Perhaps I've mistaken you for someone else. Feel free to PM me. I don't think we should have this discussion in this thread, Bobo will probably move/delete these posts as off-topic.

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Kahn

Hello fellow poker players.

I am one of the players with money stuck on FF... I am fully aware that FF will not magically reopen their business and if we do nothing about it only a miracle can get our funds back.

Does anyone have any idea how to continue? Ideally we would find a law firm that would accept to represent our interest and pay them with part of our balances if they manage to get us something back.
If I understand correctly FF owes around 2 MIO to their customers so I am pretty sure there is a law firm that would be interested in a deal... I have read and visited Game Protect website, but frankly I don't know who to trust at this point and I am not willing to invest anymore money in this ''lost case''.

Thoughts?

The reality is you would be chasing after several people in different countries and surely some would have no extradition treaty. That means IF you win, you can take the lien you've been awarded and line a bird cage. The reason a US citizen goes to these countries is because their money is safe from seizure and/or liens.

If you expect to get your money back from a straight-up con artist, you will need a face to face meeting when they have not been informed of it in advance. Otherwise.....your money is gone, for good.

My attorney told me that if enough people join the litigation, his (international) law firm can continue on a contingency-fee basis. Google 'full flush litigation' and then look for the Game Protect website. The webpage is written in broken English but I have talked to the attorney several times and he seems fully competent. This is the only chance in my opinion to get our money.

Game Protect is a 'consumer protection' advocacy type site that is poorly written and unprofessional.

Sorry to sound negative about it all, I have a pretty decent background in international business and tax havens. The odds of people being savvy enough to conduct a fraud like this, and for the amount they did, without being aware of how to safely hide the money is highly unlikely. Full Tilt was taken over by PS, a solvent entity. No one is going to touch this disaster in my opinion.

We really need agirlinoh aka IneedPaidFF to join the litigation. MeyVn do u talk with him/her? This is TookChips.

i dont, but I'm sure he/she has tried

my 2 cents guys on this whole mess.


Game Protect person seems to be illegitimate,
Kahn is a shady guy, maybe not as bad as he's made out to be, but shady.
Lastly, No one is getting any of their 'money' from FF
sad but true

IMPORTANT:

I have been in contact with Agirlinoh and have evidence of a $151,000+ bankroll that has been stolen outright. He is joining the litigation effort against Full Flush and it's not too late to join.

The deal is a standard contingency-fee offer from the international debt-collection firm of Van de Laarschot & Associates: they keep 30% of all collections, and players are awarded 70%.

I've been in the online game for probably 10 years and am an attorney myself. This is the ONLY chance we have. There is no doubt in my mind that they are planning to steal all player funds (over $2,000,000).

We now have the leverage to make this a big case, as the firm stands to gain $50,000+ if they can collect (they get 30% but pay for all of the fees of the litigation). With player bankrolls combined I believe plaintiffs currently have about $200,000 in claims. Can we take these scumbags down? I've filed a complaint with the United States Department of Justice as well. They are going DOWN. I will take this case pro-bono if I have to in order to help the international firm.

https://game-protect.com/full-flush-litigation-offer/

That link goes to a pretty badly written website, but it does not say it is no fee, in fact they say it will cost $1,500 to "invest" and all you need is a 1.1% chance to win the case for it to be worth it. I have no idea who they are talking to - maybe that one guy who ran up his balance when nobody else placed value on the money. Good luck with it I guess, but after reading that website I know I would never send a single cent to them for anything, and even if it was free I would have zero expectations.


Some of what they say includes the following:

- You can join the Full Flush Poker litigation proceeding even if you have no proof of the full amount owed. But you need at least any kind of proof that they owe you money.

- As all participants know, the for you cost free Full Flush Poker litigation proceeding (investigation, legal evaluation, demand letter, etc.) has come to an end

- If the court judgement confirm the liability of the parties involved, then the law firm can refer to this court case and collect as well the lower amounts owed, which are currently around $50,000 in total

Invest $1,500 (court fee) with the chance to receive $105,000 (IneedpaidFF) + $35,000 ($50,000 lower amounts owed – $15,000 = 30% law firm contingency fee) = $140,000.

$1,500 of $140,000 = 1,1%! If the chance to win the court case is 1,1% or higher, it is worth to invest!

- Based on my knowledge and experience, if a law firm take a case on a contingency fee basis, the expected chance to win the case and receive money is at least around 25%.


That is some serious gobbldygook


but at least you can also join their "Lock legislation."

- If you have interest to participate in our Lock Poker litigation 50:50 offer, please send the following info to contact(at)game-protect.com and as reference: Lock Poker litigation.


A common con is that people exploit those who have been conned by asking them to pay them to help them get their money back (sometimes its actually the same con man calling). Obviously that is not the case here, but reading that website should dissuade anyone from sending whoever is behind it good money to chase dead, bad money.

