The evidence came a million times but people like you cant see it cause they are not interested in evidence. You are just predicting that you are interested. Even someone would show in fron of your face you would see nothing. Denying the truth is your business. Even mathematical truths doesnt interest you. Pokerstars has to take responsibility for his actions sooner or later in front of the law you cant steal peoples money and thinking you can get away with it forever. That it worked in past doesnt mean that it will work in future.

Can I take that to the bank?

We are very interested in credible evidence.

The problem is that the riggies do not understand what 'credible' evidence is.

Posting a few hands where the favourite does not win simply won't cut it. You need to find someone who has been affected by the alleged rigging and has some tens of thousands of hands available. Then analyse those hands and demonstrate that there are anomalies that are greater than could be reasonably expected for the sample size.

This should be so easy for you given the widespread nature of the alleged rigging.



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You can, but you might find it more beneficial to take it to the fish and chip shop.

BTW, did you notice that yesterday I was using 'malfeasance' as a motif in some of my postings. It had a nice 'olde worlde' feel to it, I thought.



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I'd like to believe its all short term variance, but does anyone that plays on bovada (previously bodog) tend to run into a large amount of coolers? After playing pokerstars and live poker I feel like this happens more often than it should. I just want to see everybody's thoughts on this, am i tilting or does it really happen as often as I think it does?
I know the trolls are coming so im prepared for the answers lol

you have to change your playing style and start playing bad hands

this advice will make you a big winner

i thought i needed to add 73os into my range of hands to play UTG

They always give player1 a crap hand on Bovada. But player2 is a donkey.

Well as the word THE is the most common used word in the English language it's not surprising that it will be used quite often

Very enlightening.

This is typical of all online poker.

It's as trustworthy as a $9 note.

Do these coolers tend to coincide with very large pots?



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I notice that the question of evidence is coming up a lot at the moment with the shills insisting it needs to be provided and the riggies trying their best to pretend that its lack does not turn their arguments into non-starters. My question is, do any riggies seriously believe that anyone other than themselves would even begin to accept their arguments without evidence, especially since the raw data to provide the evidence is abundant?

evidence shmevidence, variance shmariance, data shmata. They don't need any of these things, Have you not read any of this thread? these guys have "FEELINGS" and they see the "PATTERNS" So obviously olp is RIGGED!!!!

Let's pretend that pokerstars and full tilt are on trial for rigging (I know, you just jizzed yourself didn't you?). The prosecutor, for some bizarre reason, comes to you) and asks for the BEST evidence available in this thread that the sites are rigged, to help him win the case. What do you show him?

This.

You can't examine a riggies mind as if it's the mind of a normal, rational, person.

Their position is based on faith and is as hard to shift as that of the religious zealot or even the normally committed Christian/Jew/Hindu.

Presumably, what happens in their brains when presented with a logical rebuttal of rigged claims is, if you could observe it with an MRI scanner, similar to what would happen in the brain of a deeply religious person when presented with a rational argument demonstrating that one of their core beliefs was an absurdity. Presumably they shunt the rational argument to one side or temporarily, partially, shut down the rational part of their minds whilst at the same time boosting that part that handles beliefs based on faith.

This argument can never end because the 'shills' continue to present a very simple argument based on sound logic to which the riggies deafen themselves. They have no case which is why the repeatedly post irrelevancies of the "you spend all day here" and "you don't even play poker" type.

Excellent response!

Oh this should be funny lol wp sir wp

Isn't it paradoxical that you know what billionaire entrepreneurs are thinking, yet you're stuck struggling to make a few ks for yourself.

Not that surprising when you consider other people know what god is thinking. True story.

He's wondering if he should move up to where they would respect his raises. Lazurus says yes.

My but everyone is on form, today.

The big problem with playing God is that he's omnicognisant which means that bluffing is always -EV.

And other things.

1. Agreed. I have always said to talk to players you trust who know what they are doing and how the game plays. Same applies to stats. I am all for using modern technology to analyse information, as long as you trust the person who is analysing it.

