4th option: Reduce the rake to a level that's not ridiculous so that players might feel more generous towards tipping the dealers.

5th option: Keep the rake at the same level but give the dealers a proper salary.

options 4 and 5 make no sense for the casino, they are already losing money on poker, that would mean more of a loss

No.

a) For the vast majority of cardrooms and casinos, this is NOT true.

b) For the ones where it is, cut costs/improve logistics/acknowledge as a loss leader or shut down the room.

I think he means it's a loss in terms of $/per sq ft compared to casino games, but what he doesn't realize is that if the casino had waiting lines for slot machines, that card room would vanish in a NY minute.

6th option. Casinos are not allowed to rake more than a certain amount. Would never work in the US though, considering corruption (I know you call it lobbying, but let's be real).

Yeah, this whole market economy thing really has been a debacle.

Yes poker players lobby is extremely powerful in the US, since we got ourselves by far the lowest rake in the world

I'd say it's our tipping culture that got us that.

Talking about the casino lobby obviously.

ok I give up

Exactly. Well said.

I've stuck to the following for years and it's served me well...

• Tip the good dealers and stiff the bad ones. You absolutely cannot cut in to your bottom line when a bad dealer is already doing just that.
• Dealers get $1 for small-medium pots and $2 for larger pots. I don't tip for super small pots or hands that don't see a flop.

Over the last couple of days, I have been involved in a heated thread on Facebook about tipping. Does anyone have reliable statistics on the following.

Live play
1/2 or 2/5 NL
9 handed tables.
1. How many hands are dealt on average?
2. How many hands a TAG (25/15 for example) player will win on average?
3. If the rake is 10% max of $6 plus a $1 Promo Drop after $10 pot, how much would a good average be for the above mentioned player.

25/15 is not tag. not even close. So, whatever the argument may be about, knowing this, I think you lose.

Granted. Just trying to find out an accurate hourly rate for rake.

Rake in most charity rooms where I play is $90 to $130 per hour depending on table dynamic and dealer ability. These are 10% $6 max tables with no promo drop.

From my experience most 2/5 tables are 10-30% slower than a 1/2 table but generally get max rake more often which 'can' balance things out.

I'm not sure how tipping and rake go together but we are all watching for more details!! GL

So, the heated debate on a facebook thread about tipping....

avg hands per hour?
how many hands a tag wins (or a 25/15)?
good avg for said player? Avg what? Avg number of times he follds? orders drink?

all of this to find out an accurate hourly rake?

Sounds like a heated debate of dimwits.

Back in the limit days, when rake was $3 per hand, any hand, $125 per hour was the norm.

Are players expected to tip when cashing in tournies if 3% is taken out for dealers and their is rake? I've always tipped when cashing in tournies but feel I will not in the future bc it's throwing money away in a high variance game. Thoughts. Maybe 1-2% if won tourny

The 3% is a tip, so you don't have to tip extra. I view it the same as a pizza delivery charge: I tip less or not at all if there's already something taken out.

You seriously screw the delivery guy if the pizza place charges for delivery? That's akin to not tipping dealers because the room charges rake. In most cases, the delivery guy gets none of the service charge and the pizza place justifies the need for it based on their additional costs of providing delivery service (liability insurance, those heated pizza bags, and any other bogus charge they can throw in there).

In reality, the service charge is just a way for the business to increase the cost of it's product without raising prices. Similar to why and how airlines do the same with baggage fees rather than including it in the cost of the ticket.

It's one thing if you weren't aware that the driver doesn't get that fee, but it's quite another if you knew that and still screw him over. If it's the latter, then I hope that he spits in your pizza if you order from the same place a second time.

Yeah so imagine how many people don't know that and how such charges really **** over the delivery people. No matter how wrong you are for not tipping, it can't hold a flame to the greed of a business owner who kills what little income his employees make.

When a restaurant charges an automatic 18% gratuity for larger parties, we know it goes to the staff in some form or another. It's reasonable that some people don't know that the delivery driver gets only some or nothing from the delivery charge.

https://piss.io/instacart-renames-ti...7d6#.44qt9vy9r

Something similar just happened with the Instacart service. This article by John Hendren put pressure on the company to revert their policy.

It's not akin to withholding tips due to rake, it's akin to not tipping when there's a drop called "dealer fee."

This thread keeps proving over and over why all tipping needs to be done away with.