Sounds racist.

There's experiments in mice that have shown isolating the genes for aggression can be entirely mitigated by environment.

For dogs there's a lot of variables. One major thing is that the type of person who breeds shih tzus and the type of person who owns them is not the same type of person who is likely to neglect, abuse, or raise that dog for aggression. Nobody gets a shih tzu to look tough. On the other hand, someone wanting to look tough is pretty likely to get a pit bull, a staffy, a tosa, or something on those lines. Added to this is how well dogs pick up on social cues from their owners, and a bad owner ends up with a bad dog. It's not even abuse or anything close to it, necessarily, it's an owner who never cares enough to curb its aggressive mentality or perhaps is just ignorant of the indicators of its growing tendencies.

And then you have to look at the damage potential of the breed. You're never going to read about a shih tzu getting loose and savaging a person because, quite simply, they can't. Dogs that have been historically bred for fighting, however, have a massive bite strength comparatively. Enough to destroy muscle in a person. If that dog acts out once in its lifetime, it makes local headlines and goes the way of old Yeller.

German Sheperds are a good example. If you ever see them with police for crowd control (you see them sometimes here if they're expecting trouble at football matches) you'll see them barking, straining on the lead, looking crazy. But if you ever see them somewhere like an airport, they're quiet and calm as you like, because the dogs for crowd control are trained to give the right impression, and it's a breed that is very trainable.

This isn't to say that dogs don't have individual personalities, they do, or that some breeds don't have strong tendencies, they do, but if you have the knowledge, time, and experience, and get it at a young enough age, I'm confident any dog can be raised well. The nature vs nurture argument is a very complicated and ongoing one, but that's my take on all that I've seen and read.

Genetics do have a lot to do with it. Temperament is a heritable trait in dogs. I have been involved in bloodhounds for a long time (I own 3 currently) and the reputable bloodhound breeders that I know have worked very hard to keep bloodhounds with temperament issues out of their lines. I have had two with serious temperament issues (both were males, both I got as puppies) while maybe 10 or so that didn't. I treat them all well. Also hip displexia is an issue with certain breeds with bloodhounds. There is an organization in the USA called the Orthopedic Health Foundation for Animals (OFA) that maintains a database on pure bred dogs in the condition of their hips, elbows, etc. if you are buying a pure bred dog from a reputable breeder they will have had the parents of the dog tested and the results of the tests submitted to OFA. The results are available online. I had a really nice bitch fail her OFAs and had to have her spayed. I have traveled to the UK to buy a dog and got a dog from France. The kind of testing that I'm describing wasn't happening in either place back in 2009. Not sure about the current situation.

Dogs have elbows?

Yes.

This is all obviously correct, especially the bolded in regards to that specific bit of confirmation bias, but now we're gonna enter the fun territory of seeing how the people who take a strong 'nature' stance almost all line up on 1 side of the political spectrum.

You'll never guess which side!

ethnic/asia/filipino/dog stew


Exported from MasterCook *

Stewed Dog (wedding style)

Recipe By : Joe Sweeney
Serving Size : 30 Preparation Time :3:00
Categories : Ethnic Lamb
Philippines

Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method
-------- ------------ --------------------------------
3 kg dog meat -- * see note
1 1/2 cups vinegar
60 peppercorns -- crushed
6 tablespoons salt
12 cloves garlic -- crushed
1/2 cup cooking oil
6 cups onion -- sliced
3 cups tomato sauce
10 cups boiling water
6 cups red pepper -- cut into strips
6 pieces bay leaf
1 teaspoon tabasco sauce
1 1/2 cups liver spread -- ** see note
1 whole fresh pineapple -- cut 1/2 inch thick

1. First, kill a medium sized dog, then burn off the fur over a hot fire.
2. Carefully remove the skin while still warm and set aside for later (may be
used in other recpies)
3. Cut meat into 1″ cubes. Marinade meat in mixture of vinegar, peppercorn, salt
and garlic for 2 hours.
4. Fry meat in oil using a large wok over an open fire, then add onions and
chopped pineapple and suate until tender.
5. Pour in tomato sauce and boiling water, add green peper, bay leaf and tobasco.
6. Cover and simmer over warm coals until meat is tender. Blend in liver spread
and cook for additional 5-7 minutes.

