The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition - Page 51 - Internet Poker

spadebidder · 02-03-2009, 10:50 PM

So lets summarize these twelve hands:

1. Lost as favorite
2. Lost as underdog
3. Lost as favorite
4. Tied board as preflop underdog
5. Lost as favorite
6. Lost coin flip (slight underdog)
7. Lost as favorite
8. Lost as favorite
9. Folded
10. Lost as favorite
11. Lost as favorite
12. Won as big underdog (suck out).

Dang, that's some serious riggedness that can't be denied. I'd never play again.

Weevil99 · 02-03-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weevil99
No. The probability that you will lose 9 consecutive times when you are a 76% favorite is 0.000264%.

You'll see it happen once or twice every million hands or so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SooperFish24

Heres my proof. Rigged.

Not proof. Just evidence. And really, it's only evidence if it actually happened. I think most people reading this thread will think it far more likely that you're having a case of selective memory.

Besides, it is usually pretty difficult to use statistics to "prove" anything. Josem came pretty damn close in the potripper case, but those numbers were so far out of the norm that no one could deny what was happening. (Some people did, anyway, but that's irrelevant.) Your numbers aren't anything like that.

A bad streak, even an extremely rare bad streak, doesn't prove anything. It might give you some support for your argument, but it's far from proof. It would take a lot of hands, ideally from a lot of different people, to build a credible case that a site is rigged in any way. How many hands would it take? That depends entirely on what it is you're claiming they do and how blatant or subtle they are in doing it. Maybe only 10 thousand, maybe 10 million. It depends on what you're claiming.

Have fun.

AaronT · 02-03-2009, 11:12 PM

Quote:

I wish online poker was legit but I know after playing on and off for the last 5/6 years that it is[n't]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SooperFish24

The software is pre programmed to inflict the bad beats and that is only known to a small group of people. Certainly not the average employee of the site. Cant have whistleblowers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SooperFish24

Yes could you give me more examples to refresh my memory.

Well, thank you for saving me the effort of searching.

Quote:

Yeah it says Rigged. So what.

SO... you've asserted something you now claim is merely oppinion. You do know that that's dishonest, right? You should only assert things you know to be true, and ideally be able to back them up with references.

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If it said 100% absolute certainty no doubt rigged I could see your point Aaron T.

That's an absurd defense. Don't assert things you don't know are true. It's so unethical.

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Where s your friend qpw?

Ummm... you would know at least as well as I.

Boo Boo · 02-04-2009, 01:15 AM

Going back to Live Casino's being rigged vs Online Sites being rigged.

How easy would it be to prove an online site was rigged?
With enough HH's you could do it.
How easy would it be to prove a live casino was rigged?
Virtually impossible

How much business would one lose if it was known that the poker games were rigged.
A **** load.

In conclusion
A online site has way much more to lose, if it was found to be rigged;
It would be relatively easy to prove an online site was rigged.

I would say it would be -EV for an online site to rig the deal. Especially the big ones that are making huge amounts of $$.

Weevil99 · 02-04-2009, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SooperFish24

Heres my proof. Rigged.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boo Boo

Going back to Live Casino's being rigged vs Online Sites being rigged.

How easy would it be to prove an online site was rigged?
With enough HH's you could do it.
How easy would it be to prove a live casino was rigged?
Virtually impossible

How much business would one lose if it was known that the poker games were rigged.
A **** load.

In conclusion
A online site has way much more to lose, if it was found to be rigged;
It would be relatively easy to prove an online site was rigged.

I would say it would be -EV for an online site to rig the deal. Especially the big ones that are making huge amounts of $$.

People keep saying that, and it keeps not being true. Depending on how a site was cheating, it could be virtually impossible to prove they were doing it. It could easily require a massive, concerted effort from a large number of people with a gigantic number of HHs.

If they never deal pocket Aces to people from Canada, it would be pretty easy to demonstrate that. If they only swap out a Canadian's Aces once every thousand times he gets them, it would be a lot harder to prove. In fact, you'd probably never even notice, and the site could happily indulge its bigotry toward Canadians undetected.

**Bobo Fett** · 02-04-2009, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weevil99

If they never deal pocket Aces to people from Canada, it would be pretty easy to demonstrate that. If they only swap out a Canadian's Aces once every thousand times he gets them, it would be a lot harder to prove. In fact, you'd probably never even notice, and the site could happily indulge its bigotry toward Canadians undetected.

Goddamnit, I knew something was going on!

TonyB73 · 02-04-2009, 07:14 AM

Man, I've only been dealt Aces 25 times in my last 10K hands. I knew it was rigged! And I'm not even Canadian!

Boo Boo · 02-04-2009, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weevil99

People keep saying that, and it keeps not being true. Depending on how a site was cheating, it could be virtually impossible to prove they were doing it. It could easily require a massive, concerted effort from a large number of people with a gigantic number of HHs.

If they never deal pocket Aces to people from Canada, it would be pretty easy to demonstrate that. If they only swap out a Canadian's Aces once every thousand times he gets them, it would be a lot harder to prove. In fact, you'd probably never even notice, and the site could happily indulge its bigotry toward Canadians undetected.

Good point, but surely to make it worthwhile they would have to do something to make it noticeable. What's the point of rigging the deal every 100th hand for an extra $1 in rake?

Josem · 02-04-2009, 07:24 AM

If the discussion is now one of "is it possible that something undetectable is happening" then that's even more nutty than normal "rigtard" threads.

If something undetectable is happening, then it's obviously undetectable, and therefore, you can't do anything about it, so it doesn't matter if it's happening (since you can't notice it happening anyway).

Wendel Clark · 02-04-2009, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weevil99

In fact, you'd probably never even notice, and the site could happily indulge its bigotry toward Canadians undetected.

If anyone rigs the sites against Canadians they'll have me to answer to.

Boo Boo · 02-04-2009, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josem

If the discussion is now one of "is it possible that something undetectable is happening" then that's even more nutty than normal "rigtard" threads.

If something undetectable is happening, then it's obviously undetectable, and therefore, you can't do anything about it, so it doesn't matter if it's happening (since you can't notice it happening anyway).

True, but the counter argument to "where is the proof" is always, "the pokersite do it so you can't detect it."

My argument to that is, well if they don't do it often enough to be able to detect it, why would they bother doing it at all.

I mean theoretically I could cut my fingers off. But why would I want to?