You mean after it was proven OP was overpaid? The communication between departments definitely could have been better, but the casino was right as most of us expected.





.

Doesn't seem like anything was "proven" to me.

Seems like there is a possibility OP was overpaid given all those details. Without knowing all those same details about every other transaction that day, impossible toestimate the possibility OP was overpaid.

Never mind, I thought that the same cage supervisor OP phoned with was also the one in the casino that checked the tapes twice (wrongly).

Still, with cashiers basically doing whatever the hell they want I am not quite sure what to think of the procedures in this casino. I would not trust their word when they would ask me for money with these kinds of practices.

It is possible (or even likely) that the cameras caught him counting the money in his hands enough to know how much was there, before he put it on the counter and it folded up.

From my experience, the casino would ask for the money unless they are 100% sure.

I can see why some people would be hesitant with trusting the casino since their not very open, but that's just how it works.

If this is accurate, how do they know you were overpaid? That is beyond screwed up. I find it very hard to believe a cashier did that. Based on the fact that this awesome floor guy went to look at the tape and came back with incorrect info the first time, I don't know what to think. I doubt he even watched the transaction. Still think the casino was probably correct tho.

What evidence would you need to be convinced that the casino made a mistake?

I'd need to see the tape

Just to recap:

1. The cage supervisor claims the over payment occurred at a time when OP wasn't at the casino.

2. The floor man claims the over payment time when OP was at a table and wasn't at the cage.

3. When they finally figure out a time OP was actually at the cage, they admit the cash was not counted by them.

So in the face of these 3 mistakes the casino has already admitted to making, the only thing that would convince you, that the casino made a 4th mistake, is watching the tape yourself?

I just want to make sure I understand that correctly. That short of watching the tape yourself, there is nothing that would convince you the casino made a mistake? Just trying to understand.

They think the customer knew or probably knew and is very likely a threat to do something again unless he makes good. So its like card counters in blackjack.
Wow. I'm guessing that they took so long to contact you because they spent multiple days trying to find the mistake on film and couldn't. Your transaction was probably the only one where there was any question of a doubt.

You trust the Floorperson so that counts for a lot. And maybe it was hard to spot at first but now they are sure...

In general a casino would never sanction trying to recover money that it didn't have evidence to back up. There are many reasons for this but the main one is that if the thief was a casino employee they would want to prevent further theft by firing them. Also, any employee involved in a false review could report them in a fit of honesty and the casino would risk losing its license over a small amount of money.
---------------------
OP, this is a fly by night casino. Their procedures are shoddy. The way they take cash at the cage is incredibly bad. Its hard to believe how bad it is. All management has to do is to go into any other casino in the entire US to see how it should be done. Also, the way they told you about it, getting it wrong in the explanation is completely crazy.

Still this is a classic protect your hand scenario. Glad to see from your post that you are now proactive about making sure the money is counted and how it is counted. It is almost inconceivable to me that they are still making the same procedural errors. I would absolutely go to a senior manager in casino operations and sit down with them and explain how the first error occurred and then explain that cashiers are still not properly trained (that they are not properly counting cash they are being given) and that this thing is likely to keep happening.

In the 10 years I have been going to casinos I have miscounted money I have handed to the cashier twice. Both times they gave me back $100 at the cage. Both times they could have kept it and tried to figure out a way to palm the $100 out of the drawer. I might have figured it out but I doubt I would have.

About a week ago at the Golden Nugget I was playing in a $1,000 entry tournament and after I bought in I looked at all my $100's, calculated all poker transactions that day, and thought I was missing $100. I was sure of it. I had left with a certain number of $100's. I always keep them in the same zipped pocket. The procedure at "the cage" was proper but I wasn't paying attention because I was exhausted (I later fell asleep in a cozy chair and was 30 minutes late to the start of the tournament). I knew the cashier and didn't think she would do anything dishonest but then I'm not really as good at reading people as I think I am. I was getting more and more upset about it when I reached into my loose cash pocket to tip a waitress and pulled out among other bills, a single $100 bill. I still don't know how it got there...

Yesterday at FW a guy sat down at a $100 bounty without his bounty chip. He claims he was never given the black chip. The cashier claims she gave it to him. They went to the tape. The final story was not particularly convincing but the "tape showed" that the chip had fallen on the floor. They found it on the customer side of the cage on the carpet. About half an hour after the transaction.

