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| Psychology Discussions of psychology as applied to poker and other gambling games. |
06-20-2009, 01:44 AM
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#1
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enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 80
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Bankroll übernit
I admit it, I'm a bankroll nit. I play with over 100 buyins at NL50, and I just can't seem to move up without the constant fear of losing my bankroll if I run bad. I guess it's somewhat better than being overaggressive and taking shots while heavily underolled, but I just feel like being such a nit really stunts my growth as a poker player.
I've taken various shots at NL100 with mixed results, but I can't seem to get used to the relatively large sums of money on the table.
I think the problem mostly comes from the fact that, because I'm a broke student, $100 is a LOT of money to me. At the same time, I know I'll never have any success in poker if I just can't break that psychological barrier.
Any advice on how to change that mindset. I know I should just 'think of it as 100BB, no matter what the stakes are', but that's easier said than done. How do you overcome that stupid nitty thinking?
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06-20-2009, 05:50 AM
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#2
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adept
Join Date: May 2007
Location: eating humble ***** pie
Posts: 1,086
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Re: Bankroll übernit
if you think your bad..i have over 400 buyins for nl200 and still a pussy about moving up
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06-20-2009, 03:28 PM
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#3
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adept
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 981
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khyrostenes
I think the problem mostly comes from the fact that, because I'm a broke student, $100 is a LOT of money to me.
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If you have a $5,000 bankroll to play cards with, then $100 represents 2% of this. Pretty immaterial, imo.
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06-20-2009, 04:26 PM
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#4
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: R.I.P. ItzPenzoo 12-09-11
Posts: 7,736
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Re: Bankroll übernit
$100 is a lot of money to you yet you have $5,000 online? Doesn't compute
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06-20-2009, 04:38 PM
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#5
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journeyman
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: earth
Posts: 299
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Re: Bankroll übernit
It's ok. I play 22's and 33's reg sit and go's and have 500 buy-in's for the 22's. I was planning on moving to the 55's but I just got suspended or fired from my job. I 10 table without using tracking software/hud or a training site. I think I'll move up once I purchase these things.
Have you ever gone broke? I've gone broke twice before I came to terms with the fact that I'm only good at sit and go's and that I have to be comfortable w/ the stakes so I started at the 5.5s, played 1000, 11's played 1000 ect. I find I only play my "A" game if I'm comfortable with the level.
You should take shots. Be willing to lose 10-50% of your bankroll (what ever percentage you're comfortable with) and If you loose that percentage playing nl100, move back down, grind the money you lost back up, repeat 'till you can win.
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06-20-2009, 04:49 PM
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#6
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enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 80
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craggoo
$100 is a lot of money to you yet you have $5,000 online? Doesn't compute
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I never deposited more than $200 bucks to begin with. I grinded it up to $5,000, but I never cashed out until recently so $100 is still a lot to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by catheterchri
It's ok. I play 22's and 33's reg sit and go's and have 500 buy-in's for the 22's. I was planning on moving to the 55's but I just got suspended or fired from my job. I 10 table without using tracking software/hud or a training site. I think I'll move up once I purchase these things.
Have you ever gone broke? I've gone broke twice before I came to terms with the fact that I'm only good at sit and go's and that I have to be comfortable w/ the stakes so I started at the 5.5s, played 1000, 11's played 1000 ect. I find I only play my "A" game if I'm comfortable with the level.
You should take shots. Be willing to lose 10-50% of your bankroll (what ever percentage you're comfortable with) and If you loose that percentage playing nl100, move back down, grind the money you lost back up, repeat 'till you can win.
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The only time I went broke is with my very first $100 deposit. The problem is, I don't feel comfortable losing any percentage of my bankroll (even 5% seems like a ton of cash).
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06-20-2009, 05:00 PM
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#7
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centurion
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 164
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Re: Bankroll übernit
just move up
when i moved up the last time i also had 130 buy ins
the first few hundred hands i was definitely on scared money but after that i started feeling comfortable.
btw: if u are broke , even 50 bucks is a lot of money
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06-20-2009, 05:22 PM
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#8
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enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 80
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Quote:
Originally Posted by bambam_jr
btw: if u are broke , even 50 bucks is a lot of money
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True. But I'm somehow comfortable with the swings at NL50. I guess I just have to get used to the bigger amounts at NL100...
When would you move back down to NL50? How many buyins should I take a shot with?
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06-20-2009, 06:36 PM
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#9
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journeyman
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: earth
Posts: 299
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Re: Bankroll übernit
So YOu have 5k? I would say to myself that I'm willing to risk 20 buy-ins before I move back down to 50nl. If I lose, grind back up, rinse and repeat till I win at that level.
