So I made a deposit and the transaction never hit my bank...Stars credited me instantly but I didn't go robusto and stars has now deducted the deposit amount from my Stars account leaving me with a negative balance.

They're telling me to "make good" by 6/14, but with Echecks cut off I have no way of depositing.

god our country is ****ed up sometimes

I dunno. This could be 2nd level thinking. If Frank has the votes to pass his bill into law, then there's a lot a money to be made by a person looking to set up shop in the American market, assuming they can kill off PS FT and AP, or at least screw up their finances until the bill passes.

And don't be surprised when Frank and a little known NY Federdal attorney retire to seats on the board of that person's company in a few years.

should I request a check or spend $30 on a wire?

Can someone please PM me the name of the processors that the checks are bouncing from? I live in vegas if that helps at all, I dont know if certain processors handle certain parts of country. Much appreciated.

This thread displays a lot of delusional thinking.

First of all, if this was simply a matter of a processing company or a network going down temporarily, Pokerstars and Full Tilt would post the nature of the problem and an expected resolution time. Neither company would willingly allow rumors to fester that might suggest depositors' funds were not secure. Being offshore companies completely unregulated by the U.S., an appearance of stability and security is essential for growth.

That both companies are more or less silent suggests that the problem is much more severe and that neither company knows how to resolve it quickly. The fact that customer checks are bouncing en masse is a critical event that would require immediate resolution and acknowledgment from a sound business.

If the problem is the result of law enforcement action, then the timing is ominous. The first step before a major crackdown would of course be to freeze the funds of any targeted people or entities. This would be followed by arrests or other actions. The fact that we are in the middle of the WSOP would probably not be a coincidence. District attorneys are not immune to the lure of publicity and dramatic timing of events.

Whoever we want to blame for the problem, the U.S. government is in terrible financial shape. (Personally I blame Bush and believe that it's delusional to blame Obama for the mess he left behind.) The thought that there are millions or billions of dollars being sucked out of the economy to untaxed offshore gambling operations is not something that this government will tolerate for long.

There is a precedent that the major online poker sites should be aware of and one that should keep them awake at night. If the U.S decides to go after FullTilt and Pokerstars on these shores, online poker will go the way of Napster. A combination of civil actions against payment processors, followed by limited, deterrence-oriented prosecutions against some individuals will shut down online poker in America.

This for the most part is false drivel, imo.


We've seen much longer delays then this, even then people posted stuff similair to your post, and guess what, im still scooping pots off rig tards and the like. And in 2011 i will likely be doing much of the same, except the processor name will change 92 more times. God, im such a money laundering criminal. /sarcasm

Phils

Just for the record, I'm certainly not calling you or anyone else a money laundering criminal! But I heard similar things when Napster was in the crosshairs. For example, that Napster had changed the rules, that there was no going back, that artists would have to seek out new revenue models because copyright law was fast becoming obsolete.

A few short years later, Napster was gone, hundreds of low-level individual downloaders had been sued and people now willingly pay for downloads on Itunes to the tune of millions of dollars per year. The game changed, no doubt, but the days of easy, no-risk free music downloads are over. The success of Itunes is proof of that.

In the case of music downloads, enforcement was almost entirely civil. If the government decides to go after online poker, it will be a combination of civil and criminal action. The government had no vested financial interest in whether or not Britney Spears got her royalty for "Baby Hit Me One More Time." The government does have a vested interest in lost tax revenue from online gambling. It's a question of prioritizing resources.

napster the brand is gone. just like for example stars the brand could eventually be gone.

The illegal downloading industry is still strong despite efforts to shut it down, and i feel the poker industry has the same kind of ability to continue serving players one way or another.

imo.

edit: lol at people actually DL'ing off of i tunes. The same place that i cant even download a beatles track. Im 1 year away from graduating college and dont know anyone who actually pays for music. Lets get back on topic though.

But it doesn't. The online poker industry as it operates in the United States is far more vulnerable. When you download something for free, no money changes hands. Poker sites rely on bank transfers through processing companies to operate. Players have to feel secure that if they put up $100 they have a chance of getting back, or of growing that initial deposit. And of course they have to be able to make a deposit in the first place. That requires cooperation from your bank, from you, from a processing company and from the site itself.


Never said downloading stopped or that the traditional revenue models for music didn't take an enormous hit. But where a young person in college may be willing to assume to the small risk of a civil suit for downloading a Beatles track (I share your disdain for Itunes on that point), a lot of people would think twice. Without the crackdown on Napster, Itunes would never have survived the first few years.

