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01-16-2017 , 08:19 PM

AnotherBadBeat

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 10

Can someone explain to me how it is that there are so many players sat at every table - some at several tables, yet they NEVER play each other despite being the same limit tables? This occurs all the time on Bet Victor.

I observed 12 tables where there were four individuals spread across all of them.

It struck me as odd that a player was sat at EVERY table, despite there being two or three people sat, on their own, at other tables of the same buy-in. Why doesn't KOTT play LivelyRacer? Why doesn't Summeraxe play KOTT?

Are they shills/bots etc.? Very suspicious methinks.

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01-16-2017 , 08:33 PM

KSCC

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 125

Bumhunters

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01-16-2017 , 10:32 PM

lvanhoe

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,383

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherBadBeat

Well probably (no not probably but for sure) the four players in question are all very good regulars that know the other three players to be very good regulars, and instead of being eaten alive by the rake, they are waiting for a not so good regular or even a recreational player to join their table(s) so they can actually play cards for a profit.

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01-17-2017 , 03:26 AM

Esa_Perse

banned

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 1,850

Yeah no reason to flip blinds and pay rake esp you have other tables running. And why at betvictor? There are no waiting lists so the only way to get a table (without using a script) is to open one and wait.

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01-17-2017 , 09:36 AM

AnotherBadBeat

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 10

If they're all good regulars, that makes it even more suspicious why they'd not play each other I'd say.

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01-17-2017 , 10:13 AM

sfetaz

adept

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 863

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherBadBeat

If they're all good regulars, that makes it even more suspicious why they'd not play each other I'd say.

Why would you intentionally play against opponents HU online that you know you can't profit off of? So you can both lose money to the site?

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01-17-2017 , 06:14 PM

martinwilson

enthusiast

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 98

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfetaz

Why would you intentionally play against opponents HU online that you know you can't profit off of? So you can both lose money to the site?

It's pretty confusing to me, seems like if you sit out quickly this is against the rules on some sites. What's allowed and what is not? I like the idea of being able to play against who you want, when you want, but if that means consistently quitting after the fish leaves or sits out it does create a bad atmosphere for the recs.

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01-17-2017 , 06:35 PM

Carl Trooper

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,681

B/c more poker players are scared individuals and afraid of real challenges, thus sit out afraid to bet one another - like the people who all sit @ the cash tables and check it down.

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01-18-2017 , 12:41 AM

sfetaz

adept

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 863

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Trooper

B/c more poker players are scared individuals and afraid of real challenges, thus sit out afraid to bet one another - like the people who all sit @ the cash tables and check it down.

I hope that is sarcasm which never translates on the internet

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01-18-2017 , 02:59 AM

#10

Lego05

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 24,982

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherBadBeat

They are people who don't want to play each other because they want to win money and none of them think they are better than the others to a high enough degree that they would be able to win money by playing the others. So they are all waiting for a worse player to sit down.

I have no idea who any of those guys are and I have never even registered at Bet Victor, but the above is obviously what they are doing.

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01-18-2017 , 04:55 AM

#11

Esa_Perse

banned

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 1,850

Quote:

Originally Posted by martinwilson

I like the idea of being able to play against who you want,

This can't never work. It takes two players to play you can't force the other one to play just because it's fair and fun. And you must be new to internet poker if this is news to you. Bumhunting has been there pretty much allways.

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01-18-2017 , 05:29 AM

#12

Roger Mainfield

Big Raaaaaaj

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 5,200

The rake is very high, once you become informed about it you realize just how much better you need to be than your opponent for either of you to make any money in the long run. So those players are sitting there hoping someone who is vastly worse than them will sit down and play with them.

It's a large part of the reason for Online poker's continual decline, there isn't any other game in the world that is so punishing to new players, or where the entity that runs the game takes revenue from it that affects the outcome of the game.

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01-18-2017 , 09:18 AM

#13

OutTaGetMe

banned

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 170

Just makes no sense, so what happens if another seat clogger sits, they just stare at each other

they really need to kick sitters after 2 orbits and not let them sit back at the table for an hour. and if they try **** like play a hand sit out, let it happen 3x in 2 orbits and kick em.

I see this same **** happening on merge, so basically a player trying to learn to play cash will never get to play people on his level since all these seat cloggers are just sitting and waiting. TOTALLY ****ED UP. No wonder everone says play cash live and mtts online.

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01-18-2017 , 11:23 AM

#14

goodsaint

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 2,377

Quote:

Originally Posted by OutTaGetMe

Just makes no sense, so what happens if another seat clogger sits, they just stare at each other

I see this same **** happening on merge, so basically a player trying to learn to play cash will never get to play people on his level since all these seat cloggers are just sitting and waiting. TOTALLY ****ED UP. No wonder everone says play cash live and mtts online.

