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Old 08-19-2011, 11:13 AM   #26
tklemans
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

***Update***

I just spoke with 'Clark' at BetOnline. He explained the situation, and noted that the same IP address was being used by 3 different accounts (me - in Baltimore, 1 in Philadelphia, and 1 in San Diego). He agreed that the separation in physical locations makes it hard to understand why the sharing is happening. He also explained that the IP address issue appears to be happening when logging into the sportsbook. Clark stated that it would be impossible for 2 players to sit at a poker table using the same IP address. The software would block it.

When I play from work, I have to log into my work VPN. Clark believes that it is possible that the two other accounts in question all work for the same company that I do. The company is a large, international, professional services firm. So, because all three accounts are logged into the same VPN, it may be causing the problem.

Clark is going to investigate further, and discuss the situation with the other two accounts. In the meantime, I'm sending him a copy of my work ID badge, proving that I work for the company I say I work for.

More to come..........
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Old 08-19-2011, 12:49 PM   #27
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by tklemans View Post
***Update***

I just spoke with 'Clark' at BetOnline. He explained the situation, and noted that the same IP address was being used by 3 different accounts (me - in Baltimore, 1 in Philadelphia, and 1 in San Diego). He agreed that the separation in physical locations makes it hard to understand why the sharing is happening. He also explained that the IP address issue appears to be happening when logging into the sportsbook. Clark stated that it would be impossible for 2 players to sit at a poker table using the same IP address. The software would block it.

When I play from work, I have to log into my work VPN. Clark believes that it is possible that the two other accounts in question all work for the same company that I do. The company is a large, international, professional services firm. So, because all three accounts are logged into the same VPN, it may be causing the problem.

Clark is going to investigate further, and discuss the situation with the other two accounts. In the meantime, I'm sending him a copy of my work ID badge, proving that I work for the company I say I work for.

More to come..........
Well, it looks like they are working on sorting this out which is good news. Hopefully once you provide them with the necessary information they will realize that it was a simple misunderstanding.

IMO, you should get your funds back. If their software blocks you from sitting at the same tables as someone else from the same IP that should essentially rule out collusion in your case and therefore you should receive your fund, but they may not see it that way.

Keep us all updated please!
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Old 08-19-2011, 06:11 PM   #28
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

A definite difference emergence now between this and the cake situation, cake were always uncooperative, clearly they knew they were in the wrong. This looks promising for you. Still, I'd never play on the action network.
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Old 08-19-2011, 07:39 PM   #29
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

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Originally Posted by Alrighty Roo View Post
A definite difference emergence now between this and the cake situation, cake were always uncooperative, clearly they knew they were in the wrong. This looks promising for you. Still, I'd never play on the action network.
I definitely have concerns about Action Poker. It's a shame too because BetOnline has a good SBR rating and could have done much better picking a new Poker Network. In fact, they would have been better off starting their own from scratch as they have claimed they did here. BetOnline supposedly processes their own Cashouts, which is one reason I'm so interested in this post. They have a good history of Cashouts from their Sportsbook.

Since they've already lied about the Network though, who knows if they have full control over their Cashier. Another issue could arise if an Action Poker player were to lose a large sum to a BetOnline player. What if Action Poker refused to pay BetOnline since Action Poker has a history of not paying Affiliates or Players it's not too far fetched either.
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Old 08-19-2011, 08:52 PM   #30
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

They are stand alone poker room according to gambling 911 and not affiliated with any network here is the link I found.

http://www.gambling911.com/poker/bet...rs-061911.html
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Old 08-19-2011, 10:19 PM   #31
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

can anyone explain to me why i would have to meet "rollover" requirements when i made a WU deposit and requested to not have any freeplay dollars credited to my account? they were quick to deny my first attempt at a cashout after i deposited a total of 700 in 2 days. the first deposit of 300 i used to play poker only, and lost the whole deposit. the next day deposited 400, made 3 bets, 2 of which i won, and played a ton of poker. i tried to make a withdrawal, and the next morning i was emailed that i have not met their requirements for a withdrawal. this is ridiculous, especially considering i sent them cash via WU. my money should be readily available while depositing using this method.
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Old 08-19-2011, 11:17 PM   #32
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by tklemans View Post
***Update***
When I play from work, I have to log into my work VPN. Clark believes that it is possible that the two other accounts in question all work for the same company that I do. The company is a large, international, professional services firm. So, because all three accounts are logged into the same VPN, it may be causing the problem.

