Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > Tournament Poker > Small Stakes MTT

Notices

Small Stakes MTT Discussion and analysis of small stakes MTT strategy

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-09-2012, 02:42 PM   #1
newbie
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 21
AA on KKx flop

    Poker Stars, $1.25 Buy-in (15/30 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #13153461

    UTG+2: 3,000 (100 bb)
    Hero (MP1): 4,200 (140 bb)
    MP2: 2,770 (92.3 bb)
    MP3: 4,910 (163.7 bb)
    CO: 2,970 (99 bb)
    BTN: 2,945 (98.2 bb)
    SB: 6,155 (205.2 bb)
    BB: 2,900 (96.7 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A A
    UTG+2 folds, Hero raises to 90, MP2 folds, MP3 calls 90, CO folds, BTN calls 90, SB calls 75, BB calls 60

    Flop: (450) 2 K K (5 players)
    SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, BTN bets 150, SB raises to 300, 1 fold, Hero?



    Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.
    Is checking the flop ok here? I felt I wasn't going to get better to fold and rarely get worse to call, so there was little value in betting.

    As played, what do you do after the BTN bets and the SB checkraises?
    BadBreaker is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-09-2012, 06:37 PM   #2
    Pooh-Bah
     
    killer_kill's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Oct 2007
    Location: Entertainment 720
    Posts: 3,816
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    I'd probably cbet for like 200~. Fold as played. Problem is SB raises with you still to act as the OR and you have button behind who can still 3b.
    killer_kill is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-09-2012, 06:44 PM   #3
    Pooh-Bah
     
    TomoDaK's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Feb 2008
    Location: Minneapolis, MN
    Posts: 5,555
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    I don't mind check or bet on flop. I'd lean towards betting ~180. your thought process about cbetting is spot on and I'd often check in higher buyins, but people in $1 are so bad and this is easiest street to get value on.

    Flop is an easy fold. When someone check/minraises this board with a small army behind they have king or better nearly always
    TomoDaK is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-09-2012, 06:50 PM   #4
    Pooh-Bah
     
    killer_kill's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Oct 2007
    Location: Entertainment 720
    Posts: 3,816
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    Yeah, I def wouldn't mind a flop check of course. But the main thing is the buy in. I honestly had literally 180~ typed out and deleted it for 200 since it's a $1 mtt lol.
    killer_kill is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-10-2012, 04:50 PM   #5
    veteran
     
    BigVach's Avatar
     
    Join Date: May 2010
    Location: Canada
    Posts: 2,700
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    agreed with these guys.
    BigVach is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-10-2012, 05:43 PM   #6
    old hand
     
    XMenCypher's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Aug 2011
    Location: fish pond
    Posts: 1,523
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    bet 200 otf, and then it's a fold
    XMenCypher is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-11-2012, 04:17 AM   #7
    deviation of equilibrium
     
    furo's Avatar
     
    Join Date: May 2009
    Location: Germany
    Posts: 27,486
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    wp if you folded.
    furo is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-11-2012, 11:30 AM   #8
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    ssnyc's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Aug 2005
    Location: with the wind at our stern...
    Posts: 37,723
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    I think flop is a pretty simple bet/ fold without any real read that they are capable of shenanigans
    ssnyc is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-11-2012, 01:11 PM   #9
    newbie
     
