This week on the podcast (www.toppair.net) we talked about TILT - is it a viable strategy if you know what someone's hot buttons are and push them in order to send them over the edge and spewing money. This is an especially well targeted topic for home game poker where you are apt to see the same faces & personalities week after week.

I am not talking about clearly DB things like slow rolling, rubbing a bluff in someone's face, etc., but simple triggers. As a prime example, I know the "Gutterball" goes absolutely ballistic when the name of a certain player is brought up. This player no longer plays in the group and in fact has moved out of state, but just mentioning his name puts old GB in such a tizzy that his game totally crumbles when he recalls some past, emotion charged, encounters.

A Douche Bag Move? Reading the book "Tales From The Tiltboys" is what got me going down this road.

I mentioned to Eric that Gutterball's reaction reminded me of an episode of "I Love Lucy" where she is working on a vaudeville routine and her partner immediately and dramatically reacts at the mention of one word. I think the original bit was by Abbott & Costello. He had never hear of it so I did some digging and came up with this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwSiQQJ-IoI

I would love to hear your opinions on this area or some examples of giving or receiving Mega Tilt inducing actions.

A couple of my LAG'y regs swear by what they call "implied tilt odds". They don't have a problem getting their money in as a dog versus certain players who will tilt and rebuy multiple times if their Aces get cracked by a hand like 62o.

As for myself, I don't try to put a guy on tilt, but after playing with the same guys week in and week out, I've learned to recognize when certain tilt-prone players are on the edge, and adjust my game apporpriately to take advantage of that (and maybe push them the rest of the way )

I tend to not do any of the things I think you're thinking about. Not really for ethical reasons so much as I figure it can kill more future action than it can create and it can give people a reason to pay more attention to me (generally speaking not a good thing in poker/gambling).

I do factor tilt into some poker decisions though. If a guy is known for really going off after taking a beat I may semi-bluff that gut shot in a spot where it's close but wrong in a vacume.

ETA - actually basically what the post above says but not to near that extreme.

No.

I provide my home as a happy and safe place to escape from the stressors in your life. It should be a place you enjoy visiting. These kinds of dynamics do not work towards this goal. This kind of targeted taunting and bullying doesn't jive with me.

If you want to deliberately upset somebody, do it under someone else's roof. Disrespecting someone in my home is the same thing as disrespecting me.

It depends on what you're trying to do with your "home game", Mahowny. If it's just a vehicle for you to make money, then perhaps deliberate tilt-triggering makes sense. That answer might depend, for me, on what form the expected reaction would take... and how broadly it would affect the group experience.
(I haven't listened to the podcast yet, in case it would affect the answer).

While I'm not quite as Zen as the krazy kittah, I probably lean more towards his side of the fence on this one.

(I haven't listened to the podcast yet, in case it would affect the answer).

I find it a bit difficult to believe that LL would be against inducing tilt at the table

I guess he just saves it for the HP forums!

DINGDINGDING!!!

Different responsibilities, when you're the host of a game group you're trying to maintain.

I play regularly in a team event that includes a HU match as part of the format. If I know I am playing against a math-oriented player, I will deliberately try to engineer a bad-beat, simply for what I like to term "Tilt-equity". Do not think I would do it in a Home Game setting, but cannot say 100% that I would not, either. I will plead situational dependency . . .

If this is simply an analog for a casino game, except that it happens within the confines of a residence, then I have no issues with getting people on tilt.

Somewhere along the spectrum of "real cash game" to "thing I do on my kitchen table" it becomes less and less appropriate.

Tilt seems like part of the game. It's no more disrespectful to put someone on tilt by legit means than it is to check-raise someone.

I think you lose more than you gain playing that style especially in a home game setting.

In most home games I've played in, the competition is newer/more recreational to poker then most casino settings. As long as strategy is not discussed at the table, I would get the same "implied tilt odds" by busting JJ on a 269dd flop with AKdd. And I wouldn't have to get my money in 4 to 1 (AA vs 62o) to do it.

Agreed. And as someone who sees dozens of casino table dynamics a day, I'd say you lose more than you gain playing that style in casinos, as well, especially if it's a place you intend to play regularly.

You seem to assume that putting someone on tilt involves doing something unpleasant. Of course unpleasant is unpleasant, and violates the code of conduct, and you should never act in an unpleasant fashion for any reason and in any place.

What I was talking about was doing something like making a bad call when drawing, because you know that the villain steams when you run him down. The biggest downside to implied tilt odds plays is that unless you're playing heads-up, every other player at the table is free-riding on your equity investment in trying to tilt someone.

Agreed, as well. For the record, I never endorsed the "implied tilt odds" theory, and I would never use it myself for the sheer stupidity of the idea. On the other hand, however, I would encourage any player at my table to try hitting a 10% hand on me to try and put me on tilt, because it ain't gonna happen

And here is another reason why I let my ITO boys have their fun. Just because you felt Tilty McTilter doesn't guarantee you will reap the benefits. As Laggy players your chances are better than mine, but I hit hands once in a while, too. And Tilty usually don't care who's raising him, only that he has TPTK on a dry board and is about to double up

As a note, my NL games play much closer to a casino game than a standard home game, so I let a bit more slide in this area.

My objection is more about the game, than the effect on one person.

Ummmm... no. Narrow the context a little...

Agreed here, which I know is your main point.. and was generally well-stated.

But, knitters gotta crochet

I don't try to put players on tilt in my home game; it's not my style. I also frown on other players doing it, because it's bad for the longevity of a home game between friends or friendly regulars.

However, I certainly recognize when players in my games are tilting, and I will adjust my play accordingly based on what I know about how Player X plays when he's tilted. That, IMO, is just part of poker.

Oh, by all means, make bad calls. If this is your way to put someone on tilt, please do it to me!

I mean more the attitude around it. If you make a bad call, hit, and then act like a jerk about it... THAT'S the part that don't fly in my game.

I would refrain from using the term douche bag loosely. Encouraging tilt is part of the game because it makes people play badly. So who is to say whether you are a douche bag when you make sure your opponent sees your bluff? You can do this without saying a word and the opponent will respond negatively or take it in stride. If he uses the term douche bag to describe my play it just shows me he 's not used to the game and is a mental game fish.

Um...only you have used that term in this thread. I would draw the line somewhere between simply showing a bluff and making obnoxious comments about how someone plays. Laughing while pulling in a pot is somewhere in the gray middle, as is mentioning a name sure to set someone off. It is hard to say where it crosses the line.

They say it all the time on the podcast. I would think good friends at a home game needle each other even more than complete strangers at the casino, and among real friends who the f- cares at a home game? I just think people who act badly are not experienced enough to know to be nice because it helps them get invited back... maybe a more experienced player might tolerate bad behavior because it's a sign of weakness.