More to come..........
"The company is a large, international, professional services firm."

You wouldn't mind telling us what firm this is, would you?
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Old 08-19-2011, 11:21 PM   #33
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeckoRiver View Post
They are stand alone poker room according to gambling 911 and not affiliated with any network here is the link I found.

http://www.gambling911.com/poker/bet...rs-061911.html
Gambling 911 is wrong
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Old 08-20-2011, 09:17 AM   #34
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

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Originally Posted by ZeckoRiver View Post
They are stand alone poker room according to gambling 911 and not affiliated with any network here is the link I found.

http://www.gambling911.com/poker/bet...rs-061911.html
Well a simple denial is not worth anything here. Let them explain how their poker room shares the APN tables and players. I look forward to an "official explanation."

And if they are able to join any poker network without any actual association...hook up to either 888 or Entraction, and I promise a deposit the next day.
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Old 08-20-2011, 10:25 AM   #35
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

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Originally Posted by ZeckoRiver View Post
They are stand alone poker room according to gambling 911 and not affiliated with any network here is the link I found.

http://www.gambling911.com/poker/bet...rs-061911.html
They have claimed they are not part of an existing Poker Network on various Forums and in various Interviews. They claim they started a new Network called "Hero Poker Network". However this is false. They are misleading players.

Atleast 2 people on 2p2 besides me have confirmed this including Grindunumb who is a reputable poster, IMO. We have both independent of each other downloaded the software of both Action Poker and BetOnline. The players, tables, chip stacks, cards, etc... are all the same and therefore they have to be on the same Network sharing the same players pool. That is undeniable proof that anyone can confirm, IMO. There is also circumstantial evidence such as the sudden increase in traffic on the Action Poker Network over the last month or two.

I'm not sure why they have mislead players, but it's obviously a concern. It's also a concern that the Network they are on has a long history of not paying players or affiliates over the last year.

I will add that BetOnline does have a B+ rating on SBR and is a reputable Sportsbook. Hopefully this will play out and we will get more information on this over the next few weeks.
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Old 08-20-2011, 03:27 PM   #36
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Taking a further look this appears to be the case. I didn't mean to discredit your claims but there is a lot of conflicting info out there about this one. I am trying to make sense of it and can't.

Why would they deceive players what network they are with? I thought they might want to distance themselves from the slow payouts at Action, but it makes no sense. I doubt they use their own cashier. Can't Action face a lot of legal trouble with this skin taking US signups? The network which BetOnline has claimed to be on does exist (http://heropokernetwork.com) but as you can see the BetOnline brand is listed nowhere on that page.

This is the first time I can remember a site sneaking its way onto a whole different network. There is some shadyness behind it all and I would suggest for players to stay far away from anything linked to APN.

Another forum working with these guys swear by them being on their own, but it's not hard to see what is going on here.

Last edited by fisk; 08-20-2011 at 03:55 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 08-21-2011, 09:29 PM   #37
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

I downloaded betonline.com since its another option for US players. I played a couple of freerolls. Software is really awful, light traffic but there are a few nl tables high as 3 6 nl. Only a couple of omaha tables where running.

