Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > General Poker Discussion > Brick and Mortar

Brick and Mortar Discussions of brick and mortar gambling venues

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-22-2010, 01:24 PM   #1
enthusiast
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Heaven
Posts: 88
Half Bet Rule in Limit

I've read Robert's Rules of Poker. A colleague and I disagree on when the half bet rule is applicable. The wording in RRoP is a little ambiguous. Answers to the following will end the debate. The questions may be basic, but I'd appreciate any help. Thank you.

10/20 limit hold em on the turn.

Scenario 1

Player A bets 20,
Player B goes all in for 25.
What are player C's options?

Scenario 2

Player A bets 20,
Player B goes all in for 35.
What are player C's options?
RadGrad2005 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 01:31 PM   #2
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: I've been all over. Now Seattle.
Posts: 11,501
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

1: C may fold, call, or complete the bet to $40.

2: C may fold, call, or raise to $55.
AKQJ10 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 01:46 PM   #3
journeyman
 
Aj Brock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Macau
Posts: 220
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

1:C may fold, call, or raise to 45
2:C may fold, call, or raise to 55

The half bet limit rule only applies to reopening the betting.


Scenario 1:

A bets 20
B raises all in to 25
c calls then A can only call not reraise

Scenario 2:

A bets 20
B raises all in to 35
c calls
A can now reraise

That is what the half bet limit rule is used for
Aj Brock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 01:55 PM   #4
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: I've been all over. Now Seattle.
Posts: 11,501
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerroomdude View Post
1:C may fold, call, or raise to 45
Isn't it standard to only allow the next raiser to complete the bet (when the preceding bet was less than half)? Or do they just misapply this rule in the Tunica Horseshoe $4/8 game?
AKQJ10 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 02:00 PM   #5
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Rick Nebiolo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: East of Eden
Posts: 8,690
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerroomdude View Post
1:C may fold, call, or raise to 45
2:C may fold, call, or raise to 55

The half bet limit rule only applies to reopening the betting.
This isn't quite right. In limit bets less than half a full bet are "action only". If someone who hasn't acted on the previous full bet or raise has yet to act he raises to the normal 40 (or simply fold or call the "action only amount").

Quote:
Scenario 1:

A bets 20
B raises all in to 25
c calls then A can only call not reraise
This part is correct (except A can make an unlikely fold)

Quote:
Scenario 2:

A bets 20
B raises all in to 35
c calls
A can now reraise
This is also correct. B's raise is more than half so it reopens the betting for the initial raiser.

I had some other examples partially written but need to get ready for an appointment. Might try to post later.
Rick Nebiolo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 02:20 PM   #6
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Rick Nebiolo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: East of Eden
Posts: 8,690
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by AKQJ10 View Post
Isn't it standard to only allow the next raiser to complete the bet (when the preceding bet was less than half)? Or do they just misapply this rule in the Tunica Horseshoe $4/8 game?
It's standard in LA and AFAIK in Las Vegas/Foxwoods. It's possible some rooms do it differently or a particular dealer/floor gets it wrong. Sort of forgivable in that it's one of the most poorly worded rules in poker.
Rick Nebiolo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 02:54 PM   #7
veteran
 
KenoVictoryLap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Planning a trip
Posts: 3,295
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

6/12 LHE game.

A bets the flop, gets called by B and then C goes all in for a total of $7 (call of A's bet of $6 plus $1). What are A's options?

At the time, A (me) was told I could only call. That seemed wrong.
KenoVictoryLap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 03:07 PM   #8
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: I've been all over. Now Seattle.
Posts: 11,501
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

That's correct. C didn't reopen the betting because he didn't "raise" in the reopening sense, i.e. > 1/2 the bet.

The idea is that it protects B because otherwise you're essentially raising yourself (with only a relatively insignificant $1 of action in between).
AKQJ10 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 03:23 PM   #9
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,952
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by David2+2 View Post
6/12 LHE game.

A bets the flop, gets called by B and then C goes all in for a total of $7 (call of A's bet of $6 plus $1). What are A's options?

At the time, A (me) was told I could only call. That seemed wrong.
you can fold. but no, you cannot raise anywhere the halfbet rule is in place.
lolmitHE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 03:49 PM   #10
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Land of the Free
Posts: 291
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by AKQJ10 View Post
1: C may fold, call, or complete the bet to $40.

2: C may fold, call, or raise to $55.
This is correct
Chubrock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 04:33 PM   #11
Pooh-Bah
 
steamraise's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: out of position
Posts: 5,397
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by David2+2 View Post
6/12 LHE game.

A bets the flop, gets called by B and then C goes all in for a total of $7 (call of A's bet of $6 plus $1). What are A's options?
You can call the $1 or fold.
steamraise is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 05:12 PM   #12
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: I've been all over. Now Seattle.
Posts: 11,501
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Good point, I didn't even think about the option of folding getting 37:1. I'm probably not trying hard enough to think of unlikely cases.
AKQJ10 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 05:18 PM   #13
adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 801
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Nebiolo View Post
Sort of forgivable in that it's one of the most poorly worded rules in poker.
Really.

In my local room I kept getting this ruling from certain floor persons.

(2/4 game on the turn)

Player A bets $1 all in.
Player B then must either call $4 or raise to $8.

Yeah... B can't just call the $1.

I managed to disabuse some of the floor as to this, but I imagine it lives on as I don't play that game much anymore.
Elbow Jobertski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 05:30 PM   #14
veteran
 
KenoVictoryLap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Planning a trip
Posts: 3,295
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by lolmitHE View Post
you can fold. but no, you cannot raise anywhere the halfbet rule is in place.
Ok, that makes sense. What if it goes:

A bets $6, B raises to $12, C is all in for $13.

Can I make it $18?
KenoVictoryLap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 05:36 PM   #15
I are smart
 
Lattimer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: New England
Posts: 5,984
Re: Half Bet Rule in Limit

Quote:
Originally Posted by David2+2 View Post
Ok, that makes sense. What if it goes:

A bets $6, B raises to $12, C is all in for $13.

Can I make it $18?
Yup. Action was re-opened by B's full raise.
Lattimer is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive