Just wanted to say that Bradqwer did take a stake under me and played far over the bankroll and ran off after promising to pay back the money, and has not made recent contact. The hands he played were absolutely terrible, stuff that winning players would never do, possibly chip dumping.

Please ban this poster: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/members/329078/

As you can see by his post history all he's doing is spamming marketplace threads with a link or at least attempting to, the link isn't showing up in threads.

Posting on behalf of Asquith31/Easee123 Staking

Full Name: kris hunt
Address: **Have if needed by anyone**
Moblie Phone Number: **Have if needed by anyone**
Facebook info: kris hunt
Playing Account: kris3012
Make Up: 3055
Our contracts as standard state that the player cannot leave in MU and we have the right to drop players in stakes accordingly.

Hes now playing for another backer after sending this cute email.

************************************************** ***********************

Hi Kev/Ben

As of the 10/03/12 i feel that my agreement has been forced to an end. The reasons behind this are listed below.

After constant scrutiny of my game, Ben feels my level of play is inadequate to play at the stakes I was originally offered to play. Whilst i appreciate constructive criticism, having so many constant set backs and blows regarding how I play is now starting to have a negative effect due to the constant negative frame of mind.
After the conversation regarding my "just playing 2s" which I whole heartedly disagreed with, I checked my agreement via the google docs to see if it had been changed, which it hadn't, so i continued at my normal stakes, which was brought up by Ben with an offer to INCREASE my make up by $510... Now, I work so hard, and put in so many hours, so as to grind my way out of make up and start getting some profit splits. I figured the coaching i was getting was to help me achieve this goal, but apparently not if your going to put me into more make up.
The extra-makeup deal has also made my views on how the stake is run change entirely, as I feel it's insulting.

I don't think it's possible for the situation to be rectified, and disagree entirely with the way Ben has put things forward to me, and even told me out-right "You are not good enough to be playing 8s Kris" - when $8 180s make up way over 50% of what I thought this staking deal was about.

My sharkscope shows that I have a positive return on investment at ALL stakes up to 15s, besides the $3 rebuys, which I don't like to play anyway, hence the small sample size there. I am hitting extremely bad variance at the moment, and expect my staking group/backers to help me through it with a positive attitude, I haven't had this at all and am very disappointed with how things have been dealt with since hitting my downswing.

My game, granted, hasn't been what it should be.. but I have shown more willing and eagerness to learn/grind than anybody I know, so when I started to run a bit better and took a shot back at the 15s, I didn't expect to be "penalised" as Ben put it.

In regards to my current make up: $3,022 - This will be paid as/when I can afford it, and will not include the extra 500 bucks you guys wanted to throw in.

Thanks for the opportunity, but it clearly hasn't worked out for either party, and I don't feel that it ever will.

Kris

First of all i like the way you only post half the story.

2ndly let me make it clear, i spoke to kev and told him that i would clear the make-up by continuing to play for them but was told that ben didnt want me to play anymore (so effectively dropping me).

The email above was sent in a rage as the situation was that ben was forcing me to pay an extra $500 or so as a punishment for playing games($15 180s) which was within my contract but had been told to consider not playing them.
No formal written document stated this, on my daily spreadsheet it stated the stakes i was allowed to play and it wasnt altered (both me and kev had access to this spreadsheet on google docs).

Obviously i handled the situation incorrectly but i was very annoyed at the manner in which ben was forcing me to pay this extra money(i lost approx 500 at the 15s which is included in the make up already)

And im not in a position to pay back what i owe (due to financial problems i have).

As ive said to Kev id be willing to grind the make-up off as thats the only way i have of clearing this amount (at $8s/3rs).

