The situation is: late stage in Big 3.3$ (somewhere around 100/5k+) I have 23-24 BB and I got 66 in HJ and I limped pre, everyone fold to big stack on B who raised 2x, I called... Flop: A,8,3 I checked he bet half of pot and I fold.

I know that you all will give me hard time for limping, but let me write immediately my thought process...

Big stack play almost every hand (vp 54 pr 46) and he wants to play as much hands as he can do, so if I bet 2x pre he will call me for sure (or even raise), and if flop miss me I have no room for any action , I have to check/fold. But with just calling pre, and calling his bet I get to see flop, and if I flop good I can take some chips from him, or even double up thru him... And this is the difference between calling and raising pre...With betting I risk 2BB pre, and c-bet on flop, that's minimum 4BB, but with limping I risk 2BB.

I would like to hear what you guys think, and your opinion on this hand...

Also to mention I have no experience in late stages of tournament so I play T&A always, can someone tell me what tactic is the best and should I extend my betting range and shoving range as tournament goes deeper?

just stop open limping - raising means your range is uncapped and you have more options - If called you can cbet as there are plenty of Ax in your range


What's T&A?

Generally in late stage tournament play you need to be very aware of stack sizes - what size to be open shoving - what size to be shoving over a raise etc. It's a big question - there are lots of books that cover basics - you could try Kill Everyone

I don' open limp every time... I just think that in this situation is the best option...
If I bet 2x pre, he called, I have to c bet on flop, and if he call then I have to check/fold almost every turn... and I give 15-20% of my stack...

T&A- tight and aggressive...

Can I find that book online? Who's the autor? Do you know more books, or some videos?

Lee nelson - there's another in the same series called the Raiser's edge which is also good

limping is not tight and aggressive - just think about it - if you limp / call and fold on adverse flops you can only really be happy when you hit a set - and a loose player will rarely pay you off. if you raise - this is a fine flop to c bet on - If you think he is calling c bets widely you can fire a second barrel . If you have position and initiative you don't always need a hand

Thanks I will find them... Are they available free online?

I see what's your initiation here, and I can agree with you in some point, but as I said I've no experience in late stages of tournament and every decision have big impact on the tournament future, and I don't want to donk 40-50% of stack just on assumption that he's just fooling around... I could and maybe should bet this pre and cbet on flop, but I didn't want to find myself committed on hand that I don't know what to do on turn if the board miss me...

I agree with this. Raise pre instead of limping. If you want call and fold on the flop, it's essentially the same thing as raise and he calls and you check fold on the flop, except you show more strength by raising pre.

If he's playing a wider range, it's more likely he doesn't have a strong hand as opposed to him playing more tight, and though it might cost you an extra bed or two in the long run it will be more profitable.

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If I were on the button, I would consider limping 66 with a super aggressive player yet to act, but it would be with the intent of limp shoving. 66 is actually not a terrible spot to do this with because it's a hand that won't play well postflop (you're basically just set mining with marginal odds at best to do so) but can win a ton of pots by leveraging fold equity.

However, since you're in the HJ the much better option is to raise and then shove if he 3-bets. If you raise to 2.2BB and he reraises to 5BB, you have an ideal stack size to jam over his raise. (I normally want to have a pot where I have between 3-6x times the amount of pot behind.) If he's 54/46 he's probably betting really wide and you should still get a lot of folds.

If I raise pre and check on the flop I basically giving him pot, because I have to fold any bet, that's why I have to c-bet if I raise pre, and that is the problem which I don't want to face... I agree that raise pre and c bet flop is profitable move, but that's marginal spot that I want to avoid...

Thanks, I agree with you, that's one of the things that I could do, and I considerate that, but I tough that I don't have much fold equity, because he will only raise with better 50/50 at best, he's calling almost always, and with that I don't want to play 66 post flop against player who had wide range, and who will call my c-bet, unless he completely missed flop...

Can I ask you this? What's the difference between raise, check fold or call a raise, check, fold? You're still folding flop and putting in about the same amount of chips either way.

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Two things:

1. What are your opponent's 3-bet call/4-bet stats? Is this a player who likes to raise but folds to pressure?

2. If this is a player who's a maniac who will call off wide, then great. If he's calling off with 30% of his hands then you're a favorite and you should never be sad about shoving when you're a favorite.

Remember this player has a big stack and is trying to leverage it, and at some point you will need to take a stand. If you constantly wait for the big hand these aggro big stacks will just grind you down unmercifully, especially if you play them passively.

Yes, you will jam in these spots and run into a big hand or get outdrawn - it happens. But to run deep in a big tournament you have to win flips and gamble sometimes.

This. One of the main things that differentiates tourneys from ring games. The blind structure makes it so you have to get it in sometimes. Go for pots, be aggressive when you can.

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In chip amount there's no difference, but I think if you raise pre that in most situations you are required to c-bet, if flop could hit your range, and because fold equity...

Don't know exactly sorry, but it's very small because of tight type of play...Yes and no, he is big stack at table (average around 500k he had over 1M) so I'm not sure that he would fold on c bet...

Thanks for advice I will try to adopt it...

You're not required to do anything. Poker isn't an 'always do this' game. That's the beauty of the game, make good decisions and then put your own spin on it.

If you raise pre, he could fold, vs your limp and he raises you. If you cbet flop, again he can fold...but if the flop is very scary, nothing says you CANT check fold. Playing against aggressive players can be tough, but sometimes it's the best play to let them know you can't be pushed around, even if you don't have a hand and end up folding on the flop.

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Good advice, thanks...