I realize people who were screwed by Lock and Equity and others want payback, and it would be nice if it happened one day, unlikely as that is, but use some common sense before joining someone promising some form of payback, especially if they want payment in advance. Not even sure what to say about someone who says all you need is a 1.1% chance to win to get your money back...

I still remember Pure Poker misleading people into thinking they were getting their Lock money back by joining them (all it was was a standard small instant bankroll promo unrelated to Lock), and people with Pure Poker were genuinely angry at me for pointing out it had nothing to do with Lock Poker. Lots of people in this world try to take advantage of people who are vulnerable, and appealing to victims to get payback represents a really juicy target for them.

With all that said, good luck with a case against Equity.

[QUOTE=twisty8;51529545]IMPORTANT:

I have been in contact with Agirlinoh and have evidence of a $151,000+ bankroll that has been stolen outright. He is joining the litigation effort against Full Flush and it's not too late to join.

The deal is a standard contingency-fee offer from the international debt-collection firm of Van de Laarschot & Associates: they keep 30% of all collections, and players are awarded 70%.

I've been in the online game for probably 10 years and am an attorney myself. This is the ONLY chance we have. There is no doubt in my mind that they are planning to steal all player funds (over $2,000,000).

I'm stuck flush nearly 50k full weight. nick name kangaroo, lmaf please help me to do something.

Planning? They already did. The money is gone, *poof*. It has been a sham for a long time.

I am confused about something though. If you happen to sue for damages and win, how do you plan to go about collecting? If the US government cannot get a shred of access to a bank account that belongs to an American citizen in Malta, Seychelles, Hong Kong, etc... what good is the piece of paper with the lien do?

I you are aware that when scam artists take money, they do not typically put it in their own accounts. I know there are some really stupid ones that do, but these thieves at FF are very experienced. Are you under the impression that the money is in some easy to find account in their name? If so, then your claim will get your paid off. I'm not questioning you as a person, it just seems that people are trying to find a reason to believe they will get reimbursed regardless of how slim the odds are.

What is the false hope behind needing one large claimant? Twenty people with the same claim from different locations hold far more leverage than one person with a large one. If the US government could/would pursue a case against the FF people, then the RICO statute would be of far more interest than a couple of wealthy people losing a couple of bucks. Once you go to the government and show them how much money you made and are owed, how long until the IRS is looking for their take?

I put zero credence into that Game Protect site. I do business in several different countries. As a show of respect to the citizens in those countries, I have the common sense to have someone fluent in the native language translate the website so I come across as credible. Game Protect does not even have the wherewithal to search high and low for one of the few people that speak English to properly translate their website. GameProtect is registered through GoDaddy, uses the anonymous 'Domain by Proxy' access out of Scottsdale, Az. Their FB page doesn't exist anymore and they put out a total of 7 tweets of nonsense. BUT, they do want you to know they are going to help, just send them a donation, blah blah blah.....

The Full Flush money has been flushed. They went to dinner, traveled, bought nice clothes and jewelry, etc... If you cannot spoon feed a case of fraud to the feds, there is nothing going to happen. Law firms know a civil lien is worthless to banks in tax havens/non treaty locales, that is why there is no real case pending.

You want your money back, find the person/people and 'talk' to them face to face. If you owe me 100K and my attorney does not get it taken care of, do not consider the situation resolved.

I'd love to be wrong here and get the $1,100 from my account, but I can't see a single way that happens.

i received a money gram
for 250$ today that was requested 5 months ago

proof please?

Game-Protect - you mean the site that has had people oh-so-subtly shilling over here? First it was the Player Protection account, who was a terrible poster, and liked to post about Game-Protect like it wasn't his site when pretty clearly he owned or worked for the site, or had some kind of relationship. And then there was Albufeira, who was defending the site. I checked his IPs, and found him tied to a group of posters that includes Player Protection. I asked him about it a few hours after his last post (over a month ago):

Not all that surprisingly, he hasn't posted since. He continues to read the forums (last logged on last week), but has gone silent. He did, however, take the time to send this unsolcitied PM to one of our members a couple of weeks ago, out of the blue in response to his post in an entirely different thread about the need for a poker players' group:

Spammers gunna spam. And as a result, banners gunna ban (that's me!).

As for "your lawyer" (if the offer is from "your lawyer", why wouldn't people deal directly with him rather than having to go though an affiliate?), there have been a couple of posts that call into question their claims about this being done on a contingency basis:

But of course you should know this, as those posts came after a post of yours encouraging people to pursue the offer. So my question is, what's your angle here? Are you just hoping people will ignore all the shady stuff and join so you might have a chance of this going forward, or do you also have some interest in this Game-Protect site?

Awesome post - really says it all about this supposed lawsuit. I'll just add/reiterate a couple of things:

To those few who make this sound like some kind of a "no brainer" for a lawyer to take on contingency - read a dewd's post above. For a lawyer to do all of this work for free in the hopes of payment with a settlement, he needs to think there is a very strong possibility of winning AND a strong possibility of getting the money when he wins. I think it's far from clear both of those conditions exist. Personally, I think it's highly unlikely they do.

As for Game-Protect, I don't think it's impossible that there is a legitimate lawyer willing to do this and they just need some court fees paid to get it going. I don't believe it's unheard of for lawyers to recover some expenses like this even on contingency claims. But if they are legit, they're really, really going about this in a dreadful fashion. Having to go through an affiliate, said affiliate being a terrible communicator, said affiliate using shill accounts here to promote the offer, somewhat vague fees coming to light once people sign up - it all makes it seem very shady, whether it is or not.

I'd be very, very careful about dealing with these guys - do your research!

All that said, best of luck to anyone that goes ahead with this. I'd be very happy if this turned out to be legit and was successful in recovering funds.

That pretty much says it all. WHY would a law firm/lawyer have to use third parties to promote a legitimate offer to represent you? I probably get 20 letters a year in the mail from law firms soliciting me to join their class action suit to recover money from some public company that had some sort of snafu occur. The letter gives me a drop dead date to reply to be included in it. It is also something that has been previously filed in the courts as a Notice Of Pendency Of Class Action. Class action suits are also pretty/very rare outside the United States.

Further, The Model Rules of Professional Conduct, (see rule 7) that US attorneys adhere to pretty much prohibits solicitation of clients for class action suits, including trolling the internet for them. There are rules that prevent legal profession workers from disseminating universal statements to the public, like, join us against xxxx.

I have no clue of the laws outside the US for the most part, but that pretty much puts the kibosh on US action assuming a law firm would represent a contingency of citizens that are participating/enabling activity that the federal government as deemed as a no-no.

I'd bet heavily that Game-Protect is little more than a cash grab by low level scam artists. They are probably sitting around in admiration of the level of skill Archer and company have in the scamming department. Really, they advertise on their site 'INeedFF' joining AND link it to a 2+2 post...wtf?!?! That sure seems professional. They even state that IF they can find an attorney to take the case, they expect a 25% chance of winning and collecting lolz. They only posted the 'update' about 'INeedFF' because it has been mentioned in this thread. They are trolling you. Period.

Like the MJ meme goes....'stop, just stop'. Game-Protect, on a best case scenario, is asking you to pay them to find an attorney willing to take the case. They have nada, zippo, stugats. It is far more likely that they are just looking to take your money and have a nice dinner and cocktail on the rooftop at The George Urban Boutique.

If they owed me $50K and I had an attorney that was of the belief that they could recover the money....I'd let them do it first and then tell everyone. Why would I dilute myself down? Attorneys take on class actions because they are very confident they can recover the funds. That confidence comes from knowing where the funds are. The class action gives them more fees for the same work. I want to be 3,000% wrong on this, but I think there is less than a 1 in 3,000 chance that I am.

For what it is worth, I am not sure if asked which side of a wager I would take, with the question being did that INeedFF guy send $1,500 of real money to that other company to chase the $150,000 in fake money he won vs people who were throwing it away at the time. If forced to choose then given his posts, I would probably take the "he did send the $1,500 side" and be slightly disappointed (though not surprised) with humanity after.

If he did then maybe another company can go after this $1,500. In theory the fee should become lower and lower with each iteration...

It's possible, but he may be screwed if they offer to go after the $150,000 + $1,500. In that scenario, the fee then becomes $1,515 and gets higher and higher as he chases more money.

no one is going to catch these guys


really just a big wake up call for everyone involved to choose online poker sites wisely

Funnily enough, even if I could go back I probably still would have chosen FF, the games were that good IMO. Cashouts were super fast for about a year, then gradually started to slow. Luckily I never tried to run up a bankroll, kept it at about 25 buyins for midstakes games.

That is a very smart way of limiting risk.

lol, I find this hard to believe.

i feel you man, for me, i honestly thought it really didn't matter which US poker site you choose, IE Bovada, ACR, etc etc, i just really liked FF's software and ran good. definitely a wake up call for me, but i can't fault you for seeing it that way

As do I. Though it is possible a payment was put in the queue before TSHTF and that it went through post shut-down. The lag time is huge, but it is possible. I wouldn't expect .any/many more of these from people however. Once whatever money/payouts that were on hand with that processor were processed, that was likely all she wrote.

--
Kahn

So which one of you guys is going to pay for their shady Curacao lawyer to vacation in Spain for 2 weeks? https://game-protect.com/full-flush-poker-statement/

"The estimated costs to file a criminal complaint in Madrid are approximately $2,000 and include:

Travel expenses to Madrid
Stay at least 14 days in a cheap hotel
Pay lawyer to prepare the criminal complaint in Spanish language and lodge it at the police."


I'm selling swampland in Florida if anyone is interested. If not, will sell you a bridge at discount.

-Boris

Ps. Someone at least pay for the man to have a decent vacation and not end up staying at a Motel 6.