The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

[lolusernames]

Originally Posted by donk mcReetard

in a carbon stt today watching some fishy get tilted and shoving every hand. (deepstacked not icm). as long as he had the worst hand going in (which was nearly every hand since he was shoving atc) he would win on the river or runner runner. over & over again. counless times. guys with AA, KK, QQ, AKS, JJ would reshove and lose to trash. over & over. it was quite amazing and quite a joke to behold. but yeah, it's all legit and all random...lol.

Thanks for posting.

I think we can finally confirm poker is rigged.

[donk mcReetard]

Originally Posted by lolusernames

Thanks for posting.

I think we can finally confirm poker is rigged.

ain't random > rigged......bring on the next facetious rebutal.

[Bingo_Boy]

Originally Posted by donk mcReetard

in a carbon stt today watching some fishy get tilted and shoving every hand. (deepstacked not icm). as long as he had the worst hand going in (which was nearly every hand since he was shoving atc) he would win on the river or runner runner. over & over again. counless times. guys with AA, KK, QQ, AKS, JJ would reshove and lose to trash. over & over. it was quite amazing and quite a joke to behold. but yeah, it's all legit and all random...lol.

Why was he tilted? Why don't you shove trash every hand? How was it "counless" times?

[Josem]

Originally Posted by OnE OuT On RiVeR

Really!!!!!!!! your business acumen is lacking.
Why do Pokerstars refuse to allow Ecorga approvals and auditing.

Beause Ecogra is owned by competitors of PokerStars, and PokerStars is never going to reveal their source code to competitors.

For goodness sake, Ecogra refuses to help customers if they go public with their complaint: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-bots-1280322/

if you're holding ecogra as some sort of "ideal regulator" then you are truly clueless:

a) they're owned by poker sites!

b) they are not responsible to a democratically elected government

c) there's no right of appeal to an independent court system

d) they have no regulatory or legal role

e) poker sites can join or leave as they wish


There are probably many things that would make online poker more credible and/or trustworthy. More ecogra is not one of those things.

[donk mcReetard]

Originally Posted by Bingo_Boy

Why was he tilted? Why don't you shove trash every hand? How was it "counless" times?

wow, clever questions! what's your point? other than the one on top of your head.

[Bingo_Boy]

Originally Posted by donk mcReetard

wow, clever questions! what's your point? other than the one on top of your head.

If he was tilted from losing a hand why didnt the site let him win that hand rather than having to let him repeatedly double up from a short stack in such an obvioulsy rigged way?

If bad hands always win why aren't you shoving bad hands and making a fortune?

Why did you say something happened countless times when it obviously was countable? Why are you convinced it is rigged if you didn't count them, let alone do the mathematics that would suggest it is rigged?

Basically, my point is that you are talking nonsense. Or to phrase it in a way that you would understand:

"Yeah, your little story truly is evidence of rigging and you are a very intelligent and insightful individual...lol"

[grenzen]

Bingoboy, as hard as you try, and believe in yourself to be true, you can never guarantee that card rigging will never happen.

Do you trust everybody? That is naive to think that there will never be an employee at a poker site, who has authorized access, the knowledge, the criminal intent, and the scheme to alter the original source code and subroutines to do something illegal.

We broached this very issue a few weeks earlier at pokerstars when the employee with access, with knowledge, with intent, and with a scheme sent out unauthorized corporate emails to players for his own purposes. This didn't involve programming, but it still shows that employees can and will alter the way things work for their own purpose.

Hey look, if you still dont believe me, then watch the documentary "Oceans 13".

)

[donk mcReetard]

i'm claiming it's not random. you can spoonfeed the word 'rigged' all you want, dr. sanctimony. please don't make any inane remarks to me anymore.

[Monteroy]

Originally Posted by grenzen

Bingoboy, as hard as you try, and believe in yourself to be true, you can never guarantee that card rigging will never happen.

Do you trust everybody? That is naive to think that there will never be an employee at a poker site, who has authorized access, the knowledge, the criminal intent, and the scheme to alter the original source code and subroutines to do something illegal.

Riggies believe pretty much trust what other riggies say without needing any evidence. Are they naive to do that? When you read this latest fake gimmick Mcwhatever's posts, what is your initial reaction?

Originally Posted by grenzen

We broached this very issue a few weeks earlier at pokerstars when the employee with access, with knowledge, with intent, and with a scheme sent out unauthorized corporate emails to players for his own purposes. This didn't involve programming, but it still shows that employees can and will alter the way things work for their own purpose.

Hey look, if you still dont believe me, then watch the documentary "Oceans 13".

)

He got caught. Quickly. Somehow though none of those involved in the RnG rigging that riggies support have yet to be caught by anyone.

Wouldn't your example (given how quickly it was caught internally and externally) disprove riggie beliefs of a massive secret conspiracy that can never be caught?


All the best.

[grenzen]

Wouldn't your example (given how quickly it was caught internally and externally) disprove riggie beliefs of a massive secret conspiracy that can never be caught?

I did a forum search of the phrase "massive secret conspiracy" and found that you are the only one who has used it on 2+2.

