Tipping CONTAINMENT thread.

[bolt2112]

Originally Posted by z4reio

If you push a $1 tipping tag reg 5 pots every down you deal to him, then you'll get your $40 every 3-5 days, year round. As is, you ran just as good as the player did. Hell, during the weekday afternoons, nearly all of your pots are being pushed to tag regs, no?

How many winners are you pushing to Euros who tip $8 per hand Tuesday at 1pm in Florida? Without your "$1 tipping regs" starting games for your room, you wouldn't have any Euro players in the game tossing you $8 tips.

How in the world am I going to push a TAG player 5 pots in a down on a regular basis? Like most experienced dealers I'm averaging about 17-18 hands per 30 minute down. The Euro player was at a 5-10 table where the pots are larger, the decisions take longer, and my rate probably goes down to 15 or 16 hands per down. At a 10 seated table, a TAG player is going to win less than 10% of the hands.

So I'm going to stick with my initial estimate of a couple or three months to get $40 out of him. Especially when you consider that sometimes the rotation just won't ever send me to this TAG's table.

Honestly, I don't see the logic at all on this one. Usually I see the logic but I just don't always agree with it. But c'mon. Give me a choice between pushing a pot to a big tipper or a small to average tipper and it's a no-brainer. I'll take the big tipper every time. And I challenge anyone to find a single dealer who would disagree with me on this one.

[AEPpoker]

Originally Posted by bolt2112

Honestly, I don't see the logic at all on this one. Usually I see the logic but I just don't always agree with it. But c'mon. Give me a choice between pushing a pot to a big tipper or a small to average tipper and it's a no-brainer. I'll take the big tipper every time. And I challenge anyone to find a single dealer who would disagree with me on this one.

Every time right up until all the regs go broke and youre sitting a dead spread or running chips 3 downs out of 4 because the room doesnt have a core of players to get a game started.

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by bolt2112

How in the world am I going to push a TAG player 5 pots in a down on a regular basis? Like most experienced dealers I'm averaging about 17-18 hands per 30 minute down. The Euro player was at a 5-10 table where the pots are larger, the decisions take longer, and my rate probably goes down to 15 or 16 hands per down. At a 10 seated table, a TAG player is going to win less than 10% of the hands.

So I'm going to stick with my initial estimate of a couple or three months to get $40 out of him. Especially when you consider that sometimes the rotation just won't ever send me to this TAG's table.

Honestly, I don't see the logic at all on this one. Usually I see the logic but I just don't always agree with it. But c'mon. Give me a choice between pushing a pot to a big tipper or a small to average tipper and it's a no-brainer. I'll take the big tipper every time. And I challenge anyone to find a single dealer who would disagree with me on this one.

It's simple. You used a statistical outlier to make a point, and I did the same to show you how silly your point was. How often do you push 33% of the hands you deal per down to an $8 tipping Euro?

You said 8>1 so give me the $8, LDO. Well, 8>0 as well, and if this were the case, you'd see yourself looking for another job after a year of that.

If you were to look at exactly where all that tip money you make comes from at the end of the year, you'll see that the vast majority of it comes from cheap $1 tipping regs and not $8 tipping Euros on vacation throwing money away.

[bolt2112]

Originally Posted by z4reio

It's simple. You used a statistical outlier to make a point, and I did the same to show you how silly your point was. How often do you push 33% of the hands you deal per down to an $8 tipping Euro?

You said 8>1 so give me the $8, LDO. Well, 8>0 as well, and if this were the case, you'd see yourself looking for another job after a year of that.

If you were to look at exactly where all that tip money you make comes from at the end of the year, you'll see that the vast majority of it comes from cheap $1 tipping regs and not $8 tipping Euros on vacation throwing money away.

Wait, did you just change the discussion on me? See all along, I thought the discussion was: Would a dealer rather receive an $8 tip or a $1 tip for a single hand of poker?

Now I see that it's changed to: At the end of the year would a dealer rather keep all of his $8 tips or all of his $1 tips?

Is this one of those strawman thingy's?

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by bolt2112

Wait, did you just change the discussion on me? See all along, I thought the discussion was: Would a dealer rather receive an $8 tip or a $1 tip for a single hand of poker?

Now I see that it's changed to: At the end of the year would a dealer rather keep all of his $8 tips or all of his $1 tips?

Is this one of those strawman thingy's?

Well, to be honest, I didn't really expect you to understand any of it, but I stated the obvious nonetheless.

I'm unsure how I can explain it to you without Rapini giving me another ban, so I'll just bow out now - my euphemistic language is quite limited, so we'll just stick with $8 being better than $1.

[AngusThermopyle]

I do not care if the dealer is disappointed, overjoyed, or neutral about my tip. I do not care what he thinks. I tip what I think is right.

Given that, what do I expect?

1. Acknowledgement of the tip. That is simple courtesy. Someone just gave him some money. "Thank you", a nod, etc. If he misses it once or twice, I don't freak out. Everybody has off days, etc. If it is a pattern, especially if it is a pattern linked to the size of the tip, then I might change my tipping toward that dealer.

2. Don't roll your eyes or look at the $1 chip like it was a turd. Players notice things like that, and the next time they think of tipping $2 or $3 they will remember "the look" and just give $1.

3. Don't complain about the tips while you are in the box or about to push. So you got a "measly $5 for pushing Big Jim a $20K pot". Very unprofessional. The little old lady in Seat 4 might give you sympathy, but the rest of the table will note it and remember.

