as per my reply, lets keep it all in this thread, I will help answer what I can

according to HEM, he was up about $60 total in MTTs & SNGs. While he was up over $2.2K in cash games from the hands that he was sent

I have no SS sub, and not bothered to buy it for this, but from PokerProLabs, a lot of the Japanese dumpers played in $1.50, then $3.50, then $7, then $15 HU Hyper-turbos – looks like vs legit (or at least large volume) players for the most part. Maybe there is some deposit (or other) bonus that gives you a $1.50 ticket, and then some of these accounts were successfully spinning it up. Then dumping to OP in cash games. Its highly unlikely that they are legit accounts that were unable to cashout themselves and just dumped to him to get their funds

Natural progression - win $60 in tournaments lifetime then ask Stars for a deposit limit to suggest playing in the $25K.

Pokerstars is one of the few companies that has the ability and willingness to properly investigate this type of behavior, and they have access to much more data than we have seen here after the OP made the mistake of believing his hands would show proper play.

It would actually be refreshing to have an OP like this actually explain what it was he was doing, and again - depending on the severity I can see a case to be made to get his balance back. If he did some sort of weird instant bankroll multi accounting - yeah that's lame, but perhaps he played real opponents in a real manner - so in theory the games were not tainted by collusion or hacking or credit card laundering fraud.

If the OP chooses to be one of the first that comes clean with whatever his scheme is then we can see where it can go from there. He may have even done things that were considered within the rules in the past, but odds are he will not choose this path even if it is the only one that might lead to some compensation back to him. People like him who get caught refuse to ever admit it, even if it would be in their potential interest.

It seems the result of this open assessment on this issue resulted in speculation on what these japanese accounts were doing. (i believe this is the result of Stars investigations too)

I had been open about this from the start, and i would like to stress again that i played no part in any chip dumping behaviour from these accounts.

At least i have an clearer picture now as Stars refuse to reveal much information.


I would like to say a big thank you to pmarrsouth,ArtyMcFly,AndyM2033 for taking the extra time and effort to look into the issue more in depth and shed more light on what the actual problem was.

I would also want to thank everyone on this thread who took the time to read through and offer me advice or in some giving me negative accusations based on speculations since the very start.

I accept these criticism towards me on this thread because its part and parcel of posting up an issue on a thread and things do not go well in my favor.

What is more important is getting the feedbacks and suggestions which was the main purpose of the thread.

I will keep you guys updated on the response from the gambling commission

Seems to me that someone set up a ring of fraudulent accounts in Japan (As no reason to dump from legit deposits), Somehow dumped to our hero in Korea. He attempted to make it look good (for some reason thinking if he makes standard plays it all OK here). First thinking people are too dumb and posted here in hopes of making him look innocent, than his tone changes and goes from not knowing anything to just saying he played standard and that makes him innocent, no need to look at hand histories here.

"So does this prove that i am connected to these accounts?

And even if lets say all of these players are my friends from Japan joining me for a game.

Does this mean i need to fold my strong holdings to their shove? "

If I could bet vs an all knowing god I'd give long odds against OP being innocent, especially with posts like these.

needed to gather the rest of the funds for the 25k high roller ldo

I was thinking the same thing.

But no ... the deception continues.

It's a Cinderella Story, former 50NL player about to become 25k High Roller Champion!

Can we change the title to "Pokerstars Caught Me Cheating"?

I do not want to speculate on what actually happened here, but the fact is Stars can make up accusations out of thin air.

About 3 or 4 years ago they sent me an e-mail saying they were suspecting me of playing from the USA. And they asked me to prove I did not play from the USA in last 2 or 3 years (WOOT???). Basically, "presumed guilty until proven innocent". I could not believe my eyes.

Anyway, in the end I had to send them some bank card statements (which I consider a demeaning and unacceptable breach of privacy). BTW, I had not even been anywhere close to the USA during that time.

After that, they probably realized how wrong the suspicion was and never contacted me about it again. Not even a short message saying "Sorry for a wrong accusation, for making you go through all the hassle and for treating you like a POS with no basic human or privacy rights"


So I guess all I am saying is, wrong accusations happen and sometimes it can be hard to prove innocence

Not really. They have a reason for their concerns, even if at times their concerns are satisfied with documentation.

An accusation out of thin air would be if they decided on a Saturday to randomly screw people with 7 letters in their user name because it was raining.

Some companies would make up stuff when their business was failing, but to date Stars has never gone after someone simply because someone woke up in a bad mood that day.

While you took this pretty personally (when I doubt they had any personal reasons to ask you), what this showed was that if you provide the documentation they need then the issue gets resolved.


Your reaction is a bit dramatic, but whatever. If you truly have human rights and privacy concerns with sharing basic information then this will be a tricky industry for you.


Seems like it was pretty easy. You just did not like it, as seen by your need to continue to vent about it years later. That is certainly your choice, but you demonstrated that providing the data Stars needs will often times lead to a quick and simple resolution.

I know everyone always assumes these thread are due to the guilt of the OP, and I know it looks like this thread is following a similar trend, but as someone who has been through this process with stars and was actually innocent, the way PS handles these situations makes them seem like complete scum bags.

