Hows the war on drugs going?

They put it on hold to fight the war on online poker.

lol very nice holmfries. In all seriousness I doubt we see our money this year.

simply because they have nothing new to communicate. I believe they are also genuinely pissed at the situation

First of all, it has by no means been established that the sites violated banking laws. The only evidence we have for that at this moment is the woord of a prosecutor (in the form of the indictment) that has most likely already lied to a federal judge (more on that below). So my mind is still open on whether the sites actually violated the law.

What parts of the prosecution are immoral and corrupt? These:

1. State ethics laws vary, but, generally, I think, lawyers are prohibited from "threatening criminal prosecution to gain advantage in a civil case."

DOJ filed criminal charges and civil charges simultaneously. Is there any evidence that DOJ is using the criminal indictment as leverage in the civil case? yes, it is this:

a. The indictment was unsealed when the site owners were out of the country and not subject to extradition. This plainly suggests DOJ has no intention of ever bringing them to trial.

b. Meanwhile, there are mechanisms that exist for the civil suit to proceed regardless of whether the site owners appear to defend themselves.

c. Obviously, the criminal indictment has the effect of prohibiting the site owners from coming here and defending the civil case, thus leaving them exposed to the possibility of a default judgment against them.

2. State ethics laws do not vary on this point: It is unethical for a lawyer to mislead the court. Is there evidence that this has occurred? Yes, it is this:

a. DOJ had access to all of the information possessed by the Australian processor dude they flipped.

b. Thus, DOJ knew that processor accounts held player funds.

c. Thus, DOJ knew that it was seeking seizure of player funds.

d. DOJ did not tell the judge that some of the accounts seized contained player funds.

(I could make a similar case for non-processor accounts, but this is the clearest example).

3. As a separate and distinct ethical and moral issue, DOJ knowingly and intentionally seized player money to use as leverage against the sites to harm the sites financially. DOJ has done this in the past in previous seizure cases. Here is the process:

a. Seize player money

b. Use legal procedural tricks to halt any motion filed on behalf of players aimed at getting player money released from seizure (this succeeded in the Account Services seizure).

c. Wait for the sites to repay players out of pocket; this has the effect of essentially transforming the seized funds from player money to site money.

d. Offer a sweetheart plea deal to the indicted individual to falsely admit that the seized money belonged to him.

e. Profit.

I will admit that I cannot prove points 1 and 2 beyond a reasonable doubt, but there is evidence that both have occurred in this case.

Thus, it is my opinion that the conduct of the DOJ in this case has been far more immoral than what the sites have been alleged to have done. I stand by that opinion 100%

The "war on drugs" should be called the "War for money"

any sort of update on when we are supposed to be getting another update from FTP?

LOL wp sir

Solid rebuttal. LOL that underground economies don't last. Yeah, and criminals can't get their hands on weapons, and there are no sex slaves in the USA either. Dumbass.

Almost three weeks now since the last update. Solid customer service here. And yeah, I know, they get bashed on their updates, but I'm one of the people that has been bashing harder on NO communication than on SOME communication, however inept that communication may be. Besides, I doubt they even care at this point. Odds that anyone from FTP even reads the update threads after they post their latest "answers"?

Really, though, at this point, I don't see how they can possibly redeem themselves in a lot of people's eyes. Maybe they've just given up and plan on not saying another word until they have an actual plan/timetable, and US players will be lucky if that ONLY takes another few months.

I really wonder what the thread will read like when/if FTP announces it is going to pay out to US players. I assume some will still be upset, some will post lol believe it when I see it, but I think if it gets done any time in the next couple of months, which who knows if it will, people will be relatively forgiving especially if UB/AP still haven't paid.

If FTP pays and has no change of corporate management structure I would hope people would still remember how bad this has been.

Well, this is strictly my opinion of course, but since I don't believe they'll be able to pay out any time soon - certainly not by the end of the summer, and I don't believe there's any better than a 50% chance they'll pay out by the end of the year - I think a lot of people's ire is going to be permanent.

But I doubt that will be enough to kill FTP, unless the DOJ and/or Ivey issues escalate. Between the casual players who don't know much about this, and the new non US players they can recruit, I think they'll survive, but I would not be shocked to see another company take over the #2 spot within the next two years.

To dismiss their accountability to where they put their energy and resources is also short-sited. I'm sure the SS soldier putting the match to the ovens said the same thing. Yes, I compared the DOJ to the nazis, I'm sorry. Watched a bit of FoxNews this week.

The bottom line is someone picked this case to prosecute, with political and financial motives. To give them a pass because they were just "doing their job" is pure first level thinking. They're not as culpable as the religious right, the casino lobbies, Frist, Kyl, and other republicans who thought this would benefit them in some way, but they will catch hell if this ends up imploding. Rightfully so imo. FTP is on my ****list, but they're down the list until the rest shoulder their share of the responsibility.

I agree that it seems unlikely that FTP will pay any time soon. But it is hard to judge how people will feel after they get their money back, especially if it meant a lot to them.

The way I look at the FTP situation is they have my money, misused it, and now I have to wait and if I get it back at all, and I won't get any interest or have had the use of it for however long. I assume I will still be upset after they pay, but how upset I don't know. I really hope that just getting it back won't make myself and others forget how bad FTP has screwed up.

Agreed.

Unless they have a significant change of management, transparency, customer service, player fund management, and accounting, I think all players should think long and hard about if the risk of playing on FTP is worth the benefits.

Totally agree with this. I'd rather get some communication (however worthless it may be) than no communication.

If they get grilled, so be it. It's their responsibility to keep giving us news, even if not much has changed.