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07-14-2017 , 08:35 PM
#1
Dr. Meh
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What's up with this? I've been noticing it for a couple years and I don't know why so many people are suddenly doing the across the body shoulder grab when they're in a hand. People claim it's just comfortable but it all suddenly happened at once. Am I missing something? Just the new trendy thing to do?
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07-14-2017 , 08:54 PM
#2
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You're just noticing it more.. like when you start car shopping for a particular model, now you start seeing that model on the road a lot more
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07-15-2017 , 12:10 AM
#3
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I clicked bec I had absolutely NO idea what the heck the title is about and now I know. I never see it in my limit games so I guess it must be NL.
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07-15-2017 , 12:46 AM
#4
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Some would argue that it is a tell indicating a defensive posture, which means the players is weak or stressed (arms across of the core are typically protective)

Others would argue that it is just a nice way to stretch your shoulders without invading other peoples space.

I think the latter is more accurate
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07-15-2017 , 01:03 AM
#5
Dr. Meh
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I know it can be thought of as a defense mechanism similar to standing behind a podium when giving a speech. It makes you feel less vulnerable. That's the theory I'm leaning towards and can't help but wonder if it's seemingly more popular now among the Internet guys who might be a little uncomfortable playing live still. Just odd that it seems to be the thing to do now. Also odd if it's more prevalent in NL than limit.
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07-15-2017 , 01:16 AM
#6
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I never see it in limit, like never, ever.
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07-15-2017 , 01:31 AM
#7
Guito
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Beale
I never see it in limit, like never, ever.
I have dealt limit (nearly) 100% of the time for 15 years and can confirm never seen it. Asked co-workers and not a single one had ever heard of it.

#notathing
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07-15-2017 , 02:45 AM
#8
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It seems to be a tournament poker thing. Everyone was suddenly doing it a few years ago, not so much now. I remember Norman Chad making fun of it on one of the WSOP final table broadcasts. One theory I've heard is that they do it so they can cover their neck to hide their pulse but I suspect they just picked it up from another player and don't even realize they're doing it.

As a dealer I really miss it. It kept elbows out of my side and arms off the felt.
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07-15-2017 , 06:23 AM
#9
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There was an EPT webcast that noted it and the idea was it limits tells somehow. I do it but my -roi has not improved at all.
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07-15-2017 , 07:25 AM
#10
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I saw an image on twitter about a year ago about the shoulder grab. It was two images side by side of two innocuous looking younger male players. One had the shoulder-grab and one was just sitting there normally with elbows on the table. The caption for each was "Professional", "Regular ass poker player"
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07-15-2017 , 10:57 AM
#11
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This never happens in limit games. I researched it for a while online and found nothing. Definitely an NL thing.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
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07-15-2017 , 11:04 AM
#12
Kelvis
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I do this when I want to lean a bit forward but not lean on both shoulders, for obvious reasons. That arm you don't need restricts movement and is of no use so I just put it somewhere.

Seems some people agree or think it looks cool or whatever. Don't really care.
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07-15-2017 , 03:58 PM
#13
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Some people have blatant tells re: heavy breathing and/or neck pulsing. So it's perhaps a smart defense mechanism. If I see it on someone, I presume they at least think about physical tells.

Too bad it's never used in limit. I'm sure the 88 year olds who play limit could use some yoga/stretching in their daily routine. Also more fiber.
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07-15-2017 , 05:34 PM
#14
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Tom "Durrrr" Dwan would do this. It's an homage to him (copy-cat thing.)
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07-15-2017 , 05:54 PM
#15
Bob148
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Like Rodney dangerfield grabbing his tie "huh."
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07-15-2017 , 08:02 PM
#16
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it's pretty much the same reason people are wearing sunglasses in 1/2. They saw the pro's do it on TV.

When you're sitting at a feature table, there is nowhere to rest your arms because the rail is raised up. So players rest their hand on their shoulder instead. So everyone who sees them do it on TV wants to look and act like a pro so they do it too.
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07-16-2017 , 07:54 AM
#17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Playbig2000
it's pretty much the same reason people are wearing sunglasses in 1/2. They saw the pro's do it on TV.

When you're sitting at a feature table, there is nowhere to rest your arms because the rail is raised up. So players rest their hand on their shoulder instead. So everyone who sees them do it on TV wants to look and act like a pro so they do it too.
Maybe some other reasons, BUT lots of this reason certainly.
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07-17-2017 , 12:48 AM
#18
jonovan
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I hate seeing this, too, and then realized I do it a lot. For me, it's just the most comfortable way to sit when I'm squished in by players on both sides of me without having my hands together in front of me on the table (which can make people think I have cards I'm covering with my hands, thus slowing down the action). I don't do it when I have more space to the sides, though. So if I'm squished, I try to just sit back instead because I think it looks like a douchey poker pro stance.
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07-17-2017 , 04:21 AM
#19
mbrothers22
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It probably started as a tell or something along those lines and then people realized it's pretty comfortable compared to wedding both elbows on the table. I get pretty bad poker elbow and it helps.
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07-17-2017 , 04:57 AM
#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonovan
For me, it's just the most comfortable way to sit
Why be ashamed? If it's the most comfortable AND allows your neighbors the most space then what's the problem?
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07-17-2017 , 08:57 AM
#21
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I really don't care one way or another how people sit but there are people who check by tapping their shoulder as well. Is it too much effort to tap the felt?
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07-17-2017 , 10:54 AM
#22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Playbig2000
I really don't care one way or another how people sit but there are people who check by tapping their shoulder as well. Is it too much effort to tap the felt?
By minimizing your body movement, you increase your EV by decreasing the number of muscle groups that could betray a tell. I can't tell you the number of soul reads I have made based on the way a player moved his hand to the felt. Also, the number of fingers, number of taps on the felt, and the strength of the tap on the felt practically turns your cards face up. That is why I not only check with the shoulder tap, I do it with one tap, using just one finger, and only raise my finger a specific 2 cm to do it. Anything else is just giving away money.
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07-17-2017 , 09:33 PM
#23
Dr. Meh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpewingIsMyMove
By minimizing your body movement, you increase your EV by decreasing the number of muscle groups that could betray a tell. I can't tell you the number of soul reads I have made based on the way a player moved his hand to the felt. Also, the number of fingers, number of taps on the felt, and the strength of the tap on the felt practically turns your cards face up. That is why I not only check with the shoulder tap, I do it with one tap, using just one finger, and only raise my finger a specific 2 cm to do it. Anything else is just giving away money.
I'm sure the dealers love that.
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07-17-2017 , 09:41 PM
#24
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Spew might not be totally serious here Dr Meh. Just a hunch!
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07-17-2017 , 10:02 PM
#25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bene Gesserit
Spew might not be totally serious here Dr Meh. Just a hunch!
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