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snow or draw vs unexpected action snow or draw vs unexpected action

07-01-2017 , 06:03 PM
weird spot that I don't think I've been in before, wasn't expecting villians line and was unsure how to proceed. FWIW he has bet folded in similar spots twice in the past.

midstakes 2-7 game, UTG straddles, hijack opens, i call button 234 2x, blinds fold and straddle calls, 3-2-2. I catch a 8 and a 3rd 2. hijack bets and we both call, 2-pat-1. I catch the 4th deuce, hijack bets I raise, straddle folds and hijack calls. He says well that changes things and now draws 2..... We have 2348 with 4 dead deuces, he also will not have a reshuffle.

do we snow or just try and get there. I hate snowing because our draw is pretty strong but if hes going to break and draw 2 here then I don't know if he will even call our pat unless he has an 8, and thats going to be very hard to make
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-01-2017 , 11:53 PM
1) You are repping pat hand and he seems to believe you

2) he needs an impossible card to make his 7 (assuming that's what he's drawing to)

so I think raising to break turns into a snow. He still has to avoid pairing himself to keep your snow from becoming an accidental vbet - and he believed you on turn so why not river.

If you had gone 2-2-pat, I'd def keep drawing, as that line looks more snowy. But going 2-1-pat more believable and you have a key piece of info he doesn't have access to (otherwise I think he would've either folded turn or gritted his teeth and patted 98763 or whatever).

little more read dependent than most spots, but as you noted, it's pretty uncommon
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-02-2017 , 02:53 AM
To answer the question, I would pat and snow. With no 2 it's gonna be really hard for him to make anything and when you draw it's much easier for him to talk himself into calling if you catch a bluff card.

Going back to earlier in the hand:
I am usually in the draw 2 = call draw 1 or less = raise camp, but in this case with a straddle you have to raise. There are three people who have put money into this pot blind, one of which will be able to call getting insane odds (the straddle). The extra 2 and the fact that 234 isn't SUPER strong multiway all argue for a raise.
On the flop you again HAVE to raise. The pot is humongous with the straddle and you really need to punish anyone who wants to draw 2 or more again. Either they will fold and forfeit their equity in the pot or pay a high price to try to realize it. The flop bettor should bet any improvement so it's not like you're raising into a known pat hand. To me, these points are more important than the actual question you asked.
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-02-2017 , 04:15 AM
Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow...imho...
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-03-2017 , 12:46 AM
Easy 3b pre?
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-03-2017 , 11:09 AM
I also 4bet pre.

Gotta snow here, best he can make is 86543...if he is calling to make an 8 you also have a 3 and 4 dead.

Given no deuces left and assuming he is drawing 2 to an 8, strongest 2cds are 843, 853, 863 to which 3s are 4s are key.
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote
07-05-2017 , 09:03 AM
I think snow is the option for all the reasons quoted, plus - he is likely to have some of the cards you are wanting if you draw. Neither of you is likely to improve to a really strong hand, but if you draw he could beat you when you check back with some weak showdown hand like a Q or J.
snow or draw vs unexpected action Quote

      
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