Any one besides op have any comments on this site as to whether worth playing on? Didn't read the last 2 posts , I think I will take the advice to stay away. I spoke to them on phone and live chat assured me that they where their own network and that most of their players came from their sportsbook. It would be nice if rep from the site answered definitively whether they are part of action or indeed a stand alone poker site which does seem puzzling.
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Old 08-21-2011, 09:31 PM   #38
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

with football season coming up...sports books are supposed to be overflowing with new deposits. If at any time you will get your money, it will be now
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Old 08-21-2011, 09:51 PM   #39
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Welcome to the HeroPokerNetwork

The HeroPokerNetwork.com is the holding company behind a significant presence in the online gaming community, and is incredibly dedicated to one thing and one thing only: delivering the most exciting and dynamic experiences possible in online gaming.

HeroPokerNetwork.com is committed to providing the most secure online gaming experience with the most sophisticated and state-of-the-art client software.

The HeroPokerNetwork is situated in the most secure financial areas in the world, Panama, which has a reliable and secure business environment, providing a solid infrastructure, cutting-edge Internet bandwidth and a government that strictly regulates and monitors offshore gaming activity.

The brands include PokerColony.com and BigPondPoker.com and offers the most popular gaming products: poker, sportsbook, live virtual casino and horse-racing, amongst others.

Whether your passion is sports, entertainment, poker, horse-racing or casino action, look no further than the HeroPokerNetwork’s group of sterling online gaming offerings - with the world's finest customer service, lightning-fast payouts and a constant stream of promotions – we guarantee you the most exciting and secure betting experience online.
.
I checked out PokerColony.com and BigPondPoker.com it looks like PokerColony.com is out of commision but ,BigPondPoker.com and Betonline.com are running, they may well have just called themselves HeroPokerNetwork, HPN but i believe that they are actually APN Action Poker Network

There is some shadyness behind it all and I would suggest for players to stay far away from anything linked to APN.
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Old 08-21-2011, 10:11 PM   #40
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

BTW, anyone find it weird to deny payments due to sharing IP's??? Most of us are too poor to be able to afford a static IP connection and are on DHCP connections that constantly change IP addresses. I know my cable provider will change my IP if my cable modem is off a few hours.
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Old 08-21-2011, 11:01 PM   #41
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

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BTW, anyone find it weird to deny payments due to sharing IP's??? Most of us are too poor to be able to afford a static IP connection and are on DHCP connections that constantly change IP addresses. I know my cable provider will change my IP if my cable modem is off a few hours.
Well, if they end up denying payment for only sharing an IP with another player, then yes, I would have a problem with it. However, if they are simply doing due diligence and making sure the OP didn't collude with the player sharing the IP then I think it is reasonable and could be a good thing.

In other words, no they shouldn't hold a payment simply for sharing an IP, however, if they have suspicions regarding one of the players that shared that IP then it they should freeze the account pending an investigation. Unless they can prove collusion then payment should be made, IMO. Other sites do this also when a players shares an IP with a player that has been flagged for fraud or collusion so BetOnline may be following industry standards.

All that being said, I'm still very very concerned that they have stated they are on an independent Network when I have indisputable evidence to the contrary. I guess it's possible they have a legitimate reason, but honestly I can't think of a single reason a site would lie about the Network they are on and it raises red flags, IMO.
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Old 08-22-2011, 12:25 AM   #42
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

some of the people from the BetOnSports fiasco are behind the scenes for BOL. Doesn't mean they are scam artists but if you lost money at BoS thought it was worth mentioning.

They do claim to be an independent network, and were on SBR promoting their new poker network. I have no idea if that's true or not but I'm 100% certain it's what the poker room manager was claiming when the room went live.
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Old 08-22-2011, 01:31 AM   #43
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

I'm in the U.S. and cannot set up a real money account at Action but a few weeks ago I set up play money accounts at both BetOnline and Action. I then sat down at the same play money table on both sites and played myself heads up. They are for sure the same network, regardless of what they call it.

Youwager uses the same software as Action Poker and has for years. They do not share the same player base though. This is the first time I have seen an Action Poker skin accept U.S. players.