Kris

nevermind, talking to him now

---Skype logs of one of many convo's---

[10/03/2012 14:51:13] Kev ( asquith31): yo
[10/03/2012 14:51:44] Kev ( asquith31): send remaining br back plus sreenshot of cashier last 60 days
[10/03/2012 17:47:00] Kris Hunt (kris3012): hi
[10/03/2012 17:48:03] Kev ( asquith31): hi m8
[10/03/2012 17:48:29] Kris Hunt (kris3012): hows it going
[10/03/2012 17:50:04] Kev ( asquith31): tired had 2 long days live
[10/03/2012 17:50:18] Kev ( asquith31): grrrrrrrr live poker brutal
[10/03/2012 17:50:27] Kris Hunt (kris3012): yes so slow
[10/03/2012 17:52:09] Kev ( asquith31): right i seen everthing whats gone on we dont want u to leave m8 as u hard worker and we think u will make good reg in time with coaching etc
[10/03/2012 17:52:59] Kris Hunt (kris3012): im not being funny mate ur sound but i dont think i can ever work with ben again
[10/03/2012 17:53:02] Kev ( asquith31): but u hav got to understand u cant play games we told u not to
[10/03/2012 17:53:33] Kris Hunt (kris3012): end of day nothing was set in stone or so i thought
[10/03/2012 17:53:54] Kris Hunt (kris3012): like i told ben theres no way on this planet i am paying u guys 500 extra
[10/03/2012 17:54:02] Kris Hunt (kris3012): it simply aint fair
[10/03/2012 17:56:04] Kev ( asquith31): we dissused this it part of m/u so u paying it back if u know what i mean
[10/03/2012 17:56:46] Kev ( asquith31): but we can work togther am sure unless u got 3k to clear m/u
[10/03/2012 17:57:13] Kris Hunt (kris3012): no i aint but u cant physically force me to play for u
[10/03/2012 17:57:22] Kris Hunt (kris3012): if u wanna try it will cost u alot more than 3k
[10/03/2012 17:58:05] Kev ( asquith31): i dont wont to me, i want u to stay
[10/03/2012 17:58:13] Kev ( asquith31): we can work togther np
[10/03/2012 17:58:26] Kris Hunt (kris3012): but i dont wanna be part of the team any more
[10/03/2012 17:58:31] Kris Hunt (kris3012): is it that hard to understand?
[10/03/2012 17:58:39] Kris Hunt (kris3012): i aint got a problem with u
[10/03/2012 17:58:47] Kris Hunt (kris3012): ben has gone too far
[10/03/2012 17:58:52] Kris Hunt (kris3012): as stated in the email
[10/03/2012 17:58:56] Kev ( asquith31): ul hav to get a backer to buy ur m/u then
[10/03/2012 17:59:34] Kris Hunt (kris3012): ill pay it back when i can
[10/03/2012 18:00:07] Kev ( asquith31): u cant cant just leave m8
[10/03/2012 18:00:19] Kris Hunt (kris3012): i tiled off the roll i had
[10/03/2012 18:00:28] Kris Hunt (kris3012): so until i find new backer i cant play anyway
[10/03/2012 18:00:52] Kris Hunt (kris3012): tilted*
[10/03/2012 18:00:59] Kev ( asquith31): u nothing in br
[10/03/2012 18:01:04] Kris Hunt (kris3012): nope
[10/03/2012 18:01:22] Kev ( asquith31): wtf
[10/03/2012 18:01:31] Kris Hunt (kris3012): ...
[10/03/2012 18:02:02] Kris Hunt (kris3012): like i said, MU @ $3k, will pay it when i can.
[10/03/2012 18:02:48] Kev ( asquith31): u cant play for urself or any backer until the m/u is cleard as stated in ur contract
[10/03/2012 18:03:29] Kris Hunt (kris3012): its ok i wont play
[10/03/2012 18:03:55] Kris Hunt (kris3012): if u want me to play, send more $ but i aint talkin to any1 about my play or anything
[10/03/2012 18:04:03] Kris Hunt (kris3012): except outside coaching
[10/03/2012 18:04:44] Kris Hunt (kris3012): i dont want ANYTHING to do with ben
[10/03/2012 18:05:40] Kris Hunt (kris3012): and i will only play 8s /15s
[10/03/2012 18:05:46] Kris Hunt (kris3012): otherwise i aint interested
[10/03/2012 18:06:06] Kev ( asquith31): who the **** u thinik u are m8
[10/03/2012 18:06:30] Kev ( asquith31): no 1 demans what games they play
[10/03/2012 18:06:40] Kris Hunt (kris3012): then i wont play
[10/03/2012 18:06:41] Kris Hunt (kris3012): simple
[10/03/2012 18:06:44] Kev ( asquith31): if u stay its on our terms end of
[10/03/2012 18:06:53] Kris Hunt (kris3012): ur the one telling me i got to play for u
[10/03/2012 18:06:58] Kris Hunt (kris3012): I DONT WANT TO STAY
[10/03/2012 18:07:11] Kris Hunt (kris3012): so why would i wanna stay on ur terms

