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View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 2,481 35.01%
No 4,179 58.97%
Undecided 427 6.03%
Voters: 7087. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-06-2012, 02:12 PM   #54046
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Your post is basically tl;dr... It's pointless anyway, because once I saw the point where you asked me for proof when you can't provide any WRT the deal being rigged I saw a double standard and made a fairly reasonable conclusion you're really just a typical unreasonable riggie who tries to hold other to standards they don't hold themselves to.

I could be wrong, except for the last line, which is obvious... You want something from others you are unwilling and unable to provide yourself... If you could provide proof of rigging we would not be having this discussion, would we? Nope... But we are arguing concepts, reasonability and theories, because you can't provide any proof yourself. (Neither side can, so we have to go with 'most likely' as a reasonable conclusion.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812 View Post
From my perspective, the craziest part of the argument is the illogical methodology that you use to flip-flop your opinion and your distain for those that don’t agree with you. You think you’ve applied deep thinking to the issue when it appears you simply have fallen in love with your own conclusions based on an irrational belief system.
I don't have any disdain for those who don't agree with me... You just seem to think I should believe the deal is rigged when it makes no sense and you can't prove it is, so in the absence of contradictory evidence it's much more reasonable to believe poker sites have no need to rig their deals.

Nothing irrational about my beliefs there, but you can attempt to see them that way if you please, just the same as you can believe in Santa Claus.

As far as seeing all marketing as 'essentially equal' where each presents a 'product' (which could be a service), well, yeah, I do see it that way and maybe if people looked at things that way they would see how 'sold' they are on BS ideas by a political party, much the same as they are sold on a hamburger. (If you can't see it that way, then that's fine.)

What you're doing is analogous to arguing for your 'party' without anything other than a 'belief' in the party... No facts, no data, nothing except a belief. I'm very open to believing the deal is rigged if someone can show me proof or at least makes it more reasonable to believe it is rigged than it is not, but so far no one has presented anything that's very convincing.

If you have been involved in political campaigns or sales, then I feel sorry for any candidate or company you represent(ed), because if you don't understand how marketing, in relation to service and products, works you probably did them more harm than good. Political campaigns contain some of the best marketing and sales techniques of any type of campaign.

BTW does McDonald's provide the product of a hamburger, or, the service of buying the meat, buns, etc. and cooking / preparing the hamburger for you? Is fast food a 'quick service' industry or do they provide a product? (The difference is really just semantics. The sales techniques for each work the same way.)

I'm not going to bother to respond to the rest of your questions / replies, because:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812 View Post
That’s correct, I don’t think...
Unlike you, I do think...

Last edited by uDrewAtThat?; 07-06-2012 at 02:35 PM.
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Old 07-06-2012, 02:29 PM   #54047
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by jjjou812 View Post

That’s correct, I don’t think ... (udrewatthat's editing) an election every four years where the winner is determined by the popular vote no matter how many voters is even remotely comparable to a company trying to distinguish itself in a competitive high-tech industry with a rapidly expanding world-wide market. Please explain the similarities you see.
Ahh, end with a misquote and convincing conclusions you brought to the table...just like Bretarded.

Just so that its in proper context..... I guess that's what I get for debating an primate with glasses taking a dump...or is that your look when deeply in thought.
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:04 PM   #54048
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812 View Post
Ahh, end with a misquote and convincing conclusions you brought to the table...just like Bretarded.

Just so that its in proper context..... I guess that's what I get for debating an primate with glasses taking a dump...or is that your look when deeply in thought.
LOL

I wondered how you would respond to a 'short snip' and if I would get to prove the point I made in it...

Lucky me, I guessed right and do, because rather than pointing out what I did with maturity you resorted to childishness and mocking my avatar which really has no bearing on the discussion, but your response says quite a bit about you.

The coolest thing you did was prove my 'short quote' of you to be true.

I actually made it very easy for you to take the 'high road' rather than stooping to the typical 'rigtard level' of attacks, but unfortunately for you, you didn't think before you replied to my post, which proves the short quote of you I used in my previous post is absolutely true.

Basically, I threw out a value bet on the river in my previous post and you paid in full...