    Join Date: May 2012
    Posts: 21
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by furo View Post
    wp if you folded.
    Can't tell is sarcastic or not, but yes, I did fold.
    BadBreaker is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-11-2012, 01:13 PM   #10
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    ssnyc's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Aug 2005
    Location: with the wind at our stern...
    Posts: 37,723
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BadBreaker View Post
    Can't tell is sarcastic or not, but yes, I did fold.
    Don't think it was sarcastic at all. It's a good fold. Betting flop or checking are debatable but I think most will agree to fold with the given action
    ssnyc is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-11-2012, 01:53 PM   #11
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    CBorders's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Feb 2008
    Location: yo no soy por aqui
    Posts: 15,867
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    I'd check the flop with the intention of betting somewhere else. Our hand is good enough to get value from others but not good enough to withstand much heat. I'd like to keep their ranges wide on the flop since there usually won't be many turn or river cards that would make us uncomfortable of our equity in the hand. I think if we check we can let villains improve somehow on the turn and river, be it picking up a draw or just catching a pair that they'd probably call one street with. If you bet the flop and get called you're probably done with that hand because villains range is going to be weighted heavily towards hands that are way ahead and are allowing you to value own yourself. If you check you give yourself a chance to get choose a sizing to maximize risk/reward on the turn and river. If the turn is an offsuit card that doesn't really connect with the board you can check and if it checks through you can bet 150 on the river to induce a hero call or bluff catch attempt. You're getting the same value as a flop bet but you have a lot more information about the hand ranges you're up against and you can make a better decision. By sizing it smaller you can induce a call and if he has a king he'll want to get more value with his hand so he's going to have to raise to something and you can just fold.

    Obviously there is some risk to checking the flop, such as giving pocket pairs infinite odds to improve on future streets, but I think this risk is worth it.
    CBorders is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-12-2012, 01:54 AM   #12
    veteran
     
    BigVach's Avatar
     
    Join Date: May 2010
    Location: Canada
    Posts: 2,700
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CBorders View Post
    I'd check the flop with the intention of betting somewhere else. Our hand is good enough to get value from others but not good enough to withstand much heat. I'd like to keep their ranges wide on the flop since there usually won't be many turn or river cards that would make us uncomfortable of our equity in the hand. I think if we check we can let villains improve somehow on the turn and river, be it picking up a draw or just catching a pair that they'd probably call one street with. If you bet the flop and get called you're probably done with that hand because villains range is going to be weighted heavily towards hands that are way ahead and are allowing you to value own yourself. If you check you give yourself a chance to get choose a sizing to maximize risk/reward on the turn and river. If the turn is an offsuit card that doesn't really connect with the board you can check and if it checks through you can bet 150 on the river to induce a hero call or bluff catch attempt. You're getting the same value as a flop bet but you have a lot more information about the hand ranges you're up against and you can make a better decision. By sizing it smaller you can induce a call and if he has a king he'll want to get more value with his hand so he's going to have to raise to something and you can just fold.

    Obviously there is some risk to checking the flop, such as giving pocket pairs infinite odds to improve on future streets, but I think this risk is worth it.
    you should post in SS more often lol this changed my mind.
    BigVach is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-12-2012, 01:56 AM   #13
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    desperad0oo7's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Dec 2008
    Location: near your blinds
    Posts: 9,407
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    I like check otf with so many players since betting there on such a dry flop looks very strong and kind of isolates us against Kx. as played lolfold is good
    desperad0oo7 is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 06-12-2012, 05:25 AM   #14
    deviation of equilibrium
     
    furo's Avatar
     
    Join Date: May 2009
    Location: Germany
    Posts: 27,486
    Re: AA on KKx flop

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BadBreaker View Post
    Can't tell is sarcastic or not, but yes, I did fold.
    no, good fold.

    cboaders nailed it with his post why check> bet flop and there is no real decision vs a bet and a minraise, simple fold readless and snapfold since SB basically turned his hand face up. c/minraise vs 4 other players in the hand on a paired board is mostly the nuts.
    if it goes bet, call i think we can overcall getting a decent price vs 1/3 bets. they will mostly dont bet worse hands OTT 3way.
    furo is offline   Reply With Quote

    Reply
          

    Thread Tools
    Display Modes

    Posting Rules
    You may not post new threads
    You may not post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are Off
    Pingbacks are Off
    Refbacks are Off



    All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:37 AM.


    Powered by vBulletin®
    Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
    Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
    Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive