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Old 11-29-2010, 03:30 AM   #1
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need advice going pro in vegas

hello guys, been reading 2+2 for a while, but never post anything this is first time posting. i have been playing poker for few years, play both online and live poker and have been winning so far. i play mostly nl200 (consistent winner but win rate is not fantastic or anything), and some nl400 (still quite new to this level, but so far been winning). the live games i play only have 2-5, and i won most money playing the live game.
i wanna become a pro in Las Vegas, and live there for like 3 month or so to try out, but i have some questions. is it worth it? is the 5-10 NL game in Vegas tough? and more importantly is it safe to live there as a poker pro alone? i have no friends in Vegas, so safety is one of my biggest concern. so any of the nice 2+2 people would answer the questions for me, it would be greatly appreciated, and help me a lot, thanks!
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Old 11-29-2010, 03:44 AM   #2
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Vegas wouldn't even be in my top 10 places to play 2-5 as a pro.
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Old 11-29-2010, 03:48 AM   #3
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop22 View Post
Vegas wouldn't even be in my top 10 places to play 2-5 as a pro.
the reason i wanna move to vegas is that i dont wanna play 2-5 anymore, wanna play higher. but main concern is safety issue.
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:08 AM   #4
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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Originally Posted by friendlybee View Post
hello guys, been reading 2+2 for a while, but never post anything this is first time posting. i have been playing poker for few years, play both online and live poker and have been winning so far. i play mostly nl200 (consistent winner but win rate is not fantastic or anything), and some nl400 (still quite new to this level, but so far been winning). the live games i play only have 2-5, and i won most money playing the live game.
i wanna become a pro in Las Vegas, and live there for like 3 month or so to try out, but i have some questions. is it worth it? is the 5-10 NL game in Vegas tough? and more importantly is it safe to live there as a poker pro alone? i have no friends in Vegas, so safety is one of my biggest concern. so any of the nice 2+2 people would answer the questions for me, it would be greatly appreciated, and help me a lot, thanks!
If you've got enough money to live for 3 months, don't have any ties, have a job to back to (or can get one quick) and do it for fun go for it knowing that you will possibly (likely?) fail.

I'd say that working a job to sustain yourself and playing outside of work hours would be better as you'll have time to reflect on hands and won't be as subject to short term variance/tilt/boredom but this isn't the advice most people want when they ask this question here.

Make sure you can go back to working a job because IMO you don't want to get stuck playing for a mediocre existence for the rest of your life and given you haven't moved up in stakes you likely aren't crushing the games or you would of moved up already.

Two questions that might help:
- What's your total winnings over how many hours (offline) and hands (online)
- Why are you so worried about safety? I play at Casino's and have walked 2km+ in different major Australian cities probably 50 times with 1k+ in my pocket, couldn't you park your car in the casino car park?
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:11 AM   #5
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Sorry - Third question is how big is your roll?
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:49 AM   #6
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop22 View Post
Vegas wouldn't even be in my top 10 places to play 2-5 as a pro.
No Matter what the game, I would suggest L.A.
for many reasons I won't get into now.

GL


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Old 11-29-2010, 04:56 AM   #7
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

I moved there in '08 (moved back recently). My winrate was about the same as it was/is in Southern CA (playing 5-10 and 10-20 for the most part). Tough town to live in though- but not because of safety. There are plenty of safe places to live. I researched crime rates and found something gated in one of several good areas.

If you have a lot of discipline and are good at live poker you should do fine. GL.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:35 AM   #8
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

If safety is your biggest concern, then bring a big enough roll to cover your ass. Or, start lower (1/2) and build it up.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:37 AM   #9
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

what about florida?
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:30 AM   #10
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

i have a roll of 22k, is it too small to play 5-10? was just wondering if i beat 2-4 online, can i beat 5-10 live? thanks for the answers.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:56 AM   #11
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

5/10 live plays much higher than 5/10 online.. be aware of that.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:09 AM   #12
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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5/10 live plays much higher than 5/10 online.. be aware of that.
Does it? I have never played either, but have heard contrary to this a number of times.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:18 AM   #13
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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i have a roll of 22k, is it too small to play 5-10? was just wondering if i beat 2-4 online, can i beat 5-10 live? thanks for the answers.
Hard to say as they are two different games and the skills needed to win live differ from on-line and vis versa. Remember live you are giving up tracking systems, etc....and doing it in your head.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:21 AM   #14
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

I dunno who told you the contrary, but I think most B&M regs will tell you they're wrong. Every live table I've played at, the limits play higher than their online counterparts.

At $1/2, it's not unusual to see $1k+ stacks on the table. $2/5 often has $500-1500 buy in with tons of 3k+ stacks. $5-10 can be $1000-3000, or sometimes doesn't even have a cap. Not unusual to see a table with 5k+ stacks, 10k+ stacks...
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Old 11-29-2010, 11:20 AM   #15
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Just came off MooreMoney19's thread... i recalled him calculating out the rake through his 3 weeks of 'going pro' with a 30k br taking shots at the 5-10 original post Here

Quote:
Letís look at the rake. I played 126 hours of poker. At roughly $12/hour, thatís $1512 dollars that I signed over to the Bellagio before I even sat down at a table. Add in another 500 in tips for the dealers, and before I knew it I was 2 buy-ins deep and I hadnít even seen a flop. While maybe that doesnít seem THAT crazy. Letís look at it annually. For mathematical purposes letís say you want to play 40 hour weeks, 50 weeks a year. At $12/hour thatís $560 a week. Add in tipping money for the dealers and itís a bit closer to 7 bills. Repeat that 50 times, and all of a sudden you owe the Bellagio about 35K. 35 buy-ins. In order to make a salary comparable to the average American (28k), you now need to make 63 buy-ins. 6 figures you say? One hundred and thirty five buy-ins. And so on, you all can do math. Add in the fact that real jobs come with benefits to the tune of dental care, while poker players sometimes get discounts at Snacks and the economic disparity becomes a little more transparent.
You should ck out the entire thread, but that post quoted above should be just what you are looking for.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:01 PM   #16
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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Originally Posted by canoodles View Post
I dunno who told you the contrary, but I think most B&M regs will tell you they're wrong. Every live table I've played at, the limits play higher than their online counterparts.
Really? In my experience I've never sat at a table which played anywhere near the level of it's online counterpart and I think most if not all B&M regs would share this experience. Where do you play?
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:30 PM   #17
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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Originally Posted by philipchilip View Post
Really? In my experience I've never sat at a table which played anywhere near the level of it's online counterpart and I think most if not all B&M regs would share this experience. Where do you play?
Limits play higher as in there is more money on the table and average pots are larger, not more skilled play.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:44 PM   #18
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Online doesn't play as high as local in my experience. You're also not likely to play online with the same group of players for 4-12 hours at a time, nor are you likely to play the same people several times in a week.

New live players making the transition from online are also way easy to spot. The biggest tell is their inability to quickly access how many monies are in the pot vs. how much each player has in comparison to themselves. With online, the numbers are there and you know exactly to the penny what each player has and what the total pot is. So if they post has 4 people in when the river comes and there's been some action, it tells you right there on the screen how much is in the pot. Transitioning players aren't used to doing the math in their heads because it's always been provided to them.

Additionally, online players tend not to have the endurance to play live. While many are used to multi-tabling for hours on end, in some cases a dozen or more games at a time, many can't deal w/ the comparatively slow pace that is live play. With things such as HUD it's also far easier to make table selections, live is far different, being sat where you're told until a seat change maybe becomes available.
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Old 11-29-2010, 02:55 PM   #19
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Yup, and you usually get the crappiest seat at the table. The reason being that the seat is open often because the previous occupant got busted out by the guy(s) on his left.
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:19 PM   #20
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

From my experience, $0.01/$0.02 online plays like 1/2 live, with 1/2 being significantly more passive (in general, sometimes you get an aggro 1/2 table).

10NL and 25NL play way higher than any live game i have ever played in besides the home game i play in.
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:25 PM   #21
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Quote:
Originally Posted by philipchilip View Post
Really? In my experience I've never sat at a table which played anywhere near the level of it's online counterpart and I think most if not all B&M regs would share this experience. Where do you play?
When canoodles meant the level plays "higher" he didn't mean the skill level. He mean't players are sitting with deeper stacks, so a 5/10 game will be a deeper game than a 1000NL game online.
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Old 11-29-2010, 06:29 PM   #22
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

thx for the responses so far, as skill needed to beat the game, i play both online and live, i have spent a many hours in live poker too (about 500 hours). i figure even if i cant beat the game, i shouldn't lose too horribly i hope. the thing is if i find an apartment or something to live in, is it safe to get out of casino to the place i live? assume i don't live in super rich area. if u cash out like 8k and stuff (obv 8k is not much for many ppl, but for some broke degen in vegas, anything will do) should i worry about safety like this or am i just thinking too much?
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Old 11-29-2010, 06:34 PM   #23
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

Yea canoodles you are completely wrong. 5/10 online is a much bigger game than 5/10 live. I would be comfortable grinding 5/10 live for a living with like 15k to my name. I wouldn't be sure I could grind for a full day at 5/10 online with 15k.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:05 PM   #24
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

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Originally Posted by Bishop22 View Post
Vegas wouldn't even be in my top 10 places to play 2-5 as a pro.
Which places are ahead of LV (besides LA) if you want to eventually move up to the highest limits of live games like OP does? I only ask because I would like to do something similar and if there is a place better than LV and other than LA I would like to know about it.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:39 PM   #25
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Re: need advice going pro in vegas

What are you so worried about concerning safety? I mean, I guess growing up in Chicago I may have a differ perspective. But, safety would be my last concern, lol.

If I was you Vegas would be my first choice, hands down.
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