* you can substiture lamb for dog. The taste is similar, but not as pungent.
** smooth liver pate will do as well.


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Suggested Wine: San Miguel Beer
Serving Ideas : Rice, naturally.

NOTES : During my wedding reception, my brother- in-law suggested we add to the
feast by having dog stew. Wanting to be part of the family, and having been
subjected to all sorts of socials tests already, I agreed. The result was...
well.. a lot better than I expected. In fact, it was great!

**************************************

Wiki has this to say about eating dog in South Korea:

Dog_meat_consumption_in_South_Korea

I've never tried it, and I don't think I ever would. I can't do frogs legs, cow tongue, alligator or maggot cheese, either. I do, however, love Thymus glands.

These are all very good points and it's impossible to know for sure what ratio of nature nurture there is. Add some randomness to that mix.

My point was that if you get a shihtzu from a breeder, you pretty much know what you're getting. Pound puppies are an unknown quantity. It's great to want to adopt, but if you need a puppy for a toddler, then you may want more control over your choice.

Which I think you'll find was exactly my advice for Wil when he said he wanted a German Sheperd and had a kid in the way.

As a pointless aside, one of the funniest behavioural cases I came across was a dog who used to go absolutely bat**** crazy whenever the terrible English soap Eastenders would come on TV. Barking, shrieking, running around, the whole lot. Eventually they figured out that that was the only time of day the elderly owner turned up their hearing aid, and the occasional high pitched squeak drove the poor dog nuts. Over time, it became conditioned to hate soaps as much as I do.

:thumbsup:

Except I meant a kid on the way, not in the way. Doubt his kids will attempt hostile prevention of getting a puppy.

Yeah, I dunno, I've heard the North American Soaphater breed is genetically predisposed to not liking British soap operas. Every non-scientist with an unscientific blog seems to agree.

My favorite is when a story of a pitbull mauling somebody is linked, and the story inevitably has something like, "Pitbull breaks free from chain in backyard and mauls neighborhood child." Oh, so the dog lived on a chain in a backyard. Ok. If I was doin' science and junk I'd call that a variable or data point or something, but hey.

look, no wil. everything gets boring.

i'll take over. pitbulls should all be killed because they promote homosexuality.

you ****ing douchebag. lick my nuts.

Lol

It's usually the line "He's never done anything like that before" that I hear. What it means is "I never noticed". One of the benefits of growing up with a vet in the house was having body language in animals pointed out all the time.

Back to my comment about police dogs, when you see them on the lead and barking, looking all threatening, they're usually not being aggressive at all. That's why the handler isn't bothered. Dogs love barking at stuff. I know it won't feel like playing if they set them loose, but that's what it is. You don't want a police dog that's nervous/dominant aggressive, you want one that's very well balanced but likes playing the bitey game when told.

Was going to post this song when I saw the thread title. That's a deep cut.

Jeez. Did you laugh at Karenin in The Unbearable Lightness of Being?

Important information on picking a dog breeder:

http://www.businessinsider.com/navy-...-by-dog-2017-2

Did not see that movie. Googled it so I know the reference. No, I would not have laughed. Or, I should say; I only would have laughed if they BBQ the dog Karenin and ate it. Much more worthy and useful death than euthanasia. A hearty laugh at something finally done correctly to fully honor the doggie.

And I do prefer dogs to most humans. Just ask Mat. In both society and in the pot for a final spicy dog stew. Washed down with a good beer. There is also a wonderful enlightening reference to the Lewis and Clark Expedition about dogs that I could make, but I won't. Look it up on your own.

The book's better than the movie. I think you'd like it or at least find it interesting. It's a novel, but with a lot of philosophy mixed in.