14th hand in the tournament, so no reads on the villain.







What's our next move here? Should we just call and re-evaluate or just jam it? How often is 4-bet from EP something other than AA, KK or maybe AK?

Call IP.

Flat, set mine

Just flat

In the early stages especially with no reads i'd much rather just flat and play with a good hand in IP, getting all your chips in @ 120bb deep with QQ ain't great imo.

If your plans are to 3-bet , you should at least have a plan on what your going to do if you face a 4-bet and If u do decide to 5-bet jam ( bad idea) I don't think you're going to be in great shape against villain's calling range.

So yeah just keep it simple pre and flat and take it from there

How had villain been playing so far?

With no previous history or reason to think villain is an aggtard it looks like you should fold now. You're not getting the right price to set-mine, and you're not even going to be confident facing a bet on a non-A or K flop.

Call ip

Curious any argument for shoving? We have 2rd best starting hand in holdem

3rd*

Too early in tourney blinds are too low shoving would be indirectly committing suicide because we most likely won't be getting called by worse rt now

I'm gonna channel my inner nit and agree with dragons here.

actually, tbh I don't think it's that close. Yeah, like maybe 3% of the time we get owned here...but mostly, I just don't know what we're accomplishing by flatting. When there are practically no flops we feel good about seeing, that's a sign we should fold pre.

lol @ set mine. 900 (620 more) with 4220 behind? So calling 620 with effective stacks of 4220 meaning the implied odds is 6.8? **** that. I think it needs to be something like 15 iirc.

Why do others just say "call ip" and "flat ip". No logic? How do you act on different flops? He is betting most flops after 4 betting and repping KK+ whatever he actually has. So we are happy with, Qxx flops and thats about it? In this spot, flatting against his repped range it would almost be better to be oop. So what are we doing, bluff catching on all J high flops? Do we call 2 tone boards and jam if the flush gets there as a bluff?

This hand sucks. I don't like to fold QQ pre, but I like everything else worse. I agree with Dragons_Egg and RalphWaldoEmerson. Dump it and find a better spot to get our chips in.

I have to agree that against an unknown villain this should be folded after he 4-bets. As said before, I can't call to setmine, odds just aren't there. I'm starting to think we should just call his initial raise and see what happens then.

We have sik odds to set mine

Only reason to ever flat the 4bet is if we think villain has a 4b/f range. If not, either 5bet/gii or fold.

It's probably ok to 3bet/f this. In a vacuum 3b/f QQ would be pretty bad, but it might be more +EV than flatting the initial raise.