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Draw and Other Poker Discussion of poker games not covered elsewhere (e.g. badugi, draw, triple-draw, pineapple)

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Old 07-15-2012, 06:31 AM   #16
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Villain w be dealt 2 cards to an 8 w a 2 or 3 in roughly 2/3 of all hands if my calculations are correct.

Problem w 3 betting OOP is one of RIO. Hero will win a small pot a low % of the time, but the rest of the time will have bloated the pot OOP. Bloating the flop pre results in much larger pots on later streets. Of course, hero's equity will be ahead of villain's range but the difficulty of playing OOP MORE THAN offsets that edge imo (obv hard/impossible to quantify).

Further, there are times that villain has a strong enough hand to 4 bet, further compounding the difficulty.

Unlike PLO, getting AI/having low SPR advantages the player in position as he can draw much more correctly than the OOP player.
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Old 07-15-2012, 12:45 PM   #17
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

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Originally Posted by mixgameADDict View Post
Villain w be dealt 2 cards to an 8 w a 2 or 3 in roughly 2/3 of all hands if my calculations are correct.
Is a two-card Eight draw an estimate for the bottom of an open-defending range when we rr pre, or just a way of showing that he's only on pure nothing approximately 33%?
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Old 07-15-2012, 07:04 PM   #18
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

Don't think a small raise OOP does you much good with anything predraw here...

Really easy ship here, we're ahead or flipping here and he might make a mistake either patting behind with worse or breaking better which only helps our equity.

Also, really? "Trippel"?
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Old 07-15-2012, 08:28 PM   #19
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

Funny I didnt see that. Trippel is scandi-spelling of the word and I dont think ChipsAhoya is scandi?
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Old 07-15-2012, 08:55 PM   #20
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

lol no, but I like spelling it like that; who changed the title?

so Vince, what do you 3 bet OOP then?
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Old 07-15-2012, 09:06 PM   #21
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

Any 1 card draw or pat hand.
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Old 07-15-2012, 09:17 PM   #22
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

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Any 1 card draw or pat hand.
Same if you're 200 BB deep?
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Old 07-15-2012, 09:49 PM   #23
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

Why would that change anything?
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Old 07-15-2012, 10:19 PM   #24
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re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

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Why would that change anything?
With more money to play seems like there should be a non-zero number of hands we should reraise if villain is opening 90+ percent buttons, if only to get folds from his crap hands that can develop equity if we don't.

Maybe there isn't, that's what I'm asking about.
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Old 07-16-2012, 05:33 AM   #25
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Re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

We either valueraise or bluffraise and I think 3bet/draw 2 is too thin out of position at any stackdepth as a valueraise (makes us too easy to 4b bluff, we hardly gain if we get called and are ahead and lose lots when we put in money behind a card) and any bluff which then consists drawing 3 is kind of obvious as our opponent can see how many cards we draw. So we only reraise and then take 1 or none and our bluffs should do the same.
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Old 07-16-2012, 06:11 AM   #26
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Re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

title has been restored. great modding, imo.

Vince's strategy for the hand in question is quite solid. I can't say I'm surprised. If we were super, super deep and button opens nearly 100%, then 3 betting 3 OOP wouldn't be bad for value, but even up to 200bb like Vince has suggested, it just leads us to later trouble. And it also leads to the big problem of bloating a pot OOP.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:29 PM   #27
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Quote:
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Is a two-card Eight draw an estimate for the bottom of an open-defending range when we rr pre, or just a way of showing that he's only on pure nothing approximately 33%?
Both!
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:47 PM   #28
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While not GTO, against this villain type I'd primarily be 3betting for value (1 cds and pats obv) OOP w few bluffs as he is the type that likely "defends" his button too much.
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Old 07-16-2012, 05:07 PM   #29
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Re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

Het titeltje vaar fantastikoop! (how's my fake Dutch?)
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Old 07-16-2012, 09:10 PM   #30
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Re: $25/$50 PL Trippel Draw Hand

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Het titeltje vaar fantastikoop! (how's my fake Dutch?)
if it means my title is fantastic, then awesome!
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