"are you a forum guy?"
"has anybody ever been far as even decided to go want do even look more like?"

Alot of reg fish are on 2+2, your rakeback pro's, breakecen guys all are on 2p2 hahhaaha. Just try to win IMO

You seem to think that where evidence can't exist, the proper response is to believe whatever your intuitions or "common sense" tells you.

That's not what a critically thinking poker player does. If the evidence can't exist, stay agnostic.

And by the way, if you think that "WINNING" poker players and theorists (dealers I don't give a crap about) actually worry about this issue, you are way, way, way off. Which "theorists" do you actually have in mind? The theorists I know are far, far more worried about things that can be mathematically established, along with whatever psychological issues they incorporate into their game. And as for the winning poker players-- well, there are a number of us here in California, and none of them that I know of even break a sweat when they sit at tables with lots of strat talk.

Seriously, if you were right, all the "winning" players would move out of southern California. Because you just can't avoid this talk here, and obviously that means that all of our fish run away from the tables with their tails between their legs, right?

Winning players are really, really, good at math. And they are decent amateur psychologists. And they are good hand readers. And they are really, really good at seat selection.

And maybe, after worrying about all those things, they MIGHT have an opinion about stupid table talk. Maybe. More likely, they won't care.

Get over it. If you don't like strat talk, don't talk strategy. If you do, go ahead. If you want to make money, don't think about this issue-- it's like 99 times less important than math, seat selection, avoiding tilt and knowing your own weaknesses, etc.

But don't tell me about this mythical group of "winning" players who are aghast that someone out there is "educating the fish". They don't exist. It's the players who don't know their own leaks who are worried about this one.

This was answered above. The position I am taking-- "there's no proof that this stuff matters, and plenty of reasons to believe that wild claims about the effect of strat talk at tables is heavily influenced by various forms of bias"-- is not a position that requires mathematics. It's the opposite position that requires mathematics.

You are shifting the burden of proof here.

Wow, lawdude.

Not only are you completely failing to acknowledge that the games you play are atypical of the games usually discussed in these threads...

...but you're being a real dick about it.

Step back, dude. Breathe.

I just pretend I'm a FOB Asian. The only reasoning I ever give to my play if ever asked is superstitious nonsense.

"I had fwush dwahh, I cawll"... sometimes I wish I was asian so I could level people.

I'm not being a dick about anything. There's like 20,000 things that people need to worry about to bring their winrate up, and strat talk at the table is not one of them. Worrying about this issue is-- at best-- a distraction. At worst, it shows real flaws in one's mathematical mindset (i.e., an inability to distinguish anecdotes from statistically sound evidence). Really, I think the inability to see this issue for what it really is and to understand the questionable assumptions behind it is an indicator that there may be real leaks.

I tell them pockets fives is where it's at!

^^^ So much win!

Yep. Tons of bad strat talk at the tables. When the table psychic calls out my exact 2 wrong cards after the hand, I just smile or agree. I'm not there to educate or make friends.

I do play more online but in my 5+ years of going to HGC, I've never heard 2+2 mentioned once.

I'm sure it's been mentioned plenty of times when I'm not around though.

i could tell that one dude in the game was an obv 2p2er (nerdly strat blah blah blah)
i asked him "whats your screenname??" he's like 'it's du du duh" (he has since been perma banned from the casino, lol, so i might as well disclose sn. if you can geuss it correctly, tho, it makes the story way funnierl)
he asks "whats yours?"
I bulls*#yted ( = 'lying' while at a poker table), "i'm not on there"

then i went and read the hands, ect he posted. whoa, what a donk!

nothing personal, but my standard line is something like,
"if you can't physically see the volume of chips being put into the pot by the rec players/ gamblers plummet when the strat talk breaks out, you need to open your eyes."

I had one of 2 spots from the 5/10 game where there were 2 regs who are really bad about it going off, and he moved to the 3/5, and when i asked him "not that great over there", he said "too much talk".
real pros know how to create a gambling environment, and don't feel the need to be poseurs, which is the motivation behind 99% of strat chatter at the table, imo.
the need for attention/ recognition.

none of the players who engage in it when rec players are present are really that good, and if there are no rec players present, then why are they even playing?
any game where you can get away with it, cuz everyone is a poker nerd
is not worth playing in, anyways, unless you are just into doing flips, playing 2nd best holdem, ect...

talking poker would be the last thing i would want to talk about while i'm playing poker, anyways.
do you need to talk about golf the entire time youre playing golf? or about swimming while you swim?

Pretty sure EVERY poker author has covered the fact that keeping the game fun for everyone increases your winrate, and imo, talking strat is not fun for ALOT of the fish. They dont get it, dont want to get it, and just want to gamele. STFU, play the game, and try not to talk strat. The occaisonal meme reference is fine, but NO STRAT TALK AT THE TABLES!!!

Also, was unaware of the brown trout reference....gonna have to try that one at the casino and see if it raises any eyebrows.

I call super obvious hands out at the table from time to time to allay boredom. Other session, woman who was super LAG and getting hit by the deck did something like raise her BB to $5, check-raise a JJx board, bomb turn, bomb river and when V folded, show 2s and said you'll never guess what the 2nd card was at which point I said "obv Js."

She flips Js up and looks at me like I have three heads and with a sort of whispered, feverish intensity asks how I could have known that?

To which I replied "ldo I'm psychic".

I think people play me very trappy/passive after this, so hand reading is a nice image builder I suppose.