We recently had some discussion in a thread regarding opening bet amounts (in pots that have been folded to you) particularly when the antes kick in and the blinds are higher.

Please provide your views on how much you open pots for in the early stages (pre ante) and the mid to late stages (with antes).

I am of the opinion that we should not vary our opens too much at all so I open he same amount with my 89 suited as with my JJ as with my air...

Typically I keep it simple and open 3xBB until antes kick in. Then I go to 2.3-2.75XBB. Obviously a lot depends on the table and if I see them calling a wide range regardless of who opens and from what position I may 3X my good hands and open less often.

Looking for your ideas on opening bet amounts, the whys and if available the maths behind...Also do you vary your bets by hand or by position...Finally do you guys ever miniraise open?

have at it!

-i also 3x until antes, regardless of hand or position*

*= exception when we are in SB/BB. if i'm raising there its usually 3x+1x for each limper. i.e. its 50/100 and we have a 5k stack.. if 3 ppl limp in and i'm in the SB with QQ im making it around 600

-i never minraise

-when antes kick in, i also go 2.2-2.7x. i've been trying to cut down a lot on my raise/folding, so i'm a bit more selective than i used to be with regard to raising. when i am playing in tournaments that are <$55 however, i raise way more than i do when im playing $55 77 109 162+ tournaments. reason being that lower limit players are way less likely to resteal with a hand that's not premium or nearly premium.

someone now might say "well, they call everything esp when i 2.5x and esp when they're in the blinds, so why should i even raise?" --- to that person, i say you should love when people call way too much out of position in mid-late stages of tournaments. you should know by now that the math is against them making a pair on the flop, so the majority of the time a c-bet will take it down. (giving you a bigger pot than if they had just folded their K9o)

that was sort of rambly but i think it made some sense

- mid-late game, if theres a limper ahead and i'm gonna raise it up, i'll usually make it 3-3.3x

cliff notes:
-i dont minraise
-3x pre-antes
-2.2-2.7 post antes


EDIT: forgot to mention that i don't change my bet size lategame either based on hand/position. its essentially pretty random whether i make it 2.2 or 2.7x or somewhere in the middle. i'll make it 2.4x utg with AA, 2.4x in mp with 87s, 2.4x otb with aa, 2.4x otb with 93o... all depends on situations obv but point is that i dont change my betsize at all .. its always somewhere between 2.2 and 2.7 with the bulk of the time being 2.4-2.6

I open 3x until the 50/100 level, where it becomes 275, then 400 at the 75/150 level and 2.5 exactly until antes kick in, where I just open for 2.5+ante every time but have no reasons for it other than it's easy to keep consistent.
Never minraising though, and I usually add .75-1bb for each limper.

If I'm raising from the sb or bb I'll add an extra 1bb because it makes me feel like I've got more fold equity and I hate playing OOP. So there's really no reason to that either.

This is a great subject. I was almost convinced after reading the thread that this was related to that I may need to lessen my amounts once antes kick in, but I think I need a little more convincing.

Fwiw, I am a proponent of keeping my openings consistent for the same reasons as ssnyc (Q10 looks the same AA). I normally raise 3xbb, unless the table has shown folds for less for a good amount of time.

I just haven't been able to bring myself to go from 3x to 2.5x when the antes start. Mainly because I normally start opening lighter to take down the blinds and often don't want a call from Ace small when I am stealing with Q10. Although this also inhibits people from calling with weak holdings when I hold a monster, I think I am probably stealing more with mediocre hands than missing out on callers with big hands.

I never open minraise.

I 3x everything al la Barry Greenstein (not that I think he's the greatest.. just something I do). Maybe 4x-5x really early on (20-30 chip blinds), and occassionally 2.5 times later stages after antes. I'm also adding one BB for every limper to any open.

I think I have found something in my game that needs changing and feel free to comment. In large field MTTs you really need to get a big stack going. You rarely just "average-stack" your way to the final table because at some point you with go card dead and get shortstacked fast. I would like to discuss and experiment with is larger opening raise sizes to bloat the pot when we can. Small ball sucks in these tourneys. . Is this something that anyone has had success with (5xing and occassionally more) or does 3 betting just take place of this thought when wanting to play for big pots?

I just re-read this ...and I'm willing to bet someone's already written an answer for this..

pretty solid nut..****st be why you are such a freakin Beast!

I 3 x till 50/100 then it's 2.3-2.7x

I don't vary raise size based on hand strength

Early stages I keep it simple. Bog standard 3 x my full range. In these early stages where limpers are everywhere i don't think you can make it any less than this becuase they are all calling. I dont think I've ever made a minraise in my life that wasn't a misclick, and I stick to the general rule of 3x +1 for each limper.

Its only when antes start to kick in do I think anyone should be adjusting their opens, although i have a habit of doing it from 75/150. I'll start opening to 2.5-2.6, generally making it 400 at this level. If theres a limpers Ill 3.6x it to about 550 depending on my stack size of course.

One thing I will say is once I decide on a bet size ill stick with it for the rest of that level, not switching until the next.

Late game the only time I will actually open 3 x is BvB to apply max pressure whilst being OOP.

you do want this call... 66% of the time he's going to c/f cause he doesnt hit a pair with his a6o.

even if you give him a draw say 6% of the time (which is high given the nature of his hand) you're still winning the pot 60% of the time.

then you factor in the times that he hits his small card and you hit 1 of your cards, and you get even more than a preflop raise out of him, you get a cbet called

the times that he calls with a2o and hits an ace, well, so be it... majority of the time he's not making a pair or better on the flop so who cares, let him bleed chips OOP. that's how we chip up.

I'm a big fan of the minraise open from the sb btw...................not


I usually just 3x from the sb and pretty rarely open light bvb

same

i hate the 200/400 level, it seems like i can never get respect raising to like 10xx or 11xx, but 1200 i'll get respect (well at least on stars) . at 120/250, 700 gets the job tho. i 2.5x everything when antes kick in, except for 200/400, hehe. i don't cut down raise sizes till the antes kick in.

on FTP i'll start cutting down my raise sizes cause of the more blind levels, usually around 40/80 to 200 and 50/100 to 259, then 60/120 to 300, 80/160 to 400, etc.

i never do a full 3x late in a tourney, or a minraise. usually i won't do like a "minraise" to like 2.2x, i like around 2.4x with 9's at the end!!

sorry to hijack, well, not really

how often do you guys complete the blind with no action in front?

i tried raising a full 3x from the SB, but this looks WEAKER to most players if you've been 2.5xing or whatever. I 2.5x from the blinds and still get the same amount of respect imo

pretty much never unless theres a total aggro moron in the bb and i have QQ+

but i still usually raise that anyway cause im never limping anything but those hands.. balancing ranges and all that