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Is Alec Torelli wrong about this? Is Alec Torelli wrong about this?

06-16-2017 , 02:47 PM
I have been watching Alec Torelli's videos where he says you should fold certain hands in tournaments that you would call in cash games. He says that losing chips hurts you more than winning chips helps you (since you don't win all the money if you win all the chips). I put this advice into practice in a $200 buy-in live tournament yesterday, and it cost me.

I had about 22BB left, and the blinds were going up soon, so I would have under 15BB left after posting my next blind. I look down at AKs UTG and open to 3x BB, and a big stack pushes all-in. I knew he wouldn't have shoved with AA or KK, so I was pretty certain he had a pocket pair in the 99-JJ range. I would normally call in this spot, but I remembered Alec Torelli's advice and decided to fold. I asked the guy what he had, and he told me JJ.

A few hands later, I was down to 12 or 13 BB and flat call with 77, one guy raised to 3x BB and another guy 3-bets to 6x BB. At this point, with only 11 BB left and the blinds coming around, I felt like I had to shove all-in, and got called by the 3-better who had AA. I would have been way better off calling the AK vs. JJ.

Torelli says that you should play more cautiously in tournaments because preserving your stack is more valuable than trying to double up, but I think it's the opposite. You should play more aggressively and take risks in tourneys because if you don't, you'll end up in a situation where you're down to 10BB or less even though you've barely played any hands the whole tournament, as opposed to cash games where you can sit there for hours folding hand after hand and you barely lose any money at all. Am I wrong about this?
Is Alec Torelli wrong about this? Quote
06-16-2017 , 02:59 PM
Well when he says "fold certain hands" I don't think that specifically means hands like AKs. I personally just don't see enough reasons to fold AKs to a 4-bet jam from a big stack in a tournament like this. Like you said, the range he has when he makes this play is somewhat capped. I'm just rarely folding here with around 20bb, just my opinion.


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Is Alec Torelli wrong about this? Quote
06-16-2017 , 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtiangold
Well when he says "fold certain hands" I don't think that specifically means hands like AKs. I personally just don't see enough reasons to fold AKs to a 4-bet jam from a big stack in a tournament like this. Like you said, the range he has when he makes this play is somewhat capped. I'm just rarely folding here with around 20bb, just my opinion.


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I would add that there are plenty better hands we can fold from UTG, hands like 99, TT, KQ, KJ, maybe even JJ and AQ. If your UTG Opening Range is a little wider than normal, obviously you'll have plenty of better hands to fold. I'm thinking we definitely want to be getting it in with our AA-QQ, and AK like 95% of the time.


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Is Alec Torelli wrong about this? Quote
06-16-2017 , 03:25 PM
The general principle is correct - you have to be more protective of your chips in a tournament because you can't reload. In a cash game, assuming you're properly bankrolled, you can play very loose because you benefit from bigger implied odds and can reload if you lose.

The problem is you are misinterpreting and misapplying the principle. Shortstack poker is largely robotic. With 22bb and the blinds about to climb and hit you, getting it in pre with AKs is automatic. And with 13bb and 77, you should be shoving or folding - flatting there is just bad tournament poker.

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