Guess that's why since American sign-ups are now allowed again on Merge, some folks are being capped at 4 tables. Gives the recs a chance.

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01-18-2017 , 11:33 AM

#15

AnotherBadBeat

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 10

>It's pretty confusing to me, seems like if you sit out quickly this is against the rules on some sites.

I saw one guy on PokerStars that continually did this on the 1/2 tables. He'd sit at several tables and whenever I sat, he'd sit out or leave. It happened so often, I reported him and eventually he stopped. If you don't want to play, don't sit!

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01-18-2017 , 11:54 AM

#16

.isolated

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 21,495

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherBadBeat

>It's pretty confusing to me, seems like if you sit out quickly this is against the rules on some sites.

It's not against the rules and it's not against the rules at Stars. Table blocking is against the rules. Table blocking is sitting in and out but never playing to try to force the other player to leave.

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If you don't want to play, don't sit!

They do want to play. You just have to accept what others have already mentioned: They want to face players who are vastly worse than them because rake eats all of the money when two players of a similar skill level play each other.

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01-18-2017 , 12:20 PM

#17

OutTaGetMe

banned

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 170

Sites should just remove the sit out button, you sit you play

**** the way it is now, you cant even catch a reg on tilt cause they arent even playing just cloggin seats

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01-18-2017 , 01:48 PM

#18

Esa_Perse

banned

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 1,850

Quote:

Originally Posted by OutTaGetMe

Sites should just remove the sit out button, you sit you play

And you have peebottle, poopbucket and a fridge next to your station?

You should definetely try 888 games. I think you might like them more.

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01-18-2017 , 02:39 PM

#19

OutTaGetMe

banned

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 170

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esa_Perse

And you have peebottle, poopbucket and a fridge next to your station?

You should definetely try 888 games. I think you might like them more.

so leaving the table when you gotta hit the john or the fridge or the bowl and rejoining it when youre ready to play, isnt an option either.

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01-18-2017 , 02:49 PM

#20

otatop

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 12,721

Quote:

Originally Posted by OutTaGetMe

so leaving the table when you gotta hit the john or the fridge or the bowl and rejoining it when youre ready to play, isnt an option either.

Yeah, if you need to take a short break while playing on a table with a 10+ player waitlist, you should be forced to give up your seat and join that list.

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01-18-2017 , 03:00 PM

#21

OutTaGetMe

banned

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 170

Quote:

Originally Posted by otatop

Yeah, if you need to take a short break while playing on a table with a 10+ player waitlist, you should be forced to give up your seat and join that list.

you shouldnt be able to hold that seat hostage for 30 minutes either to take a piss, but I thought the original premise here was everyone sitting out at the table not piss breaks

who cares what anyone does at the table as long as they are paying blinds, no sitting out but go take a 30 minute piss break and come back and youre still at the table.

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01-19-2017 , 03:12 AM

#22

lvanhoe

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,383

Quote:

Originally Posted by OutTaGetMe

you shouldnt be able to hold that seat hostage for 30 minutes either to take a piss, but I thought the original premise here was everyone sitting out at the table not piss breaks

who cares what anyone does at the table as long as they are paying blinds, no sitting out but go take a 30 minute piss break and come back and youre still at the table.

Do you run an online pokersite? As people of equal skill level 'paying blinds' just means more rake, and rake is high enough as it is without playing vs other solid regs. The sort of mystique idea that people should 'just play' makes no sense at all if they don't percieve they have an edge.

Two guys tried this like a year back, can't find the topic. They played 3/6 plo or nlhe headsup, and after x thousand hands they were both (!!!!) down a few k.

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01-19-2017 , 10:30 AM

#23

AnotherBadBeat

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 10

>It's not against the rules and it's not against the rules at Stars.

Er, yes it is. Stars themselves confirmed it was.

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01-19-2017 , 10:34 AM

#24

AnotherBadBeat

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 10

Play NL/PL is very different to Limit - Yes, you could play someone for a gazillion hours and both of you come out with the same level of stack minus rake. That's much more likely in Limit than in NL/PL.

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01-19-2017 , 10:58 AM

#25

dreddie

journeyman

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 232

Quote:

Originally Posted by lvanhoe

Two guys tried this like a year back, can't find the topic. They played 3/6 plo or nlhe headsup, and after x thousand hands they were both (!!!!) down a few k.

It baffles me how many players dont understand the story and math of rake.

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