Anyway, all of this is to say stuff happens all the time. I'm glad you worked it out and learned something from it. The lesson was cheap whether it was $0 or $200. Either way build in safeguards and processes for yourself to minimize the mistakes. And the way you handled yourself throughout this process was with class, dignity, and a good attitude in my opinion. You took some heat in this thread and responded very maturely for what I am assuming is a young man.

You guys are making way too big a deal about the initial reports bearing the wrong time and date.

DEFENDANT: Your Honor, the speeding ticket says I was driving a red 2015 Nissan Maxima with the license plate 123ABC. I present defense Exhibit A, a photo of my automobile. As you can see, it is a red 2015 Nissan Maxima bearing the license plate 723ABC. I motion to dismiss.

JUDGE: GFY.

If the cop says you were speeding on friday the 13th but you were in prison on thursday the 12th through saturday the 14th what happens there? I'm not a lawyer, so i don't know. Just curious.

What is the reasoning for not being able to show the video? I had an issue with an employee of mine and a deposit that came up short at the Bank. The bank happily produced a clear video of the money being counted and it was short. If a bank can show a deposit video why is the casino so special?

Agreed. I'd still contact the PGC if I were there OP and explain that you paid the money back, but you still feel uncomfortable about the situation. Wrong dates, folded money not counted etc. Ask them to review the tapes.

I was making a joke.

So, what evidence would you need to be convinced that the casino made a mistake?

Because despite the fact the casino already admitted to making multiple mistakes:

The casino admitted to not counting the cash at the cage.

I'm just confused.

I agree. I've worked in casinos before and I play regularly in PA - gaming employees don't just walk into the cage. He probably walked up to an enclosed window to speak with a cage supervisor.

Sent from my SM-G930V using 2+2 Forums

COP: He was speeding on Friday the 13. It's on video.

DEFENDANT: I was in jail! 12th through 14th! Check the records!

COP: Oh, I meant the 15th.

DEFENDANT: motion to dismiss!

JUDGE: GFY.

***

EDIT: a clerical error isn't going to torpedo such a strong case. Now if the cop said you were in a red Nissan when you only drive a blue Ford pickup, that's a different story.

A famous prosecutor I admire says evidence isn't a chain, it's a rope. One piece of faulty evidence isn't like a link in a chain, causing the chain to fail--it's more like a strand in a rope. Lose one lousy strand, the rope is just as strong. He also compares it to a mosaic--remove one pebble, the image is still overwhelmingly clear.

Well you snipped out most of my post where I said...


I don't believe the guy actually watched the footage. I do believe someone actually watched the footage on the day that it happened and was sure he was overpaid.

However, if what he told you is true, that your money was never spread out and verified then I would never pay it back and just never play there again. This is just very hard for me to believe since it is standard operating procedure to do this and any cashier knows this is maybe the most important part of their job so it just makes no sense to me.

I guess to answer your question of what evidence I need to believe the casino actually made a mistake... I would need to see the tape for that. As much of a joke as it was it is also the truth. Nothing that some floor guy said or cashier said is going to make me believe they are lying. I need to see it with my own eyes.

They believe you were overpaid. They will not let you play until you pay them back. If they are wrong, there is no way to ever prove it short of taking them to court and subpoena the video. It sucks, but that is how it works.

Incredibly ballsy attempt at passing this terrible analogy by us when you know he's just going to respond with a proper one. You basically set yourself up to be spiked on

So if he wasn't driving on the 15th what happens then? Cop gets to change the date until he figures out a time he actually drove? Because the Casino gave OP 2 incorrect dates.

Clerical errors do not invalidate a speeding ticket. If you are not from the US, you should disclose that, as this is not some esoteric **** that requires a law degree or a passing of the Bar exam to understand. It's extremely basic.

I'm asking. I'm sorry I don't know. I'm not as smart as you forgive me for being stupid.

People are telling you what's up. A "famous prosecutor" was cited

The answer to your question is "yes". It's not a stupid/smart thing. You have your answer.

Gotcha, I think I side with you here. Probably was spread out and counted (and cashier had brain fart) and the guy never watched. Seems most likely. You have swayed me.