Besides that, I didnt come here to defend anybodys beliefs, or attack them either. If you feel im in one camp or another, then I think you misunderstood the purpose of what I was pointing out.

I also think it is possible for hardware to fail and produce anomalies. Such as looping, not initializing properly, physical damage to bios or working storage, memory errors, cache timing errors....

The Oceans 13 comment was a lighthearted joke. All the Best to you.

[Bingo_Boy]

Originally Posted by grenzen

Bingoboy, as hard as you try, and believe in yourself to be true, you can never guarantee that card rigging will never happen.

I can't guarantee it will never happen, I am saying that there is no evidence to suggest that it is hapenning and that the people claiming otherwise make no sense.

Originally Posted by grenzen

Do you trust everybody? That is naive to think that there will never be an employee at a poker site, who has authorized accessthe knowledge, the criminal intent, and the scheme to alter the original source code and subroutines to do something illegal.,

I try to trust people unless I have reason not to, in which case I make a judgement based on the information available.

Originally Posted by grenzen

We broached this very issue a few weeks earlier at pokerstars when the employee with access, with knowledge, with intent, and with a scheme sent out unauthorized corporate emails to players for his own purposes. This didn't involve programming, but it still shows that employees can and will alter the way things work for their own purpose.

Hey look, if you still dont believe me, then watch the documentary "Oceans 13".

)

Yeah I have evidence of that in my email.

Originally Posted by donk mcReetard

i'm claiming it's not random. you can spoonfeed the word 'rigged' all you want, dr. sanctimony. please don't make any inane remarks to me anymore.

...and you have provided no evidence to back up these claims and they make no sense whatsoever. Thanks for dropping by.

[Monteroy]

Originally Posted by grenzen

Wouldn't your example (given how quickly it was caught internally and externally) disprove riggie beliefs of a massive secret conspiracy that can never be caught?

I did a forum search of the phrase "massive secret conspiracy" and found that you are the only one who has used it on 2+2.

Clearly this is an indication of a conspiracy of some sort. You should develop it more and present your beliefs.

Originally Posted by grenzen

Besides that, I didnt come here to defend anybodys beliefs, or attack them either. If you feel im in one camp or another, then I think you misunderstood the purpose of what I was pointing out.

That is because you never explained it, which is the behavior pattern of a specific segment in this thread.

You said the following:

Originally Posted by grenzen

We broached this very issue a few weeks earlier at pokerstars when the employee with access, with knowledge, with intent, and with a scheme sent out unauthorized corporate emails to players for his own purposes. This didn't involve programming, but it still shows that employees can and will alter the way things work for their own purpose.

as if it meant something sinister (though you did not explain your specific beliefs). I simply pointed out that the only thing this really proved was that people get caught (which riggies say is generally not possible).

I realize you are going with the uncommitted routine (very common in this thread), but why don't you say specifically what your example was supposed to mean?

Originally Posted by grenzen

I also think it is possible for hardware to fail and produce anomalies. Such as looping, not initializing properly, physical damage to bios or working storage, memory errors, cache timing errors....

Pretending that your looping/caching/memory thing even happens, how would anyone exploit it? Wouldn't errors in cards being dealt show in databases?

Again, what is your specific point here? What are you suggesting?



All the best.

[gzer]

Seems like "Online Poker biz" is the most honest of all the businesses out there, sports are rigged, even elections are rigged , you can go on and on, but hey ... don't you dare to say that online poker might be rigged ! It's simply impossible because if it's rigged then that would be clearly shown in the databases (ROFL!) , ofc super-accounts and stuff like that .. well yano ... **** knows right ? It surely can be done and it was done before, but hey.. it's regulated by Indian tribes so there's absolutely nothing to worry about.
Pffff....

[Monteroy]

I have told riggies for a long time that the smartest thing they can do is cashout all their money, uninstall all online poker software, and never play another hand for the rest of their lives.

Based on your post I assume you agree with me on this? For what it is worth, riggies will believe every word you say without question. They will also want to disagree with anything I say without question, so keep that in mind when posting.

With that in mind - should riggies cashout and never play again? Yes or no? Note, if you say yes (and agree with me) then you will cause a break in the riggie time and space continuum, so it is probably best if you pretend you do not see the question and you never answer it specifically.

All the best.

[gzer]

Sure I agree with you on that, that's the smartest thing you said in all your posts.

Thing is ... I don't see a point for someone who truly believes that online poker isn't a scam in any way (rigged RNG, super-admins, refusing your cashouts for BS reasons, whatever's the case ...) , say someone like you, wasting time posting day after day here repeating same old crap.
Now, I really don't believe in shills regarding this online poker matter, sure there could be some interest like coaching or whatever, but come on man ... let them blow their steam, don't jump like a dog every time. But okay, maybe you enjoy doing that. Fine.

Whether they should cashout or not it's up to them, sure online poker player can maintain status-quo and with some brain always break even, or like in your case , play for 10 years and be up maybe a couple of thousands. Now, if you think about that you will find that all that hard work and 'wasted time' by playing online poker all day long for so many years 'chasing major score' , just to end up with month worth salary is ... 2+2 ?