2. Disagree although I do partly agree. I am a numbers person and always have been. I used to study statistics at school (long time ago), and have a numbers type of brain, so I am a big fan of stats, but I am well aware how you can use statistics to lie and mislead. Yes you can do a "LOT" but the more information you have the more reliable the results. I love stats which is why I want to see all of them out there.

My main concern is those who support online seem to be towing the poker site line. I would have thought those who are genuine players and want to see online thrive would be pulling for the sites to come up with the information so there would be far less doubt and more confidence in online poker. For that reason I would have thought online sites would be willingly supplying the necessary information. That they don't, and neither do those on here who take the online side, looks a little strange. Like one unified voice.
For this to be transparent, you need all the information, so that genuine analysts can do their stuff. The information needs to be out there for all.

Hopefully we can start anew with government approved and regulated online poker sites, with constantly monitored rng's. There will always be people shouting "rigged" but it will be a lot better situation than we have had in the past.

I am not a regular 2+2 er, but I ask for those who think it is rigged to come up with some evidence. I was tempted to put the word "evidence" in capitals but it's not usually my style. I don't think you need to shout to get your point across. Evidence is very important if you wish to convince others. If you don't wish to convince others, then just play online and see what you think. Take your own stats in your own way if you have any questions about realistic odds, then choose to play or not to play. If you want to prove it to others though, shouting "definite rig" on here is not enough for a lot of people, unless you have some evidence to back it up. Opinions are good, but evidence is better.

How can there be so many riggies who claim to be fans of stats (did you /like stats on Facebook?) or claim to have math(s) degrees yet have no idea how to use a simple database program.

At least guys like ray openly admit to their fear of statistics which I can appreciate more than the riggies who seem to believe they are actually stats guys while having no understanding of the topic.

I do understand that computers do not exist in the year this poster continues to live in, so that might be a factor.



The sites provide all the hand histories you ever played on request (and those that do not you should avoid like Pitbull Poker back in the day). If you want more HHs then go to tableratings and buy a couple million.

I encourage you or anyone else to use all the data you like and prove to me that the games are rigged. In fact I have offered a $1,000 reward to the first one who can do this.

I realize you never speak in specifics (few riggies do) , so you will say things like the sites do not reveal "all the information" without actually stating what information you need to see, and how you would analyze it if you could see it. Thus, no point in even asking what specific information your require since you would never answer that with a specific answer.

Instead I will offer you a reward if you can prove the games are rigged.



Government regulation will have nothing to do with rigged RnGs since rigged RnGs are not a practical form of crime. They will regulate how money will be handled.

You probably have not noticed that many countries have implemented regulation already and that is a trend that will continue to eventually include the US.

Government regulation is needed for the industry, though it will do nothing with regard to riggie beliefs, they will simply think the governments are part of the conspiracy.


I will add $1,000 as incentive if they can provide conclusive evidence that a major online poker room (even Full Tilt ) is rigged.

You have to admit that $1,000 should provide more incentive than a heartfelt plea from you, but I suspect we will receve none.


This is fine for a casual player, but then casual players should play for any reason they like, and if being a riggie is part of that game experience that's fine.

If a player wants to make money online this is not the approach that is required. Any riggie playing online poker to win money (instead of having fun) should immediately cash out and uninstall every online poker program on their system and never look back.

All the best.

What did you do that made them hate you for winning? What should we ask them? So you've emailed them asking if they're rigging the site? LOL. Got away with what, and are you talking about Stars or a site like Stars? What is all this rambling about? I genuinely have no idea. So your claim is that they've always been rigging things, and continue to do so out of greed? K. Longterm like 10+ years? Chess is popular all over the world, it's a basically solved game, and yet there are still millions of awful chess players. Why do you think poker is different, and why do you think having more players who are skilled will make poker easier for you?

Is it because you won't have to move up to have your raises respected? There will always be players who don't trust the games, there are already people now who don't trust live poker because of shuffling machines, for God's sake. Then show us how we're being cheated, instead of claiming you want to protect your privacy. Which sites were "rigged" and hurt the reputation of poker?

ah yes.....but