If you can beat 50nl, you should have what it takes to beat 100nl. have confidence in yourself. If not you'll be stuck in 50nl for the rest of your life, not like that's a bad thing.
One thing that's helped me is having a outside job. Even part time min wage atlest you know you'll have steady income. That helps me alot metally 'cause when I'm unemployed no matter how good I "think" I play I usually loose. like I just got suspended/possibly fired this thursday, played 16 sngs and lost all except one, cashing for second place.
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06-20-2009, 08:40 PM
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#10
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journeyman
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Partying
Posts: 201
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Re: Bankroll übernit
I don't get what your problem is. You're successfully winning at the stakes you play now. You are super-rolled for the stakes you play now, and sufficiently rolled for a level or two above you. Your worried about playing the higher stakes. Here's what i'd do.
Cash out a large enough percentage of your bankroll so you're well rolled for your current level but not enough to play the level above you. This will put money in your pocket and in a way 'legitimize' your poker playing (i bought this **** from money i made clickin buttons!). You will then just keep playing your current level and improving. Anyone can go on heaters, so building a big roll and then moving up when you've got funds may not be the best way to go about things. If money is the issue, cash out and put money in your pocket. If you play with over 100 bi's cash out 60 bi's that's 3k, which i know means a lot to a broke student. And you'll have at least 40 bi's at your current level. I actually think thats a good standard way to go about moving up. Play a level, dizominate, build the roll, cash out a bunch, rebuild the roll, move up/cash out depending on how poker/life is going. It's a long long game bro, if i had been more fearful in my past playing i'd be a level above where i am if not two, guaranteed. Also, being able to enjoy the money you've made from poker is important imo. hope this helps, but you're on the right track.
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06-21-2009, 01:12 AM
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#11
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banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Coming from where u won't believe.
Posts: 4,102
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Move up during the course of a session, having started in the comfy zone to get your legs under you.
Also, though it's anathema to some, you could also set a loss limit only moderately higher in the bigger game than you generally adhere to in the smaller one, say maybe 33% more for starters.
I need help in this area myself, and have been considering Brother Al Schoonmaker's coaching for it. I once asked Penny Tweedy why she bet $2 per race while surrounded by some fairly impressive wealth. "I don't like to lose," she said from some place way down deep. There are enormous differences in people along these lines and that captured it well for me.
Last edited by Cinch; 06-21-2009 at 01:20 AM.
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06-21-2009, 09:58 AM
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#12
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old hand
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: getting into photography
Posts: 1,732
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Re: Bankroll übernit
you have to treat your online roll as investment money its not "your money" its your work money
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06-21-2009, 10:21 AM
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#13
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banned
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 211
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Quote:
Originally Posted by rugmuncher
you have to treat your online roll as investment money its not "your money" its your work money
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True, you need to think those numbers are just points, no money (remove the $ sign).
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06-21-2009, 10:47 AM
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#14
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adept
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: In an octopus' garden near a cave
Posts: 1,070
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Re: Bankroll übernit
I understand every has unique reasons and motivations. Here's my experience:
I know I have a big enough edge and a low enough ego so that I can keep pushing myself higher and higher with a small bankroll. If I lose some, easy, I grind a lower level. I know that I can crush my level, especially with my game slection and lack of tilt. I typically start to "take shots" when I have 15BI and by then time I have 20, I'm a reg. I have no danger of losing my roll as I'd have to lose 100+ buy-ins because I'd keep moving down.
Maybe something that helps me is that I don't have "regular" limits. Doing so would hinder my growth in every way.
My bankroll is my working capital. It's not my holiday fund. It's not my grocery money and it's definitely not the rent.
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06-21-2009, 01:12 PM
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#15
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enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 80
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Re: Bankroll übernit
Quote:
Originally Posted by rugmuncher
you have to treat your online roll as investment money its not "your money" its your work money
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Yeah, that's what I try to do. But say I grind NL50 and make 10 buyins. I just feel like I can lose all that hard-earned profit in no time if I move up. This is obviously results oriented thinking, but I can't help it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcesVsMuck
I understand every has unique reasons and motivations. Here's my experience:
I know I have a big enough edge and a low enough ego so that I can keep pushing myself higher and higher with a small bankroll. If I lose some, easy, I grind a lower level. I know that I can crush my level, especially with my game slection and lack of tilt. I typically start to "take shots" when I have 15BI and by then time I have 20, I'm a reg. I have no danger of losing my roll as I'd have to lose 100+ buy-ins because I'd keep moving down.
Maybe something that helps me is that I don't have "regular" limits. Doing so would hinder my growth in every way.
My bankroll is my working capital. It's not my holiday fund. It's not my grocery money and it's definitely not the rent.
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I wish I could do that. Being a student, I don't even need the money for rent or anything.
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