I'm not saying that the two situations are identical, only that the music downloading example provides a model for how an anti-poker campaign might work.

I get the jist of your argument, i just respectfully disagree.

Also you're the one that correlated napster with online poker.

Again, IMO, you should feel perfectly safe with every penny you have online. Even in the most extreme scenario (i,e. nt, epass, etc) people recieved their payments in full.

Look back to just 2 weeks ago. We had a stretch (leading up to UIGEA in dec) of like 8 months where people were getting paper checks in like 2-4 days. People were getting their e checks overnight at times. I requested a cashout once on monday morning and had it tuesday morning. 3 days was the longest i waited to recieve my funds.

When these situations occur it's simply a waiting game. Contrary to what many believe stars is waiting for information, just like the posters/players. The money isnt in their hands, the money has been sent to a processor, who'se now in control of the situation until they relay information on monday.

I'm not really trying to argue, just pointing out that you shouldn't have any anxiety about playing online. As a player there is no law on the books that you're breaking, therefore a civil suit (as in your example) would not be possible.

A Full Tilt rep already came on, said it was a processing problem, sent the money back to players accounts, and is cutting checks from other processors. So that's the nature of the problem and a resolution time

So I guess, by your own logic, this is simply a matter of a processing company or network going down temporarily.

Good to know we dont have to worry, thanks for your contribution.

question for you lg, has stars made a similair statement?

Just that there will be an update Monday, but Id expect a similar resolution based on precedent

If this is some kind of crackdown, then they will probably find a way around it as they have in the past. If not, then there will be some legal online poker or we will have to play live or something.

The timing of this is right when people have who won WSOP seats are withdrawing the money to buy their seats, as well as people taking out money to play side events and such.

I'm sad, I hve an $800 check coming this week that I am pretty sure will be worth absolutely nada

I believed yesterday that it was a federal action because earlier in this thread someone learrned from a bank that the funds were frozen as a result of a "lien from a pending legal action". Only the feds can freeze your funds before they've won their day in court.

..................just pointing out that you shouldn't have any anxiety about playing online.

...................When these situations occur it's simply a waiting game.

You anxiety free Nevowski? You don't mind waiting for your $800 bucks do you?

denial is not a river in Egypt.

I had concluded from all this bs that Click2pay was easy way out of this mess for now. No way to trace source of the funds other than to Click2pay, no chance of a bounced check, no chip window shutdowns - and both PS and FT offered it as an option.
I recently bought $50 in chips on FT and ran it up to $300 pretty quick. I opened a Click2pay account about a week and a half ago with no sweat. Click2pay called me to verify my phone number, etc., and they said before I could cash any money out I needed to send them a scan of a utility bill and or a bank statement to verify my address. I'm traveling and couldn't do it.

Returning home tomorow and planned to email the stuff to them Monday. Then I saw this post over in the FT checks thread posted YESTERDAY:

Tried opening a Click2Pay account and the website told me it was not possible because my IP address originates in the US.

These guys know more about what's going on this weekend than meets the eye! Whatever it is, I suspect we will learn about it next week - maybe as early as Monday, but probably on Tuesday if the sh***t hits the fan Monday!

Click2Pay has not been available in US for a long time. I don't know if it ever was.
Next.

it was in like 2007, if you had an account b4 they shutdown to US you were grandfathered in

nothing new here

I won't dispute your remarks, I had no prior experience with Click2pay. However they called me at my us area code and phone number and told me all I had to do to complete opening the account and cashing out on FullTilt was send them a copy of a utility bill and/or a bank statement. Why the f***k would they tell me that knowing where I lived and talking to me on the phone about cashing out a check from FullTilt?

Maybe they are just a bunch of 'tards. I don't know. Just passing on my experience with them past few weeks.

Barring a true meltdown, it appears I will have to take one person's advice. Open multiple bank accounts for minimum balance. Use one of them for all gaming deposits. Move money from it to clean bank. Buy chips with WU, Gift cards, International Money Orders, or whatever tool there is outside of my bank accounts.

Better yet, I have chips on PS and FT. Don't ever have to buy chips! Out.

no. This is like, massively wrong. You can get your assets frozen in a divorce proceeding ffs.

Gee! Been divorced three times, one very contentious, and never been warned once by a lawyer that could happen. I'll keep that in mind next time I get a divorce.

Gee, I used this think called "google" and found about a zillion articles on assets being frozen in a divorce proceeding.

Might be time for a new lawyer, IMO.