Home game toke splitting/ethics question - Page 2 - Home Poker Games

Running2Good · 06-28-2012, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damani311

i don't see what emotion has to do with it

someone is trying to point out that he works harder than me outside of this situation, which is a moot point that i don't care about. I'm only looking at what goes down here, and yes he is entitled to take most of the tips at the end of the night if he wants to, just like I am entitled to come on here and bitch about it, and you are entitled to waste your time bitching at me. Thanks for trying to help but you come off as so crass yourself.

CEO sits in the chair and drinks all day, while other person is clearing the ****ters. Who works harder?

Damani311 · 06-28-2012, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgiharris

Okay, I missed one of your posts so I was overly harsh...

Let me make it up to you by offering something useful.

It may be too late for this arrangement but next time, its important you work out the business arrangement prior to taking on a job. It is human nature to "assume" a set of conditions that ultimately favors oneself since our POV is always self serving. We then assume that the other parties' assumptions will mirror our own when in reality their assumptions will be self serving.

In this case, "if" you were to renegotiate this, then your best argument would be one of a "flat rate". By paying you $60 regardless of profit increase he is saying that is your flat rate. Now, let's say only 4 people show up and you deal, is he still going to pay you $60? If the answer is yes, then you don't have a logical basis to insist on more money. If the answer is no, then that provides a logical basis for renegotiating and insisting on more money or a percentage basis.

A possible compromise could be a cap at $60 and then a 75/25 split his way above that. Another way to help renegotiate this is if you can bring more value to the table in the form of offering ideas that help this setup. If you bring in new players then you have a better negotiating position. Perhaps you combine with another club for a monthly tournament? Or what about offering "how to play poker" lessons. Basically, figure out another way to add value and that will help you renegotiate your position.

Thanks. It indeed may have been a one time deal, but I can guarantee that it only four players showed I would have gotten 40/120, but before last night we've just never had to deal with that much overflow and then I suppose I was just shocked and overreacted when he just automatically pocketed the overflow, and then follows up with some degrading statement about "not having the ability to make any more than that", even though we basically just did. I was trying to blow of some steam on here, and the issue is now resolved in my head, so thanks again.

pfapfap · 06-28-2012, 03:52 PM

I'm a dealer, and I've dealt private games. I agree, it's possibly unfair. But that's life, dude..

You have zero power here. Unless you're willing to walk out over this, your only option is to accept what he gives you.

Any negotiating power you may have had was erased when you whined to him about it.

That's business. That's capitalism. That's life. Yes, it's unfair. If it's any consolation, in the grand scheme of things, he's a peon just like the rest of us.

zunni74 · 06-28-2012, 04:20 PM

Considering what minimum wage is, and the number of people who work for it.. how did we get so many posts in without anyone mentioning that $30 an hour is a FREAKING GOOD SALARY for a kid...

Side note, dgiharris's last post is dead on (and mirrors the question I was thinking, what do you get if fewer players show up?)

**The Palimax** · 06-28-2012, 04:28 PM

Dinesh summed up pretty much my thoughts on the matter in the first post.

If you feel the $60 is your business arrangement and you're unsatisfied with it, discuss it with your business partner. If you and your business partner can't reach an accord, then you have to look at other remedies.

Quadstriker · 06-28-2012, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfapfap

I'm a dealer, and I've dealt private games. I agree, it's possibly unfair. But that's life, dude..

Pretty much everything Pfap said. You're the employee here. If you like the arrangement you work. If you don't you negotiate. If negotiations don't go how you want you work under the arrangement, or you don't work. It's your choice.

DavidNB · 06-28-2012, 04:48 PM

I take it the manager handles the bank/chips, and thats how he finds out what you make in tips? Not that it matters, I m just curious.

Anyways on the house tip, not much you can do, the manager runs the place. The $60 you get is decent, let it ride

Bene Gesserit · 06-28-2012, 06:57 PM

Our free enterprise system lets this be the norm. Someone is always getting the shorter end of the stick. You can only eat this and stay on, or you can quit and consider it a life lesson. You may have a moral position here possibly, but you really have no practical position.

SooperFish24 · 06-29-2012, 01:01 PM

So you are getting $170 for 6 hours work tax free. Not bad if you ask me.

LiveD0nk · 07-28-2012, 12:17 AM

It should be completely irrelevant to YOU whether or not the players are "HIS" or if they belong to the country club that he is "just an employee of". HE is your gateway to this job, and as already stated, you can EASILY be replaced. Dont forget those facts.

Furthermore, have you considered that he may actually be JEOPARDIZING his job by making a profit from hosting these games?

I'm actually surprised he is giving you ANY of the "toke". If I were him, I'd feel perfectly justified in letting my dealer work for nothing else but the tips the players give them, and $30 an hour CASH is much more than you could make in any other job with a level of "skill" equal to the skill and ability required of a poker dealer. (Face it, its not that hard of a job...more people skill than technical skill is required)

Lottery Larry · 07-29-2012, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfapfap

Guys in suits rule the world. Life is incredibly unfair, and will be until the day you die. There's absolutely nothing you can do about it.

"Seems a little defeatist."

Don Quixote

Lottery Larry · 07-29-2012, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SooperFish24

So you are getting $170 for 6 hours work tax free. Not bad if you ask me.

"Tax-free"? So, you're an advocate of violating income reporting laws?

Lottery Larry · 07-29-2012, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgiharris

OP,

Your arguments are coming from an emotional childish place. The truth in the real adult world is that employees ALWAYS WORK HARDER THAN MANAGEMENT!!!

DUH....

Ummmm... no

that being said- I'm definitely in the camp of: Managers should work for employees and not the other way around, as a primary aspect of managing people.

Lottery Larry · 07-29-2012, 12:54 PM

I can't believe no one reacted to this, yet:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damani311

$5 single blind $300 buy in.....

a manager from the club calls me

The players take a 'toke pool' for the house, generally $20 per player which ends up being $120, and the manager gives me $60 of that.

At last nights game there is an extra player, and it is suggested that the 'toke' for tonight is $30 a head,

that he just pocketed the entire extra $90 that was collected.

Suggested by whom, exactly? If it's the manager..... really?

Quote:

. He tells me to "not be disappointed, it's not like there's anywhere else you could make this much money per hour" which is ridiculous in my opinion.

I'm with you, this attitude pisses me off. As others have said, however... unless you're the only good dealer in the area, you have little power unless you're willing to go on strike, for a few calls, and risk the loss of future calls.

Quote:

This is the problem I've encountered in every single job where my boss wears a suit, because I either just stew in the disrespect until it affects my performance, or just blatantly start calling people out and end up fired.

I understand the frustration. Perhaps you need to find a third action, besides these harmful black/white choices.