(Raked) Club Game Containment Thread - Page 3 - Home Poker Games

bluegarage · 09-27-2011, 02:29 PM

Another home game with a "higher than casino" rake. The rake is too high, I would never play at this game regardless of the other issues.

If he is doing all the dealing and playing he has a lot going on. In fact IMO it is impossible to run the game and play poker effectively at the same time. So this plays in your favor.

Doesn't matter though because with a rake like that he will always come out OK at the end of the night.

ochsy03 · 09-27-2011, 03:17 PM

i would never play at a home game that has rake. ive played at maybe 3 or 4 different games and none of them took rake. also playin out of the house chip tray is a joke too. how do you know the host?

DavidNB · 09-27-2011, 03:50 PM

Raked home game that the dealer plays, bad idea.
How is the cut done, dealer get someone else to cut?

**eneely** · 09-27-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tenstiks

I've been playing in a particular live 1-3 NL home game for the past 5 months, and have not been able to win in the past 4 or 5 sessions. The house is losing players, so the host is dealing, raking (about 15.00 per pot) and also playing.

Last night, I noticed he wasn't raking the pots he won. He was only raking the pots of other players. Also, he puts his chips in the house chip tray, so it is impossible to know how much he has behind, but virtually he has an unlimited amount behind so he plays every hand.

He also runs the game with a partner, and she too will never fold. They call every preflop raise just to build the pot so they can rake, or try to get lucky against you. And they have gotten lucky by outdrawing me at least 90% over the last 5 sessions.

This seems to me like a lose-lose situation. I am going to classify this an unbeatable game, although I have had a fairly good amount of winning sessions in the past.

Since this is not a home game, but what we call a club game, I moved it into the containment thread.

**eneely** · 09-27-2011, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eneely

Since this is not a home game, but what we call a club game, I moved it into the containment thread.

Oh yeah, find another game. This one sucks.

**Schmendr1ck** · 09-27-2011, 04:36 PM

Shenanigans for sure. +1 to finding another game.

tenstiks · 09-27-2011, 06:36 PM

Basically, the rake is just whatever he feels like raking. Whenever I mention anything about the rake he gets defensive and mad. Although this is a 1-3NL game, they play like it's a lot more in order to build the pots. And since there are two of them as partners, your chances of not being outdrawn are a lot lower. And, all the rest of the players at the table are extremely loose fish, so they are also looking to out draw on you. I did have have 4 winning months out of 5, so I shouldn't complain. But it seems like ever since he fired the dealer who I trained at my own home game which is no longer happening, they have been seeing every river against me, and if my hands do not improve to flushes, broadways and full houses, they win.

Thanks for your feedback on this.

tenstiks · 09-27-2011, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidNB

Raked home game that the dealer plays, bad idea.
How is the cut done, dealer get someone else to cut?

Oh no, he cuts himself. More shenanigans!

tenstiks · 09-27-2011, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ochsy03

i would never play at a home game that has rake. ive played at maybe 3 or 4 different games and none of them took rake. also playin out of the house chip tray is a joke too. how do you know the host?

I met him at a free poker league, and he met a lady in the same league who's son ran a rebuy tournament and then a cash game afterward in her home garage. Then, she and this guy hooked up, and she fired her son. They play every Monday night at the Big Fishes house, and they switch back and forth every Friday night between her garage and Fishes house. When she fired her son, they stopped having a tournament. Obviously, they are money hungry for the rake.

tenstiks · 09-27-2011, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluegarage

Another home game with a "higher than casino" rake. The rake is too high, I would never play at this game regardless of the other issues.

If he is doing all the dealing and playing he has a lot going on. In fact IMO it is impossible to run the game and play poker effectively at the same time. So this plays in your favor.

Doesn't matter though because with a rake like that he will always come out OK at the end of the night.

Yes this is so true. They always come out OK. I know it is a very bad idea to play in this game. And living in Richmond, Texas is a very bad place to live if you play poker. We are 3.5 hours away from a so-so casino, and now with Online Poker's Black Friday, there isn't so much going on for online poker.

Maybe it's time to find something else to do.

dugthefish · 09-27-2011, 09:45 PM

Start your own unraked game, and steal all his players. Before long, he'll be asking to play at your game. **** that guy.

Hoss1193 · 10-16-2011, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dugthefish

I once played in a game that used the "end of night" rake. The last few hands were almost always shove fests, as the players who were down figured "well, the rake is going to eat most of what I have left anyway, I might as well go all in".

I initially thought that the 20% cashout wasn't so bad...in some ways, really not that different from a time-charge just taken at the end of the night. Dug brings out a good point though...with this rake structure...the players who bust out early essentially play for free.

In my mind, part of winning poker is playing well enough to "beat" the rake...at least minimizing the amount one directly pays, passing a disproportionate share to the looser players who see more hands. With this structure, that's not possible. By definition, the winners pay all the rake (or at least, those who played well enough to at least have a stack left at the end).

Which leads to another unintended consequence...the later the game goes, the stronger the disincentive to rebuy. This structure is actually a game-breaking action-killer toward the end of the night.

cdog · 10-17-2011, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmendr1ck

Instead, understand that winners and losers pay rake.

Sorry, but you got this wrong.

The rake is a tax on winning and breakeven players ONLY.

100% of the losing players money would go to the winning and breakeven players if there was no rake.

Aidan · 10-17-2011, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdog

The rake is a tax on winning and breakeven players ONLY.

This is up there with the worst possible recurring arguments. Can we talk about glocks instead?

**Schmendr1ck** · 10-17-2011, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdog

100% of the losing players money would go to the winning and breakeven players if there was no rake.

This is true (though thanks to variance, it can take a really long time in live poker).

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdog

The rake is a tax on winning and breakeven players ONLY.

This is false.

In a raked game, the pots you lose are the same size, but the pots you win are smaller. The rake has a negative effect on your win rate.

Losing players have a win rate too - it's just negative. So in a raked game, they lose faster than they would in an unraked game. If the game is raked steeply enough, the extra losses are noticeable to even the worst fish, and they will leave the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdog

Good question.