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| Stud Discussions of various forms of stud poker. |
07-25-2012, 05:05 AM
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#1
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grinder
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 437
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Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Poker Stars $20/$40 Limit Stud $4 Ante - 3 players - View hand 1834999
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter
3rd Street: (0.6 SB)
Hero: 8  2  A  ___Hero completes
Seat 2: xx xx Q  ____ Seat 2 brings in for $6____Seat 2 calls
Seat 3: xx xx K  ____Seat 3 folds
4th Street: (2.6 SB) (2 players)
Hero: 8  2  A  A  ___ Hero bets
Seat 2: xx xx Q  9  ____Seat 2 calls
5th Street: (3.3 BB) (2 players)
Hero: 8  2  A  A  7  ___ Hero checks___Hero calls
Seat 2: xx xx Q  9  Q  ____ Seat 2 bets
6th Street: (5.3 BB) (2 players)
Hero: 8  2  A  A  7  9  ___ Hero checks
Seat 2: xx xx Q  9  Q  3  ____Seat 2 checks
7th Street: (5.3 BB) (2 players)
Hero: 8  2  A  A  7  9  7  ___ Hero checks___ Hero raises
Seat 2: xx xx Q  9  Q  3  xx____ Seat 2 bets____Seat 2 calls
Bet double on 4th to clarify.
Looking back, assuming I used PPT correct, ch/k 5th is just bad.
Since I dont think we have any FE, should we just ch/f?
| Hand | Pot equity | Wins | Ties |
|---|
| 82AA7 | 28.16% | 168,967 | 0 | | JT, AA, 9*, Q* | Q9Q | 71.84% | 431,033 |
As played, once we get to 7th, should we just put in the bet or what do you guys think of a c/r in this spot?
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07-25-2012, 09:04 AM
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#2
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grinder
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Land of Unemployment
Posts: 507
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
games are going to get tougher because of you. too many good questions. i'd like to hear good answers too.
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07-25-2012, 10:44 AM
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#3
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grinder
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 583
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
i think you played it fine except 7th.i would just c/c.
since he checked 6th hes turning his hand face up so his most likely hand is qq+sd.
i doubt he will call with worse then trips or a straight but bet 2pair and sometimes bluff himself but all this is again read dependent.
Looking back to your simulation i think you can eliminate q*
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07-25-2012, 02:08 PM
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#4
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 14,898
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Also is he really calling 4th with a pair of 9s against open aces?
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07-25-2012, 03:51 PM
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#5
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old hand
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: New Zealand, The 80s
Posts: 1,867
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyBrooks
Also is he really calling 4th with a pair of 9s against open aces?
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Why would calling it with a pair of Qs be any better?
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07-25-2012, 07:07 PM
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#6
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 14,898
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davdob
Why would calling it with a pair of Qs be any better?
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I was tacitly agreeing that I didn't think QQ was in his range, and adding that I didn't see why a pair of 9s was either.
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07-25-2012, 09:13 PM
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#7
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: at JoeTall
Posts: 15,265
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
This is wide-ish range for your opponent is wide but probably more what your sim should look like:
| Hand | Pot equity | Wins | Ties |
|---|
| 8h2h|AsAd7s | 32.38% | 194,278 | 0 | | 22-AA, 9+9+, Q* |Qs9hQh | 67.62% | 405,722 | 0 |
So he's basically continuing with all 2-pair, obv trips and straight combos.
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07-25-2012, 09:28 PM
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#8
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old hand
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: New Zealand, The 80s
Posts: 1,867
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyBrooks
I was tacitly agreeing that I didn't think QQ was in his range, and adding that I didn't see why a pair of 9s was either.
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Oops. My thought as well. Actually pretty hard to construct a non silly call on 4th for villain here though.
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07-25-2012, 09:40 PM
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#9
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adept
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 822
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
My range for villain is AA,QQ,99,Q9,JT. We have 30% equity: 49% against JT (which he has 59% of the time) and 2% against the rest of the range. We need 32% to call down blind, but that's not a problem as we can fold 6th a lot (any 8-K if we don't improve, 8,Q,K if we don't make trup aa).
The problem is, we need to have a very good idea about what he does with JT and he needs to be doing it wrong. If he checks back 100%, easy call. If he barrels both streets 100%, call...but why would he do that? If we read his mind and find out he'll barrel 6/16 combos (making us nearly indifferent to calling or folding 6th), we should fold (and quit the game because he's a superuser and a reverse mind reader). There's probably a large range of percentages where we can't profitably call even if we know his strategy.
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07-25-2012, 09:52 PM
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#10
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old hand
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: New Zealand, The 80s
Posts: 1,867
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
I would be really surprised if he didn't start with JT or AA (but heavily weighted by math and play to JT).
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07-26-2012, 12:56 AM
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#11
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: montana usa
Posts: 9,047
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
most times its best to fold here after he hits his doorcard.
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07-26-2012, 04:27 PM
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#12
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Loaded for bear
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: chicago
Posts: 3,231
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Don't like c/c on Fifth. Either lead or c/f. You should lead to get value from JT, KJ preserve the dynamic for when we spike later or c/f if he ever plays split QQ like this on Third. If you check you're telling him to value bet his 2pr correctly or put in a bet with his straight draw holding good equity on Fourth, then give himself a free card on Fifth. Don't like the check on Fifth if you don't intend to fold.
c/r on river is pretty fancy and unlikely to make money. If you've bet the whole way you can bet the river because villain has decided to hang on with two pair sometimes and when he has us beat it's still hard to raise your board. As played here I don't know what to do but I'm pretty sure c/r isn't it.
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07-27-2012, 01:49 AM
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#13
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veteran
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Crushing
Posts: 2,324
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
5th is very iffy, I'm not even sure I like the c/r here on 7th. Villain is bad himself, and/or he thought you are extremely bad to actually be betting 7th there with Qs up.
Pretty sure this is the kind of spot where reads on the opponent's tendencies would help in getting input? Otherwise 5th through 7th stuff just won't do much...
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07-27-2012, 03:54 AM
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#14
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grinder
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 437
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Re: Stud 20/40- Open Aces on 5th
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Tall
This is wide-ish range for your opponent is wide but probably more what your sim should look like:
| Hand | Pot equity | Wins | Ties |
|---|
| 8h2h | AsAd7s | 32.38% | 194,278 | | 22-AA, 9+9+, Q* | Qs9hQh | 67.62% | 405,722 |
So he's basically continuing with all 2-pair, obv trips and straight combos.
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Yea, messed up a bit, this is more like it
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