I did not have any money on my account at the time (luckily I moved my roll to PP/888 months earlier), but I was permanently banned from Poker Stars due to my "association" with another account who broke the ToS and was barred from the client. Stars perma banned me because of the risk that this other player could access the games through my account, yet refused to share any further information on who this account was (didn't even provide the name) and basically stone walled me in every email attempt, basically telling me to **** off.

I explained to support that I lived in a university dorm for over a year, offered to provide evidence of my board and asked for any information that could help me clear this up. Nothing. Be very careful with your money on this site guys, they will not hesitate to bar you and rob you without explanation in true mob-like form if something even looks suspicious.

That being said, it's pretty clear that this guy is guilty due to the hand histories shared, but I am more so speaking to the system that stars has adopted after it's sale. No ****s given about the players and no emphasis on support or a relationship with the customer.

It is always easy to jump on the "Amaya is a big nasty meanie" bandwagon, but realistically this company does not go after people for random reasons, nor for more common reasons associated with failing or corrupt companies.

Do they make mistakes? Of course. I got a chat ban for a month when someone asked me at the tables what my ROI was in DoNs and I answered then a mod was called and I was cited for talking about game statistics.

I also had my account frozen for a few days after Black Friday when I tested the system with regard to $T sales with Americans by doing a test trade for $1 to an American friend's dormant account (he had not played in years). When I saw that this could work I reported it to Stars, and they thanked me. Two days later I got an email saying my account was frozen pending an investigation of an attempted transfer to an American . Even with the previous email chain as evidence it took a couple days before my account was back. Annoying, but part of the industry.

In your case - perhaps you were totally innocent, or not. Everyone claims to be totally innocent as you see from these threads, however you had no money confiscated, so even if they banned you because of concern of association, that is within their right to do as per their terms, but without question people need to take from all of these cases that one needs to treat their accounts properly.

So the assumption is that I didn't treat my account properly by playing on my only internet connection in my own dorm room? I fully understand that Amaya has the right to ban accounts due to their own terms, what I am actually talking about is the lack of clarity and transparency in their process. Right or wrong, there are people who have become dependent on sites like Stars for their financial livelihood, and if they want the right to take the funds from these accounts then they should also be forced to provide the direct evidence and allow the person to defend themselves.


The old stars used to be a glowing example of what customer service was supposed to look like, what currently exists is the scum at the bottom of the old platforms shoes.

Also, if you did that American scenario now-a-days, you'd be permabanned without question. Lets see how just you think the system is then.

That's not what happened in this thread. People were naturally skeptical, but most posters seemed to approach the story with an open mind. But then inconvenient facts started to trickle in, and the guy began to dodge the questions. Then he headed out with his tail between his legs looking guilty as hell.

That absolutely happened in this thread, people instantly assumed he was hiding the smoking gun, which he was.

"Oh I just so happened to play in an internet cafe in Japan while players were chip dumping to me"

Actually he's right, and you're wrong. People did try to help him - he even thanked some of them. But the story just fell apart.

My assumption in pretty much all threads like this is that OPs leave out important information when they explain their side of the story, and that has been proven true except for a couple of specific cases in memory.

I have no idea about your situation - I guess create another thread if you really want to present your case, but I do know that a ton of students have played from a ton of computers in a ton of dorms or internet cafes, and if there was a systemic removal of all of them that would be massive news, so something likely happened in your situation that differed from the norm.

What that was? Who knows - as I said threads and topics like this usually leave out full information.


Nah, that is just you venting. I had full documentation of what I did and why and I reported it to Stars before they did any action, and they thanked me for the information. Even with as you would claim to be "Evil Amaya" that is the type of detailed information that makes situations easier to understand and resolve quickly.

Latest update,

No help from the gambling commission whatsoever, these guys just parrot copy and paste whatever Stars says.

Good luck on anyone who think these regulators would actually help

Thanks for the update. Sounds like the gaming commission is doing a good job in this case.

What a tangled web this is! I just looked up their dates of their very first games played and all of them were created in April or May of this year. Then I checked to see who they all have been playing HU against and its against each other and/or the many more Japanese accounts (which also were created in April and May 2017). Its all basically a pyramid. Truly hard to believe these Japanese accounts dumping to each other from the bottom to the top, and OP actually being an innocent victim at the top on the receiving end of all the money.

On a side note, if all of these accounts were not bonus abusing, couldn't they all just transfer the money to the OP without having to chip dump?

Not really surprising at all, you were clearly involved. I would have tried to run the angle that I played and won vs most accounts at a gametype that PokerStars themselves pairs me vs my opponents, and that I have no control over who I am paired vs

Stars closed/banned these accounts within about 48 hours of this post


Stars appears to have only restricted this account, rather than close/ban it. They did this around the same time as they closed the 4 above accounts. Maybe the investigation into it is still ongoing

Nice to see you are still doing great work pmarr.


I don't know if you remember me or not.
But when I was in bad shape and owed people money, you had faith in me an supported me.
Thank you.

pmarr , do i still have any options ?

by emailing stars or gaming commission again by running the angle you mentioned ?

Probably not

deadend? seem no hope of 50/50 of the confiscated funds i guess.
bitter taste in the end because i honestly did not breach any rules.

But i guess its hard to be convincing given the details stacked against me