Last edited by uDrewAtThat?; 07-06-2012 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:24 PM   #54049
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by blatantlyrigged View Post
Any real online poker players in here? If so, and you think youve lost your mind reading all the psycobabble from all the site promoters, employees, affiliates, etc. that clog this thread defending the rigged OLP scam protecting their financial interests, take a look at some comments from real players, in a forum with real players.

http://www.pokerscout.com/RecentReviews.aspx

Read through some of these posts for GP.

One line that really stood out for me was from "Well Known Euro Grinder" on the first page, who says this about PokerStars:

"I am not the first pro to question this site.The code of silence is strong as stars is a very powerfull organisation but in lounges at some live events you hear the truth from other well known pros who have no affiliation with this site."

It's like the "Lil Holdem exchange" that was posted here not long ago; it would have never seen the light of day except for the fact that the poster was pissed at Lil Holdem because he was welching on a bet they had made together - because he thought PS had targeted his user name and that he could no longer win under it.

If we could all hear the things these pros are saying about this topic in private, I believe it would make the Turd's heads spin like Linda Blair in the Exorcist. (Although they would still make their same arguments against it).
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:49 PM   #54050
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordias View Post
If we could all hear the things these pros are saying about this topic in private, I believe it would make the Turd's heads spin like Linda Blair in the Exorcist. (Although they would still make their same arguments against it).
Why would winning professionals secretly discuss how rigged the sites are, and why would they publicly pretend everything was fine?
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:01 PM   #54051
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordias View Post
Read through some of these posts for GP.

One line that really stood out for me was from "Well Known Euro Grinder" on the first page, who says this about PokerStars:

"I am not the first pro to question this site.The code of silence is strong as stars is a very powerfull organisation but in lounges at some live events you hear the truth from other well known pros who have no affiliation with this site."

It's like the "Lil Holdem exchange" that was posted here not long ago; it would have never seen the light of day except for the fact that the poster was pissed at Lil Holdem because he was welching on a bet they had made together - because he thought PS had targeted his user name and that he could no longer win under it.

If we could all hear the things these pros are saying about this topic in private, I believe it would make the Turd's heads spin like Linda Blair in the Exorcist. (Although they would still make their same arguments against it).
Anonymous racist with learning dificulties claims on the internet that other anonymous people agree with him. Nobody cares.

If "these pros" say the same crap that you do they will get the response that you do. If they exist.
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:58 PM   #54052
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

I'm pretty sure most pro gamblers are not afraid to speak their mind publicly and loudly. And do. They don't whisper conspiracy theories among themselves.
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Old 07-06-2012, 06:33 PM   #54053
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by uDrewAtThat? View Post
The craziest thing about this entire argument and my being involved is when I first started online I thought it was rigged, but the more I looked into it (with an open mind), the harder it became to believe it was, and in the absence of evidence in either direction the more likely and reasonable conclusion is OLP is not rigged.
This statement says it all. You are FOS.
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Old 07-06-2012, 07:04 PM   #54054
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by uDrewAtThat? View Post
LOL

Lucky me, I guessed right and do, because rather than pointing out what I did with maturity you resorted to childishness and mocking my avatar which really has no bearing on the discussion, but your response says quite a bit about you.
I have been mocking you all along. Perhaps you missed them. However, I was also trying to get you to provide proof behind your illogical arguments.

Let’s look at a summary:

uDrewAtThat Post 1

Theory: Poker isn't rigged and I am so much smarter than riggies for seeing it.
Reason 1: because no pros who worked their way to fame have ever claimed it to be rigged.
Reason 2: Because no online site has advertised about another being rigged.

jjjou812 Response:

Points out that a lack of antidotal evidence from .05 percent of poker population and that his second reason is illogical argument that is not followed in common industries.

uDrewAtThat Post 2:

Theory: Negative advertising works in the political arena and I should have really mentioned political campaigning in my response so that Udrew can educate us on political negative campaigns and their effectiveness.

jjjou812 Response:


Indicate that political ads that attack an individual person or his/her reputation are not analogous to a competitor accusing another business of cheating using the same tool (RNG).

uDrewAtThat Post 3

Theories:

1.) Political campaigns are run exactly like product markets.
2.) Poker sites don't all use an RNG nor is it clear where the rigging occurs due to contradicting theories.
3.) My Favorite - It also does not need to be directly negative to be 'negative', an example would be: 'You deserve to play online poker with a fair deal... [poker site].com' Simple, easy, indirectly negative about the other sites and their deals. Directly positive marketing is indirectly negative to competitors.
4.) No absolute proof but my opinions, no matter how illogical, are more likely and reasonable to believe. Such arguments also are applicable to Santa and the Toothfairy with derogatory implications about riggies intelligence levels.

jjjou812 response:
Asks for facts that support his theories. Especially interested in the positive is the same as negative because then these Poker sites have been advertising that their competitors are rigging the deal all this time.


uDrewAtThat Post 4:

Unresponsive to questionings about his basic theories and fails to provide any facts but continues to insult my intelligence and knowledge of the issues being discussed.

uDrewAtThat Post 5:

Notes the irony of him being a former riggie and how illogical his former opinions now seem that he has opened his mind and developed his irrational counter theories.

jjjou812 response:

Point by point show his fallacies and irrationality in a mocking tone.

uDrewAtThat Post 6:

Non-responsive and pulls a BR editing quote of context

jjjou812 response:
Laments wasting time with responding to such an idiot.

uDrewAtThat Post 7:

You fell for it. I win. Value bet on the river.


I now feel like Monteroy in his debate with Filo-something about being chicken and not showing up for the non-existence challenges. Not as cool or omnipresent as Monteroy, but similar.
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Old 07-06-2012, 07:26 PM   #54055
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

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Old 07-06-2012, 09:08 PM   #54056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldGuy View Post
I'm pretty sure most pro gamblers are not afraid to speak their mind publicly and loudly. And do. They don't whisper conspiracy theories among themselves.
Many pros who can affect these online poker sites by having media attention are censored by a Non Disclosure Agreement you damn shill-turd and for the rest of the gamblers who cares when they are never heard by a media supported format moron!



Quote:
Originally Posted by otatop View Post
Why would winning professionals secretly discuss how rigged the sites are, and why would they publicly pretend everything was fine?
WHY REALLY?? Full-Tilt publicly pretended everything was fine as well in regards to players funds. What a damn imbecile you are 1 million sperm cells and you are the one who won. RIGGED!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bingo_Boy View Post
Anonymous racist with learning dificulties claims on the internet that other anonymous people agree with him. Nobody cares.

If "these pros" say the same crap that you do they will get the response that you do. If they exist.

Last edited by Mike Haven; 07-07-2012 at 07:42 AM. Reason: 3 posts merged
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:43 AM   #54057
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shill This U Fools View Post
Many pros who can affect these online poker sites by having media attention are censored by a Non Disclosure Agreement
No they aren't. You totally just made that up. Find just one who signed any kind of perpetual blanket NDA with his sponsorship deal.
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Old 07-07-2012, 12:09 PM   #54058
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

NDAs are like IP addresses, boogeymen that riggies don't understand at all but fear greatly.
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Old 07-07-2012, 04:35 PM   #54059
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

ok well to all the guys who think its 'rigged' just comon, i mean..i was at the casino playing in a tournament 18 left,9 paid, $1,300 to winner. and i'm all in with A-A vs 910 flop 9-10-K.

then im out the door, on super tilt! lol. but if they happened online, people would think its rigged. i mean i see and give and take, the worse bad beats live. just the same as online. get over it people, just play poker.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:58 PM   #54060
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMGiseetrees View Post
ok well to all the guys who think its 'rigged' just comon, i mean..i was at the casino playing in a tournament 18 left,9 paid, $1,300 to winner. and i'm all in with A-A vs 910 flop 9-10-K.

then im out the door, on super tilt! lol. but if they happened online, people would think its rigged. i mean i see and give and take, the worse bad beats live. just the same as online. get over it people, just play poker.
WOW Im convinced!!!!

Shillthisyoufools,
See why its better not to bring any evidence of the blatant deal manipulation that goes on in online poker to this thread yet? You could post an article where an owner of one of these rigged sites finally comes clean and admits it.
All the site promoters, affiliates and employees would say is its a phony article, right? Something to that affect.
Go to a forum with real players. This is not one of them.
Anybody with 1/2 a brain whos played the OLP scam any amount of time already knows its rigged. Might as well leave it that.

Last edited by blatantlyrigged; 07-07-2012 at 08:07 PM.
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