You guys should get arbitration imo. Because of a somewhat vague contract and your partner adding that $500 extra in makeup without a basis in the contract, he has more of a leg to stand on than usual. I'm in no way saying he's in the right though, but this would confirm things. Plus if he refuses, then it's pretty clear he doesn't think a neutral party would side in his favor.

the way kris has come off in the emails/skype is pretty bad. nothing to do with the actual MU/playing, just the way he is demanding stuff/saying he "cant work with ben". what does that even mean? just dont talk to ben during the stake and work with another one of the other backers to get this cleared up.

It always amazes me the way people just **** on their rep for very little money. grow up, work the MU off, and then leave the deal and do what you want. both sides need to just swallow their pride and work through this. it can be pretty hard at times, but its for the best.

good luck

Zima, The reason i was like that is because i was angry not really an excuse i know but when ur being told to pay $500 extra for something that isnt even against ur contract it kinda takes the P*** imo.
Also ben made my feel worthless whilst i was staked by them, rather than helping me and tryin to improve my game he made it worse and also knocked my confidence.(hence y i got to the point where id had enough)

Imo the reason the stake failed was all down to the fact that ben and then kev was tryin to force me to pay this $500 or so, there was no terms in my contract stating anything about a fee for playing games i shouldnt(even tho my contract still stated i could play these games).
So the whole adding $500 to ur makeup is absurd and unjustified.

I, on numerous occasions made an offer to kev to clear the makeup (its not like i just blatantly refused) to start of with i was told they didnt want me, then after a while kev said he would let me clear it off at 2s only.

Given the fact poker is my main source of income this would be impossible for me because it would take me a couple of months or so to clear and with no income i simply wouldnt be able to live.

The skype convos syker has posted is only a tiny % of the actual convos i had with ben/kev and if he was to post all the convos(i cant atm find them myself) then people would see that this was infact all caused by Ben/kev adding this extra $500.

Ive had numerous other stakes including with urself Zima which have all been successful, the last thing i wanna do is give myself a bad name hence y all along ive offered to clear the makeup (within reason i.e. without making my own life impossible to live.)

Kris

A stake where the staker can't lose money.. Change it to a loan please.

Kris is a decent lad to talk to, and i know Ben can rub people up the wrong way - hes pissed me off on numerous occasions and is one of the reasons i left his stable when i grinded for them a while ago. Its still irrelevant.

I have no thoughts on the extra MU situation, it could go either way.

The fact of the matter is, you signed a contract, you cannot leave in MU - yet you did. You should not have given anyone else your action and the Backer has the right to drop people in stakes as he see's fit. This is a all very standard in the world of staking and part of your contract.

We agreed to a payment plan, Kris has not showed even one little good faith payment and broke the payback agreement we had in place, i even said to him we can be reasonable if he shows good faith. None was shown. Hence why i posted this.

The extra $500 will never be paid ever(unless someone can prove to me that i have broken the contract and also that it states in the contract about being the backers being able to unformally change the stakes of my contract and that i would be liable to any money lost at said stakes after, aswell as that amount of money lost being added to mu).

As for dropping me in stakes surely there has to be a change to the contract to offically change the stakes? its a bit like saying well today we gonna change the split even tho ur contract says is x amount, if that makes sense.

Makes having a contract useless if things can be changed without it formally being changed, as both parties should have to agree.

As for the makeup like i said all along the only way i can repay it is to grind it off(im not nor never have refused to repay it, im just not in a position financially to do so.)

gudcallm8, this is the trap for the staking guys making hundred's of k's each month.

---> find someone dumb but that wins a bit at poker

---> make a contract where he cant loose and if he does he has to pay us back, but still let him think that all the risk are on us

this is why i went from getting staked to staking, all those guys using your own profits/loss to determine your stakes played with no regards to your skills/badrun/goodrun.

The Real way to fix this would be for them to let you grind back your loss at the stakes in the contract, anything outside of this is them trying to hustle you.

Imo, if u make a contract with the horse to play certain stakes and he proves to be unprofitable at those stakes ( or run bad , or tilt his stake away, doesn't matter ) u can't make him play lower stakes then agreed upon to clear his MU.

