my perception about people who are new to the game
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06-27-2015 , 12:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VP$IP
That would help.

But there are many more people on the internet now than there were then. And TV programming is more fragmented now. So it may be more cost effective to create the content on the internet.

What would it look like? How good could it be?
I think it could be great if done right, and not just for reg players, but appeal to the general population and their psychology, give em the game we love and pepper in some of what they love (special interest, knowledgeable commentators, maybe a news show and some visible rankings give people an idea of who to root for, wrap it up in a story mode and let people relate (or not so much) with these people. Added benefit, itcould provide some extra income for those players who are personalities too. I like the idea of doing something on the internet as its cost effective, and gives more flexibility.
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06-27-2015 , 12:27 AM
The answer is already in this thread:

1. Regulated / legal online poker in the US
2. Next boom is daily fantasy sports
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06-27-2015 , 01:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by striiing
Tv poker is never going to be what it once was. No characters now like in the early days. Hang poker up in the wardrobe next to you're shell suit because neither of the two are coming back into fashion
Poker became interesting because of the personalities of a generation that had to sell themselves. The intentionally uninteresting GTO personalities dominating the game are crushing any interest in it.
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06-27-2015 , 02:18 AM
Option to play two second tables, where you basically get two seconds to make a decision or your hand is checked or folded if someone bets. One way to even out those using huds and gto charts vs fun players, and Isuldur1 would probably be champion at the game
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06-27-2015 , 03:39 AM
The single biggest factor for any potential future boom would be tied to legalization of online poker in the US… I think everything flows from there. Like others have already stated, I don’t see another huge “Moneymaker” boom, but the game definitely has room to grow from its current state.

Best-case, (regulated) online poker is legalized in the US allowing US-based players to play versus ROW players. 2nd best-case would be US players allowed to play versus everyone else in the US. The current state-specific model (NJ / NV only) is floundering and not doing anything to expand poker as a whole given the player pools are far too small. Either way, integrity of the game has to be paramount.

Ultimately the majority of poker on TV was either outright time buys by online sites (PAD, PS Big Game, etc) or almost completely subsidized by online poker advertising. If/when online poker is legalized in the US; the sites will (hopefully) now have money to advertise and possibly subsidize new shows.

As someone else already mentioned ITT, the product itself has gotten insanely boring to the casual fan, and that’s exactly who’s needed for another boom. Guess this is nitpicking between watching a live-stream versus TV, but the incessant tanking for 5 mins every single decision is deathly boring. At least this can be edited out on TV. I’d rather stab myself than see more nonsense like Hevad Khan or Humberto Brenes acting like idiots on TV, but a little bit more character/personality wouldn’t hurt the game.
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