This has to be a good thing for Action. More rake and likely softer players dumping into the site to help with liquidity. Maybe someone outside the U.S. could try to sit at a real money table on both sites to see if there is a security issue here allowing players to take two seats at a real money table.
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Old 08-22-2011, 10:00 AM   #44
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

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Originally Posted by Pokeraddict View Post
I'm in the U.S. and cannot set up a real money account at Action but a few weeks ago I set up play money accounts at both BetOnline and Action. I then sat down at the same play money table on both sites and played myself heads up. They are for sure the same network, regardless of what they call it.

Youwager uses the same software as Action Poker and has for years. They do not share the same player base though. This is the first time I have seen an Action Poker skin accept U.S. players.

This has to be a good thing for Action. More rake and likely softer players dumping into the site to help with liquidity. Maybe someone outside the U.S. could try to sit at a real money table on both sites to see if there is a security issue here allowing players to take two seats at a real money table.

+1 and I done the same thing and this is how I was able to determine that they were on the same Network despite their claims. I also asked another 2p2 member to try the same to confirm and he was also able to do the same thing. As a poster above said they have been on numerous forums and in various interviews claiming they are an independant Network. Below is an interview with the Affiliate Manager where he states they are on an independent Network and then proceeds to talk about why that is such a huge plus for BetOnline compared to their competitors

http://gaffg.com/blog/betonline-affi...ng-us-players/

TBH, it seems like a security issue already possibly because most Networks will not even allow you to have 2 clients open at the same time. Though, I guess if it blocked you from the same tables AND the same tournaments it wouldn't really be a risk unless I'm missing something.

I'd still like to get to the bottom of why they are claiming to be on an independent Network when there is overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

OP-Any updates on this issue?
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Old 08-22-2011, 11:02 AM   #45
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

***Update***

Spoke with Clark again this morning, and he indicated that "upper management" has a Monday morning meeting. He needs to get his supervisor to approve the reinstatement and cashout, which he believes wouldn't be a problem.

Clark indicated that he contacted one of the other players that apparently had the same IP address, and that player was able to fax in a copy of his ID and work badge. Clark believes that due to this verification process being complete, my account would be reactivated by the end of the day.

So, I'll re-post tomorrow with an update.
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Old 08-22-2011, 11:10 AM   #46
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by tklemans View Post
***Update***

Spoke with Clark again this morning, and he indicated that "upper management" has a Monday morning meeting. He needs to get his supervisor to approve the reinstatement and cashout, which he believes wouldn't be a problem.

Clark indicated that he contacted one of the other players that apparently had the same IP address, and that player was able to fax in a copy of his ID and work badge. Clark believes that due to this verification process being complete, my account would be reactivated by the end of the day.

So, I'll re-post tomorrow with an update.
Sounds very good. If they reinstate your account and make the Cashout they probably handled it appropriately. I'm not sure why they auto freeze accounts for using same IP unless other player had some kind of fraud or his account was flagged for some reason. I'd like to hear their explanation on that, but if they end up getting it fixed, then that is definitely a good sign.

Thanks for the update OP.
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Old 08-22-2011, 02:20 PM   #47
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

I hope you get your money , but that still does not answer the big qwestion here, why is Betonline.com claiming that they are an independent network ? when they are clearly not, they are in fact a part of the Action poker network.
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Old 08-22-2011, 05:48 PM   #48
tklemans
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

***Update***

Spoke with my pal, Clark, at 5:30 pm EST. He stated that he was unable to get a hold of his "supervisor" as she was in meetings all day. However, he plans to discuss this with her before noon on Tuesday.

Hopefully my cashout will be honored then?

Sigh. Sounds to me like they are looking to slow-pay me........
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Old 08-22-2011, 06:28 PM   #49
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Hmm bad news I guess if its action. Read pokerscout reviews many players complaining of no payouts or delays on payouts with regard to action. Is paynorake part of action? Thought they didn't acceppt us and I have read a few threads about paynorake no pay its players.

Last edited by ZeckoRiver; 08-22-2011 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 08-22-2011, 07:13 PM   #50
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Re: Major Issue with BetOnline.com

Thanks for the update OP. I really hope you do get your money it does sound like there is some progress here, lets hope for the best.
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