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"Checking out" (folding when there is no bet) "Checking out" (folding when there is no bet)

12-15-2011 , 04:22 PM
Is there a rule to folding when it's your turn and no bet is made? I had a hand today at a local casino where I was playing for the high hand promotion and the villain bet $25, I called and he mucked before the river the card was dealt, therefore I was not given a chance to see the river card and win a chance at high hand. I was furious obviously and probably overreacted.
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12-15-2011 , 04:31 PM
No rule; HU, he can open muck at any time.
Yes, you overreacted after being denied your chance at a 44:1 draw.
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12-15-2011 , 04:39 PM
This is from the TDA, which governs tournaments rather than cash play, but here's what it has to say:
45: Non-Standard Folds
Anytime before the end of the last betting round of a hand, folding in turn when facing a check or folding out of turn are both binding folds and may be subject to penalty.
I couldn't find mention in Robert's, which covers the standard rules for cash play.

Regardless, it's poor etiquette. Unfortunately there's not much you can do about it. The guy who's annoyed you picked off his bluff doesn't really care that you lost a chance at more money. If anything, he's happy you're angry. Best to just let it go. The odds are that you wouldn't have made the hand anyway.
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12-15-2011 , 05:19 PM
I despise checking out for reasons other than what happened to the OP.

If there are 3 people left after the flop and the first person checks and the second person checks out that changes the entire dynamic of the hand for the person who is last to act.

It's also a stupid thing to do for the person doing it. I saw a hand once where there was 1 limper pre flop.

The flop was 3-5-high card (I don't remember the rest of the board, but it's irrelevant to the story.)

BB checks... limper bets... BB calls

After the turn

BB checks.... limper bets ... BB calls

After the river

BB checks, limper mucks

BB starts laughing and says "I was on a straight draw and ended up with the nut low. Thanks for the pot." and flips over 2-4.
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12-15-2011 , 05:26 PM
It's poor etiquette. So is looking like you're going to fold before someone is done acting (like they're counting out chips). You potentially change the course of action (someone's bet-sizing may differ if they know you are folding). Of course, I see this all the time and people never learn. I don't know what is so hard about acting in turn and following the rules.
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12-15-2011 , 05:28 PM
If you're going to play for bonuses you have to endure the consequenses that come with it. I personally dont have a problem with checking out, It's a minor evil among many.
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12-15-2011 , 05:44 PM
Anyone who folds when there is no bet is either an idiot or a cheater.
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12-15-2011 , 08:09 PM
I'm finding it difficult to think of a situation where you have 0 outs to tie against an unknown hand. Perhaps the other player has your exact hand. Sometimes everybody plays the board.
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12-15-2011 , 08:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRunkle
No rule; HU, he can open muck at any time.
Yes, you overreacted after being denied your chance at a 44:1 draw.
He did not say it was a quads promotion. He may have had ten outs.

If the opponent bet the turn and you called and he mucked, I would have asked the Dealer to put out the river. The Dealer should have.
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12-15-2011 , 08:48 PM
That's not unreasonable, although I don't know official cardroom policy. After all, in Stud, if you fold to no bet, you keep getting cards.
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12-15-2011 , 09:42 PM
That sucks but at least you got the pot with only a draw. Sometimes it's better not to see a river and hopefully you didn't rabbit hunt in this case because it would only put you on tilt if you would have hit.
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12-15-2011 , 09:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy Whiz
He did not say it was a quads promotion. He may have had ten outs.

If the opponent bet the turn and you called and he mucked, I would have asked the Dealer to put out the river. The Dealer should have.
Aces full is need to qualify, and at the time I had 7s full of aces. I need a 7 for quads or an ace for the aces full. I asked the dealer to put the river out and she was like a deer in headlights. Eventually she called the floor and he ruled against me. I know its a longshot for me to hit it, but that's not the point.
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12-15-2011 , 09:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrducks
That sucks but at least you got the pot with only a draw. Sometimes it's better not to see a river and hopefully you didn't rabbit hunt in this case because it would only put you on tilt if you would have hit.
I already had a made hand that I was not scared of losing. They didn't rabbit hunt and I was on tilt anyway so I got up right away and left.
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12-16-2011 , 12:12 AM
I know a couple people who do this so when they do it to me HU I look at the dealer and say "I check", this usually garners a chuckle

It's amazing how some players love to narrow their ranges for you for absolutely no reason.
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12-16-2011 , 01:20 AM
Unfortunately it is allowed in most rooms as stated earlier it shouldnt be allowed because it can effect the action..... the 3 handed scenario talked about before... 1st player checks, 2nd player checks out, third player now has free information that 1st did not. player three now knows that he cant be check raised by player 2 and only has 1 opponent instead of 2. I have only seen 1 card room in the country that does not allow you to check out, Canterbury Park in Minnesota. A rule that others should adopt!
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12-16-2011 , 02:21 AM
Never heard someone complain about winning a heads-up hand when his opponent checked out. And I don't see it as poor etiquette at all. It's heads-up! Who is the guy hurting? Checking out in a multi-way pot can matter, but heads-up?

OP just happened to hit that one in a thousand case where he really DID want to see the river. And that was caused by the idiotic HHJ. I blame the HHJ for this, not the player who gave up on his bluff. I'm not ready to propose a new cash game rule that when heads-up playing a cash game, you may not check out. I WANT my opponents to do this. PLEASE, fold as soon as I call your bluff on the turn before you hit a river that pairs you or hits that inside straight you didn't notice you had! Pretty please?!
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12-16-2011 , 02:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCJ001
Anyone who folds when there is no bet is either an idiot or a cheater.
I'm glad you know so much about everything, but I've done it before, and I'm not cheating.

If I'm holding 65s and the flop comes AJTs (but not my suit), there are cards that could come that might make me interested in my hand, but I figure there's no way 6 high is winning AND I don't want to see a card that might make me think I've got something worth playing. It's like a poker chastity belt -- to make sure I don't get um, laid.
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12-16-2011 , 03:14 AM
When a player does this, use that knowledge to your advantage and just cbet 100% of the time against him/her.
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12-16-2011 , 06:45 AM
I'll check out if need be on the flop in early position in a limped pot and on the turn in a limp pot where the flop is checked around.
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12-16-2011 , 12:13 PM
i wish more people checked out, speeds up the game
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12-16-2011 , 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shootpool
I have only seen 1 card room in the country that does not allow you to check out, Canterbury Park in Minnesota. A rule that others should adopt!
Both Mohegan Sun poker rooms have this rule, too.
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12-16-2011 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfapfap
That's not unreasonable, although I don't know official cardroom policy. After all, in Stud, if you fold to no bet, you keep getting cards.
Is that a RROP rule? Interesting,
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12-16-2011 , 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pork Fri Rize
When a player does this, use that knowledge to your advantage and just cbet 100% of the time against him/her.
If they do it too often you might not want to employ this strategy, ducy?
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12-16-2011 , 02:21 PM
If it's heads up, I really don't know what the big deal is. In a multi-way pot, if it's your turn to act and you check out, it does change the dynamics, so it's definitely poor etiquette. I personally only "check out" when everyone checks through, it's 5 people to showdown, and I have 6 high. I just go ahead and muck and not table my hand.
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12-16-2011 , 03:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onchan
Is that a RROP rule? Interesting,
Yes, it's is listed with the Stud rules in RROP.

Also in RROP is the rule that you shouldn't check-out.
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