Have you ever seen a hand killed for bad behavior - Page 3 - Poker Card Room

<Showdown>
P1: "I have a flush" (or whatever hand)
P2: mucks hand
P1: collects the pot without ever showing his cards to prove he has a flush

This happens every day?

While most players will shoow their hand it is not required and I see players not do so. If you don;t want your opponent to be able to win the pot without showing .... all you have to do is showdown your hand. Either you will win or will see the other hand. Mucking and complaining that you want to see the hand doesn;t make any sense.

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06-14-2017 , 01:02 PM

#52

Playbig2000

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 11,322

Quote:

Originally Posted by psandman

this could open up more angling if the dealer does not ask to see the hand - how can she tell if he's lying about his hand or not? A verbal declaration of a showdown hand should be tabled even after everyone unknowingly mucks.

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06-14-2017 , 01:30 PM

#53

Kelvis

banned

Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 8,737

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playbig2000

Eh no. If the casino doesn't require the winning hand to be shown and everybody mucked the winner should be able to muck. Even after he announced a royal flush on 23458. You don't believe him; show your hand like you were supposed to in the first place.

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06-14-2017 , 01:38 PM

#54

Rawlz517

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 58,240

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playbig2000

Lots of room don't require a hand to be shown to win the pot, however I think sandman is exaggerating when he says it happens everyday. My room is like that but I wouldn't say I saw it everyday. The majority of the time you see it is when a player gets caught bluffing and just mucks allowing his opponent to muck. What you're taking about is a player value betting, getting a call, announcing their hand and having the opponent immediately muck. That is absurdly rare and I don't recall it ever happening.

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06-14-2017 , 04:03 PM

#55

Playbig2000

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 11,322

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelvis

I've seen a dealer pause before pushing the pot until he tables his hand after declaring a particular holding after everyone mucks.

The rule you're referring to is if someone bluffs the river and is called he mucks, the caller doesn't need to show his hand to be awarded the pot in rooms with that rule.

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06-14-2017 , 04:16 PM

#56

Kelvis

banned

Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 8,737

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playbig2000

The dealer can pause all he wants after someone declares a hand but he doesn't need to show if the room doesn't require a hand to be shown to take down a pot. If he declares he has 7 of a kind over a straight he still doesn't need to show.

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06-14-2017 , 04:34 PM

#57

psujohn

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 2,173

I very rarely see V1 declare a hand and V2 muck without seeing it. Maybe once every hundred hours. And even then it's usually followed by V1 at least showing the 1 card.

I see V1 bluff the river, V2 call and V1 muck without showing much more often.

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06-14-2017 , 07:37 PM

#58

psandman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 15,829

Quote:

Originally Posted by RadioActiveEd

Attorney: Objection.... Calls for speculation.
Judge: Sustained.

We don't ask witness to speculate. We expect juries to make determinations of intent. Otherwise you could never convict someone of crime with spefic intent unless they gave an incruminating statement admitting intent.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

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06-14-2017 , 09:21 PM

#59

Reducto

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,773

Quote:

Originally Posted by psujohn

I very rarely see V1 declare a hand and V2 muck without seeing it. Maybe once every hundred hours. And even then it's usually followed by V1 at least showing the 1 card.

It seems to be a regional/stakes issue. There are some games where it's done very frequently, some where you almost never see it.

I've never worked in a room that requires V1 show their hand in that spot.

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06-19-2017 , 03:43 AM

#60

Tomark

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 2,812

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rawlz517

I have won at showdown without showing at least 10 times this year. Its one of two situations: 1) i call a bluff, and they are first to show, and decide to muck, so I never end up showing. 2) checks around on river and V just open mucks their hand.

#1 im normally calling weak, but wouldve won if we had shown. I have won at least one hand (probably at least 2) this year with absolutely nothing in stuation #2. So for the most part you are correct that ive never seen someone call a bet on the river and muck, although my friend has had that happen to him.

Also not quite the same, but I also showed K9 on a QQJJA board 3 way and the other two players mucked

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