I would like to ask for some thoughts and opinions on tables moves.

Here is the situation...

I run a home game where we usually have 2 (and sometimes more) tables. We pretty much exclusively play Big O (5 card Omaha). So, we can accommodate 8 players. BUT, when we have too many players, but not enough get for 2nd table, we go to 9 players and exclude having a last burn card. Furthermore, if we have 10 players, we do the same thing, but position left of the button sits out.

The way I'm currently doing it is when people walk in the door, their name goes on the list. The first 8 are at the "main table". Players 9 and 10 can play at that table until we have enough to start a 2nd table. When I get 4 waiting, I pull players 9 and 10 to start the 2nd table.

Now, table 2 becomes a must move, because I always want table 1 to have at least 8. So, the list for table 2 starts with players 9 and 10 from the first table, and so on from there.

The problem comes if table 1 has 3 or 4 tight players, then some of the looser players want to move to the 2nd table. I can't allow this because then my main table would have less than 8. Then to further complicate things, there are a couple of super-loose-bad players that walk in. They have to go to table 2. Now the loose-players from table 2 are fighting to get on the table with the bad players and say they should be able to move first because they were there first.

I tried to implement that if they want to do move off of the tight table, then they have to sit out for an hour before they can come back in. This backfired for them and me when they did this; which made me have to move 3 people to the main table (one of which was the bad player). So when they came back to table 2, the bad player wasn't there; and it hurt my game.

Does anyone have any opinions on how to a) keep the main table strong, b) effectively handle the waiting players and the must-move players, and c) keep everyone happy (not possible, I know).

I have tried to provide all of the information I can, but if anyone has any questions, please ask.

Thanks.
Paul

Thats a interesting one. I look forward to replies to see how to resolve it. Its hard to limit players from moving tables but on the other hand, you have to keep them balanced.

The hour sit out for moving tables should not be there. If your going to let players move, then let them do it right away. Only let players move to the second table if it keeps the tables more or less even with in 1. Drop your must have 8 on the main table to 7. So you could have 7 on the main table and 8 on the second table.

What do the players think/

A couple of options. Can a player requesting to move to table 2 ask seats 9 and/or 10, if they want to stay at table 1, so the requester Can go go to table 2?
When you say "must move", aren't you rotating players every hour (just make it every 30-45 minutes)?

Like exercise class right?

Must move means that the it is a feeder table into the main game and whenever a seat opens up in the main game then somebody from feeder table must move to that new open seat. If you have more than 2 tables than the 3 feeds into the 2nd, 4th into 3rd, etc. so there is a trickle down effect and all tables except for the last feeder are full. Fairly common in casinos.

I wish my one-table cash game had this problem...

First and foremost: whatever you do, you must be consistent. Establish rules that apply to everyone and stick to them. If you bend the rules or make special accommodations for certain players, it will come back to bite you.

Your goal is to keep the main game full, and I think the easiest and most consistent way to do that is to make table 2 a must-move game, no exceptions. Sometimes the game will be better at the main table, sometimes it'll be better at the must-move, and players will have to accept that. Table selection is for the casino, not for a home game IMO.

One possible exception is that if a player wants to move to table 2 and can find a player in that game to take his seat at table 1, I wouldn't have a problem letting them switch. Of course, the player from table 1 also takes the other player's place on the waiting list, so he might find himself right back at table 1 sooner than he wants.

This is the important part. Establish a policy and be consistent.

When my game runs two tables, we use the same policy:
-we play one table up to 10 players
-first table is filled in order of RSVP time
-above 10, a second table list is started
-when we hit 13 players, we break into two tables
-second table is filled first by volunteers to move, then by order of RSVP time with the latest RSVPs moving to the second table first
-main table must always have 7. At 13 we play 7 and 6, 14 we play 7 and 7, 15 we play 8 and 7 and so on. If the main game drops below 7 we move players back to the first table in order of RSVP. Sometimes we hit 7 and 4 as people start to leave and the second table either continues 4 handed or they wait for one to leave and we combine back to one table of 10.

Most times, we have a couple volunteers to play at the second table and I move a couple based on the order from the list. Not saying our system is perfect, but it works for us and it is consistent as Schemdy said. I have found I always fill my first table quickly too as people want to get a good spot on the list.

I think a lot of people like must moves for the wrong reasons........ Thyere are people who feel they always must have full table and they like must moves to provide them that,


But I don't think thats what you really need. Maybe you should just consider a having a rule that a player can never move from a table if it would leave that table shorter than the other table.

If you insist on a must move don't must move to to keep the main game full. Allow it to go seven handed (so you only force a move if the main game gets down to 6)

Here's how I did it:

Pretty much the same as you, tight on the main table until a couple people are waiting, then break to two tables.

For changing tables, this is how it worked:

A new player shows up, and the people who were forced to move to balance tables have first option to move back. If they don't want to, then any player on any table may switch tables, provided it keeps a balance. If Table A has 6 players and Table B has 5, then anybody on Table A can move. If they both have 6, then anybody on either table can move.

As new players arrive, we go through it again. And if at any point one player is one higher than the other, anybody from that table may move to the other. If a table loses 2 or more players, we don't force others to fill in the spots, but people can voluntarily move. By the time it becomes problematic, we can combine tables anyway.

(And if a table is really short but we can't combine, as host I usually move voluntarily if nobody else does. Gives me a chance to socialize with people I haven't seen yet.)

This is almost exactly the rule for my game, with the exception that we don't take RSVPs. First Come First Served.

Yeah, I totally agree with FCFS.

Yep

Thanks for all of the great replies. I will probably end up doing it more like pfap. There will be some that aren't happy with that, but I think that is the fairest way to do it.

And in case it wasn't clear, the new player goes to whichever table needs the balance.

Only to play devils advocate: What happens if man 11 and 12 show up, and after waiting around an hour, # 13 never shows up? Do you make certain that # 13 is on their way? Or do you eventually go to 7/5 or 6/6 or 6/5?

We take RSVPs for a couple reasons:

1) To make sure the game is going to run (which it almost always does)
2) To see how many players we are expecting. It actually helps on nights I have 12 so that I can attempt to recruit a couple more to run 2 tables.
3) To prevent people from showing up and not having a seat

We used to start the game at 8:00. A large majority of us wanted to move the game up to 7:00 to get a little more time to play. The earlier start time didn't work for everyone based on work schedules, so in an attempt to be fair, we hold any RSVP'd seats until 8:00, then if anyone is on the wait list they can fill that seat.

It works well for us.

Yes, I give it about 15 minutes, then I break it up.