'CATS WIN!! 'CATS WIN!! 'CATS WIN!!

Supposedly he was also a parent of a student at the school. Have you heard anything more regarding that?

Yeah, when the thing about his mother also being a teacher there, it beagan to roam into soap-opera coincidence.

First paragraph: That's a different story. I'm not saying that the state should freely divulge all information to the media.

Second: Let's assume I agree with you that that is "messed up". Who's fault is that? In my opinion, the fault resides with the public, because they are the ones demanding this information.


Well, this is probably true at times. One problem in this discussion is that "the media" is not some massive singular entity. "The media" is composed of many, many different groups with different aims. As it should be.


Bolded -- is there evidence of that? On the face of it, I'd disagree, but admit I haven't done a ton of research there.

And yes, mass murderers probably are trying to make a point. But the second sentence doesn't necessarily follow from the first. It's just a "happy" side-result.


I should have been more accurate in my language. It's not that the Columbine killers were ACTUALLY bullied to a massive extent, it's that they believed that they were (that's what I remember from researching this when it happened, it's been a while). Something of a persecution complex, one that is found throughout survivalist/gun nut/far-right-wing literature. What could account for this disparity between reality and perception? Mental illness seems like a big one.

This is a good point. Gun nuts are obsessed with doomsday scenarios in which THE STATE comes in to forcefully take everybody's guns (see my above statement re: persecution complexes). It quite literally could spark a civil war. Of course, this war would last about 2 weeks. These dudes suffer from a weird delusion that they would have a shot against the US military, because of "guerrilla warfare herp derp". This isn't 1776. Or even 1965. They have tanks and planes and predator drones. And probably all sorts of other **** we're not even aware of. You have the equivalent of sticks and stones.

In this scenario, the civilian militias are a team composed of SSSH's 12 best basketball players and the US government is the Miami Heat. We're gonna lose 274-2 (I think I could get a bucket vs. Norris Cole).

I don't want all of this to indicate that I'm a far-left anti-gun wingnut. I'm very mildly pro-gun, in that I don't really care if some citizen has one. But it's a big reason why I can't get with the US Libertarians. Those guys are unnaturally obsessed with guns.

I don't really know much else. Just saw that earlier and lol'd because there were literally people on TV yesterday going into these deep Oedipus complexes and **** talking about the kids being an extension of the mother as a reason for killing them, etc. I'm gonna act like the only thing we really know right now is that 26+1 people are dead.

Agreed, and I'd extend it further: If someone really, really wants to kill you, they'll find a way to do it.

Also, I just slept for 15 hours straight. Went to bed at 1 and woke up at 4PM. WTF is that all about?

LOL reminds me of this episode of Doomsday Preppers where a lady thought she was gonna fight off the storm troopers with a fire poker. The argument of gun control --> forceful gov't takeover because we can't defend ourselves is so ROFL. It really highlights what the real war is (psychological control) and how it's already been lost miserably by us.

Fewer guns leads to fewer gun homicides. Agree or disagree?

.

however, it would be anything but civil.

if someone also really wanted to create a gun, they'll find a way to do it.

google 'ak 47 shovel northeast shooters' for the lulz.

it's also very, very easy to create a zip gun with parts you can find in a hardware store (or your basement/garage) - zip guns are mostly capable of only holding a single round.

Even if this is a given I don't think it could be extended to mass murders. Correlation != causation. Ppl who really want to murder or commit various illegal acts w guns will end up w guns. I'm not a gun guy myself but can understand the gun ppl bc they have so much in common w the poker ppl.

The Iraqis have held off our military for almost a decade with some home-made explosives and small arms. Tanks and things aren't terribly useful for controlling a population: you need soldiers on the ground. You can't round people up with a tank.

Without an armed populace, a government could disappear someone quietly in the middle of the night with an econoline van, a couple pistols and some cheap thugs. With an armed populace, they need all sorts of expensive technology you're talking about: helicopters and things. They also need to find crazier thugs that are willing to get shot at. Making the cost of some action 50x higher reduces the likelihood that some charismatic nutcase can round people up on a large scale.

Depends. Zero guns on the planet leads to zero gun homicides. When you've got more than one gun out there it depends who has it.

Right, because that's never happened anywere else in the world. A dictator has never taken over a country, right?

And yet, recent history says the above is wrong.

Civil war if the 2nd Amendment is nullified? If the government can just cancel that, what makes you think the rest of the Bill of Rights is safe?

Oh, and 'CATS WIN AGAIN!! 'CATS WIN AGAIN!! 'CATS WIN AGAIN!!

This time over 5th ranked Florida in basketball.

Why do u have to draw the line at guns tho, why not at knives bats and like the rest of the developed world?
I am genuinely curious about why US has such off the charts murder statistics. The easy available guns are after all the one thing in which US differs a lot from the countries they are compared to. Most other things about culture/society should be pretty similar.

The argument that guns should be spread out in public in case of invasion is about the only good argument i can think of. But then clearly you would have strict rules with training and various checks in place to ensure it didnt get into the wrong hands

The US has high murder stats because of the drug war.

In the 20th century you were 27x more likely to be killed by your own government than by homicide (not just gun homicide, all homicide). Somehow Americans understand that governments are dangerous more than Europeans, despite all the incredible suffering that Europe has endured over the last century.

Doomsday Preppers itt

really? Is there any kind of statistic backing up this statement?

Seems weird to me because i believe drugs in general are just as much of a problem in europe and also that the police/governemt go after all parts of the drug network in a similarly hard way.
Criminals in europe are also likely armed just as heavily with guns etc..
Like someone mentioned if u want a gun u can get a gun in any european country fairly easily but the difference is that everyone and their mother doesnt have easy access to a gun here, and u cant just go to a store and buy one like u buy a pack of cigarettes. This is where the problem lies imho.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_vio...elated_to_guns

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ted_death_rate

interesting imo

an armed society is a polite society

class differences are much larger and there is much less social mobility. poor, uneducated, dumb people + gun culture = dead people. this is not rocket science.

its not like harvard graduates shoot more people than your average european, easy access to guns or not.

on a related note, I don't think I have seen a number on school shootings per capita. somehow europeans tend to forget that there are 5M people in Norway and 350M(?) people in america . . .

FFS this guy is persistent, lol at Mr Karroo

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for sample issue we should combine all of europe. And I think the population is then like 700M or so in europe.
Not sure of exact numbers but school shootings are for a fact far more common in US than europe.
I also dont think class difference or poverty is a likely explanation. Plenty of countries in europe arent that different class-difference wise, and several have more poor and desperate people than US.

Violent history and violence in media (pc games and movies) is another explanation u hear a lot that 100% doesnt explain anything