This is from a bounty tournament last night at a casino with a mix of locals and tourists. Every player has an oversized bounty chip that you need to put in the pot when you are all in. The chip is much larger and a different color than the tournament chips in play.

The hand in question:

Blinds are 1k-2K. It folds to me on the button. I toss in my bounty chip, indicating I am all in (I did not make a verbal declaration). The small blind instantly says "I call" and throws in a single 1k chip. The dealer says "you call the all in?" The small blind looks flustered and says he meant to just call the big blind and didn't notice that I had thrown in my bounty chip. The dealer calls the floor.

When the floor arrives, he says the small blind must leave the 1k chip in the pot, but had the option to fold without losing anymore chips. I of course protested saying that he had said "call" and it is his responsibility to follow the action. He acted so quickly that the dealer didn't even have a chance to announce all-in. Imo, once he said call all his chips should have gone in the middle. The floor disagreed, saying the small blind's action was "un-willful negligence," so he gets a one-time warning. If he does it again, he will be considered all-in. During our discussion, the small blind threw his hand into the muck, at which point I realized there was no way the floor would change his mind at that point and I let it go.

fwiw, the small blind was a nice older guy, and I think he just made an honest mistake.

Did the floor make the right ruling?

I have no problem with the ruling, the dealer didn't verbalize you were all in before he limped.

Yes.

fwiw I don't really think you had a case to try and hold him to the all-in. If you verbally announced it loud and clear while pushing all your chips in, then yes.

So the other player is a nice old guy and you want to hold him to an all-in that he never intended? Sorry, but that's really ****ty on your part.

You got lucky the floor ruled that his $1k had to stay in the pot. Other places would allow for him to take his call back and reconsider his action.

Bounty chips should never be allowed to designate an all-in (even though we know that's the rule in many places). When the room rule dictates that it is an all-in, an announcement at the beginning of the tournament is a must.

Floor should have given the 1k back.

I think this is pretty common in tournament play, even during cases of misunderstood action.

I would expect to see this a lot in cash play, but typically a player is 'penalized' any chips entered into the betting area during the tournaments I've played.

As a Floor, I'm almost never holding this player to an AI here. Kudos to the Dealer for clarifying action and getting a ruling. GL

Yuck. A little disappointed that you got the extra 1k chip.

I don't know if it is the same where you play, but even though it was considered en vogue to toss in the bounty chip, I was informed by multiple dealers that this was in fact not a valid action.

If you toss in one chip that is not indicative of a betting value and make no verbal declaration, then no, the SB should not be bound to an action you did not declare, unless it is explicitly specified that tossing in a single bounty chip is an all-in.

I've recently played in a tournament where it was announced at the beginning the bounty chip meant all-in.

It was announced at the start of the tournament that you needed to throw the bounty chip into the pot in order to go all in.

This is going to depend on the room. OP seems to infer that in this room, throwing in the bounty chip i an all-in. OP's situation is why I personally prefer that it's not an action.

I'm fine with the ruling including the 1k staying in the pot. It's pretty common in tournaments that any money put in the pot in-turn stay in the pot.

So a player can announce all-in, wait for somebody to call him and then say "I didn't put the bounty chip in" and muck his hand without losing a single chip?

The reason why I was asking if it was specifically stated was because in the room I play in, half the players assume that the bounty chip is an all-in bet, but the rule is different, which can lead to confusion. Unless it is clearly stated, I would put this up there with one chip calls as 'things that might indicate an action, or might just be terribly confusing and should be avoided.'

I am curious as to what the action would be ruled if you put all your chips in the middle in one clean movement, but did not put in your bounty. Is that a minriase? A call? An all-in? Is your hand killed? Are you banned from the casino?

No. It's just one of many - say all-in, push all of your chips in, call a bet/raise more than you have, toss in the bounty chip.

This isn't hard, but like I said earlier, if this is the room rule it needs to be made clear to the players at the beginning.

That's not how he described the announcement:
Based on that, no bounty chip = no all-in.

I would have made the exact same ruling.

Then what is it if you push in all your chips but not the bounty chip?

So I verbally an OCD all of in. But I am not ? What does my verbal announcement mean?

Or I shove all my chips except the bounty in to the put in a single motion. Am I all in? If not what is s the size of my heart?

What do if I do that at the same time?

I'm about as pedantic as possible, but c'mon.

That's literally the rule.

OK splitting hairs folks ... Nowhere do I see here that it states that you 'are' All-In by throwing in your Bounty Chip!! It only states that 'in order' to go All-In you 'need' to throw in the BC. Which leads me to believe that one of the 'standard' AI conditions must also be met 'in order' to go AI!!

We all know what's going on here. We are all well beyond this thread trail. We all know that Floor's speak in twisted tongue at the start of tournaments.

I think we are looking at 2 issues here ..
1) The validity of a silent BC meaning AI ... 'maybe' by house rule

2) The SB's right to correct misunderstood action, which the Dealer very quickly handled before the rest of the action took place.

This is a good splitting hairs discussion but I think it was handled with a much greater emphasis on #2 than #1. I'm all for going down the 'what if' trail and I think the SB would've been in a much more precarious spot if he hadn't 'completed' the Blind in the 'calling' process, but with a Bounty being a 'non-standard' type of tournament I think we lean more towards player protection than the letter of the law for that particular room. GL

Not necessarily. It could be poorly worded but they may be saying that if you do go all-in YOU MUST PUT IN YOUR BOUNTY CHIP as opposed to IF YOU DON'T PUT IN YOUR BOUNTY CHIP YOU ARE NOT ALL IN.


In my room putting in a bounty chip (without a verbal declaration is not an action (but it may be ruled in all in in the interests of fairness if circumstances make that the best ruling) The reason this rule exists is to avoid the sitiation where a player is held to all in because they didn;t notice that the bounty chip was in the chips they were betting with.

IN OP's case we are told the bounty chip is an oversized chip. This makes it difficult for players to mistake it for a tournament chip as a result I don;t feel much sympathy for a player who either accidently bets it or assumes it isn't a bounty chip and calls it.

I don;t object to letting the player off the hook if it hasn;t caused any damage .... but I will never feel that player is a victim.