4. Don't play games by short pitching the cards to the non-tipper or by shoving the pot half way (or almost into his lap). Again, the other players notice and your tips will suffer.

5. Don't openly root for the big tipping tourist. He will be gone tomorrow. But the 8 other players at the table will be there, and will remember. Looking at the tourist and saying "If there is anyway I could have pushed you the pot, I would have" does not sit well with the regs.

6. 1-5 can be summed up by: be professional.

[NYCNative]

Originally Posted by z4reio

Well, to be honest, I didn't really expect you to understand any of it, but I stated the obvious nonetheless.

To be honest, your premise is kinda silly. Your theory is based on the premise that the reg is suddenly going to go away. Hell, AEPpoker imagines a time when poker rooms are empty all because the tourists did, what exactly? Take all the money from the regs? Drive them into retirement? Bankrupt them?

Regs don't go away. That's why they are regs.

Oh sure, some of them move away (and become regs elsewhere).... Some of them realize they are losing players and stop playing as much or entirely... Some of them have changing life issues which stop them from coming out even if they would like to - say, health issues or money problems.

But is a reg going to stop coming because a tourist won a pot against him? That's really what you're hanging your hat on?

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by NYCNative

To be honest, your premise is kinda silly. Your theory is based on the premise that the reg is suddenly going to go away. Hell, AEPpoker imagines a time when poker rooms are empty all because the tourists did, what exactly? Take all the money from the regs? Drive them into retirement? Bankrupt them?

Regs don't go away. That's why they are regs.

Oh sure, some of them move away (and become regs elsewhere).... Some of them realize they are losing players and stop playing as much or entirely... Some of them have changing life issues which stop them from coming out even if they would like to - say, health issues or money problems.

But is a reg going to stop coming because a tourist won a pot against him? That's really what you're hanging your hat on?

How many years have you been dealing? I've been playing for over 20 years, and I can say that rooms have been making *at least* double over the last 10 years and even more over the last 5 years. Have you been in the box that long to even notice the difference?

[steamraise]

Originally Posted by z4reio

How many years have you been dealing? I've been playing for over 20 years, and I can say that rooms have been making *at least* double over the last 10 years and even more over the last 5 years. Have you been in the box that long to even notice the difference?

I've been dealing for 20 and playing for 40.

I don't have a clue what you're saying here.
What difference am I supposed to notice?

Originally Posted by AngusThermopyle

I do not care if the dealer is disappointed, overjoyed, or neutral about my tip. I do not care what he thinks. I tip what I think is right.

Given that, what do I expect?

1. Acknowledgement of the tip. That is simple courtesy. Someone just gave him some money. "Thank you", a nod, etc. If he misses it once or twice, I don't freak out. Everybody has off days, etc. If it is a pattern, especially if it is a pattern linked to the size of the tip, then I might change my tipping toward that dealer.

2. Don't roll your eyes or look at the $1 chip like it was a turd. Players notice things like that, and the next time they think of tipping $2 or $3 they will remember "the look" and just give $1.

3. Don't complain about the tips while you are in the box or about to push. So you got a "measly $5 for pushing Big Jim a $20K pot". Very unprofessional. The little old lady in Seat 4 might give you sympathy, but the rest of the table will note it and remember.

4. Don't play games by short pitching the cards to the non-tipper or by shoving the pot half way (or almost into his lap). Again, the other players notice and your tips will suffer.

5. Don't openly root for the big tipping tourist. He will be gone tomorrow. But the 8 other players at the table will be there, and will remember. Looking at the tourist and saying "If there is anyway I could have pushed you the pot, I would have" does not sit well with the regs.

6. 1-5 can be summed up by: be professional.

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by steamraise

I've been dealing for 20 and playing for 40.

I don't have a clue what you're saying here.
What difference am I supposed to notice?

The rake.

[steamraise]

Originally Posted by z4reio

The rake.

Same now as when I started 20 years ago. 10%, $3 max.

Jackpot drop has gone from $1 to $2.

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by NYCNative

To be honest, your premise is kinda silly. Your theory is based on the premise that the reg is suddenly going to go away. Hell, AEPpoker imagines a time when poker rooms are empty all because the tourists did, what exactly? Take all the money from the regs? Drive them into retirement? Bankrupt them?

Regs don't go away. That's why they are regs.

Oh sure, some of them move away (and become regs elsewhere).... Some of them realize they are losing players and stop playing as much or entirely... Some of them have changing life issues which stop them from coming out even if they would like to - say, health issues or money problems.

So basically what you're saying is the $1 tipping regs are the lifeblood for your tips, not the atypical $8 tipper, but you disregard their importance and take them for granted? Yeah, you've covered that ad nauseam already.

Originally Posted by NYCNative

But is a reg going to stop coming because a tourist won a pot against him? That's really what you're hanging your hat on?

Not sure how you could construe this from anything I said.

[z4reio]

Originally Posted by steamraise

Same now as when I started 20 years ago. 10%, $3 max.

Jackpot drop has gone from $1 to $2.

You deal on a boat or something? That is quite the exception.

[fuluck414]

Originally Posted by z4reio

You deal on a boat or something? That is quite the exception.

Where do you play? This is how it is in the room I deal in, along with every other room in Washington state

[NYCNative]

The rake is pretty much capped at $3-5 almost everywhere with a lot of rooms dropping one or two bucks for a jackpot or other player promotions.

How does this correlate to your odd theory again?