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Old 04-17-2012, 03:38 PM   #1
journeyman
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 339
Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

I know limping first to act is bad,and i have no problem with that,except this rare spot when i have a live 3-flush with a small door card utg, facing big cards behind.I want to play the hand but i feel that raising is too much,given how often it comes back 2 bets or even more to me.
I know limping unbalance my range b/c i always raise my big wired pairs and fold or raise depending on the situation my small split pairs.
Should i just fold this hands and not think much about it,especially with the tight ante structure?Here's some examples to create a better idea:

1.
Poker Stars $1/$2 Limit Stud $0.10 Ante - 8 players - View hand 1732526
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

3rd Street: (0.8 SB)
Seat 1: xx xx 9 ____Seat 1 calls____Seat 1 calls
Seat 2: xx xx A ____Seat 2 folds
Seat 3: xx xx 5 ____Seat 3 folds
Seat 4: xx xx T ____Seat 4 folds
Seat 5: xx xx K ____Seat 5 completes
Seat 6: xx xx 3 ____Seat 6 brings in for $0.50____Seat 6 calls
Hero: 5 7 3 ___Hero calls___Hero calls
Seat 8: xx xx 9 ____Seat 8 folds

2.
Poker Stars $2/$4 Limit Stud Hi/Lo $0.25 Ante - 7 players - View hand 1732533
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

3rd Street: (0.875 SB)
Seat 1: xx xx 3 ____Seat 1 completes
Seat 2: xx xx 7 ____Seat 2 folds
Seat 3: xx xx 3 ____Seat 3 brings in for $1____Seat 3 folds
Seat 4: xx xx 8 ____Seat 4 folds
Hero: K 8 5 ___Hero calls___Hero calls
Seat 6: xx xx J ____Seat 6 calls____Seat 6 calls
Seat 7: xx xx K ____Seat 7 folds

3.This one could be a raise maybe.
Poker Stars $2/$4 Limit Stud $0.25 Ante - 8 players - View hand 1732552
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

3rd Street: (1 SB)
Seat 1: xx xx 4 ____Seat 1 folds
Seat 2: xx xx A ____Seat 2 folds
Seat 3: xx xx A ____Seat 3 completes
Seat 4: xx xx Q ____Seat 4 folds
Seat 5: xx xx K ____Seat 5 folds
Seat 6: xx xx 2 ____Seat 6 brings in for $1____Seat 6 folds
Hero: 3 4 5 ___Hero calls___Hero calls
Seat 8: xx xx 7 ____Seat 8 folds

Last edited by FaraChef; 04-17-2012 at 04:07 PM.
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Old 04-17-2012, 05:17 PM   #2
adept
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 891
Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

Depends on many factors, e.g. what the game is like, how live your hand his, the cards behind you etc

Given the tight ante structure I would discard quite a couple of 3flushes in early position, especiall if they have more than 1 dead flush card, no straight potential, no overcards, dead pair cards etc

I don't see any reason to fold in your hands though.

Hand1: Completely live 3flush with plenty of straight potential. Even in the worst case (isolation against a big pair), you have 37% on 3rd and an easy decision on 4th.

Hand2: This is probably the closest hand since your pair card are a bit dead but there's not a lot of strength behind you. I would prolly give it a go (and probably raise instead of limping )but often fold against stronger doorcards.

Hand3: Even though your straight potential is hit by dead cards, you have about 40% against a big pair.

Why do you always raise your big wired pairs in tight games?

Last edited by BeenAWhile; 04-17-2012 at 05:26 PM.
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Old 04-17-2012, 08:45 PM   #3
journeyman
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeenAWhile View Post
Why do you always raise your big wired pairs in tight games?
I don't like limping it feels exploitable and weak to me.Also i don't raise 3 big cards utg and most often given the tight structure i don't raise small split pairs so either way people can put me on a big pair in the hole.Given that i prefer to maximize value by raising,people call light anyway and don't pay much attention at the stakes i'm playing.
That's actually why i have problems with this small 3-flushes,i don't know if i should raise them or fold,and end up limping.
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Old 04-18-2012, 01:56 AM   #4
old hand
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

I'd fold all three of those.
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:13 AM   #5
grinder
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

call in very lose games fold in tight imo
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Old 04-18-2012, 01:23 PM   #6
centurion
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

Quote:
Originally Posted by acesholdup View Post
I'd fold all three of those.
If hand 2 was stud hi would you still fold? Raise? How much does the dead K influence your decision in this spot?
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Old 04-18-2012, 02:59 PM   #7
Loaded for bear
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

Fold hand 2, raise the others. Lots of different reasons but if you are in early position you need a strong reason not to raise when entering a pot. Normally you should be opening, reraising or folding. Only weird passive game conditions with bad players would make me want to limp or flat any of these hands.

You raise because you'll also be raising your strongest hands and you don't want your opponents to know you haven't got one at the moment. Raise because your equity is good enough to play the pot heads-up if it comes to that but also does well if other people come along, and in that case make the pot as big as they'll let you.

You're dumping hand 2 because your straight and low outs are gone, along with an overcard pair card. You have so little secondary equity that you're only playing this hand for flush value in a pot that's likely to get chopped with a low hand.
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Old 04-18-2012, 03:26 PM   #8
Loaded for bear
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

It's weird mixing examples in discussion of stud8 and stud hi. Hand 2 is a raise in stud because you want to play a live 3-flush and your door card doesn't define your hand as much in that game, but as posted in stud8 it's a fold.
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:30 PM   #9
journeyman
 
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Re: Stud hi live 3-flush/small door card utg spots

My mistake in hand 2,i just saw it's a stud8 hand.I meant to post only stud high hands,so let's just assume it's stud high.
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