That is the time when u have to cut the horse loose and take your loses, as a backer, u picked a wrong horse and that is your risk of the business.

What stakers do is make sure that they will be in profit or they will own you , as they well know that a horse will not leave the stake when in small profit, and if profit gets bigger they move you up the stakes insuring that u can't never fund your game on your own.
Guys who have to take the profits to fund real life are perfect for this.

"you can't leave the stake while in MU" , that's ok, but only if both staker and the horse agree on the terms and stakes to continue.
And " he is not profitable at those stakes so I can make him move down" is not a good argument. That your problem, why did u back him for those stakes in the first place then.

I don't recall who posted it, but someone suggested a non-partial arbitrator. I think that's a good idea...

I would volunteer (yes, for free) to be that person if you guys want... This thread has helped me in the past and I want to give back in any small way I can...

Let me start by saying I am 99% sure I don't know any of the parties involved. I do know a backer named "Ben", but from his description ITT this can't be the same person...

I have been staked (at Multi-Table SnGs up to $30) and I have staked players up to the same buy-ins. I think I have an outstanding reputation with the people within the online poker community who know me (I'll provide a list if you'd like)...

I am sure I can provide an impartial recommendation on how to settle this if both parties agree...

Shoot me a PM if your interested, or hit me on Skype (bigloser2448)

Cheers

+1

This poster is back and doing the same thing under the 2+2 user name "Gainess12".

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/members/329665/

got him, thanks

Best to just do a Report Post on any spam posts.
That way any mod who checks the reports can ban such blatant spamming.

This pi$$es me off to no extent.

Ive never headbutted my Mum, but if i only did it once, would that be ok? GTFO.

I dont really care about the shot taking extra MU situation, its irrelevant if your never going to payback anyway.

The facts are:
You got $2-3k in MU.
You wouldnt move down in stakes.
You left the stable while in MU.
You "tilted off" what money you had left in your account.
You have not paid anything back after we gave you a super relaxed payback plan.
You now grind for someone else on stars as its your only source of income.

I symathize with your situation if it is your only source of income, and a person has to do what he needs to do to survive. But to think we should not post on you to let the backing community know whats gone off would be crazy. Anyone who would back you after this situation would be a total **** idiot.

Thanks, ill let you know, i have PM'd the backers.

What are you confused about???

No im not saying it is, what im saying is that this situation isnt entirely my fault.
Agreed
Ok so after looking at all my emails i have found the contract i signed(this was on 11/05/2011

This is part of the contract(i have the full contract if required)
So in the way the situation was handled by kev/ben they failed to stick to the contract (if i had broken the contract by playin games i shouldnt have).

Also at no point in the contract i signed does it say anything about kev/ben having the right to drop my stakes at any time.
The only thing it states is the following
Finally the stakes it states i can play in my contract are:
Now as you can see these are the stakes that stars changed too shortly after black friday, my contract was never changed to the updated stakes only on my spreadsheet which still to this point say 180s up to 15s.

The way i see the situation is: The reason this situation arose is because Ben wanted me to pay 500 extra and also drop my stakes(which at no point in my contract does it state this can happen).
Both of which are against my contract so they as backers are breaching the contract.
Also ben has stated he doesnt want my grinding for them, so imo he dropped me because as ive stated im willing to clear it off.

You could also say that my contract is invalid because it states i can only play games that dont exist anymore but thats probably a seperate argument, and one im not entirely sure on.

Added on skype

So wait, were they willing to have you move back down to stakes in the original agreement? Or were they demanding that you moved down to stakes way below the original agreement? Both after you had moved up. There's a big difference there.

I started the stake playing all stakes up to 10.85(at the time but this changed to 15s with the buyin changes).
My main stakes was 15s and 8s(later started playing 3rs), i only played 2s as fillers when 15s and 8s didnt give me a full table count.

What they was saying was that i had to drop 15s all together and was even told i wasnt good enough to beat 2s and should be only playing 2s after stopping playing for a couple of weeks to have intense coaching.

Whether or not the stakers may have broken the contract and/or have been unfair and unreasonable with you which would allow for you the break the contract, the tilting off of the money you had left in your account is inexcusable and amounts to outright theft.

Just out of curiosity how much was it? and, What was your reason behind doing such a thing?

Possibly you had some kind of argument until you ran off with their money...