pretty sick call down imo.


nvm, i guess hero felt he was very likely being squeezed.

Joe, I agree with you. My point was a different one though. It would be more or less impossible to prove that they only shared knowledge of hole cards, and don't softplay in the actual hands. Why we might get lucky with the finding of dodgy hand histories one day, they can continue to tell each other's hole cards til the end of times without anyone realizing it.

Unfortunately, there is no solution for this problem. Stud Hi (from the perspective of a low stakes player like me) is a combination of card information, aggression and playing marginal hands well. Therefore it's probably the most susceptible for collusion.

You and Joe could sit at an online table and tell each other your hole cards without anyone realizing it, or me and camz, or Daniel Negreanu and Liv Boeree. While it's against the rules, you can't stop anyone anywhere from doing that. If, however, hand histories show evidence of softplaying or other kinds of collusion, now you have a means and a reason to solve the problem. The poker sites just have to properly police it and adjudicate it.

I would prefer me an Liv, you and camz , negreanu and howard-coward.

Lol, email I got from Stars yesterday. Those colluders just wont give up

Ive only been playing Stud for cash games lately

"Account Credit‏
17/04/2012
Reply ▼

support@po​kerstars.co​m
To xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.com

Hello,

PokerStars has become aware of accounts who have violated our Terms of Service, to the potential detriment of other players. You played against these accounts and as a result you may have been adversely affected.

In a case such as this it is our policy to confiscate the balances of the offenders and for PokerStars to add funds where appropriate. This compensation pool is then distributed to players potentially affected in as fair a way as possible.

To confirm your credit, please log onto your PokerStars account, go to the 'Cashier' screen and click the 'History' button. Your share will be shown as "REFUND", followed by the amount of the credit.

The integrity of the games at PokerStars is of paramount importance and appropriate action will always be taken when players operate outside the Terms of Service. PokerStars works hard to police the games in order to proactively prevent such instances. However, in cases where it is discovered that rules breaches have occurred, the aim is to ensure that any players affected are compensated appropriately.

We regret that we will be unable to answer questions as to how your specific credit amount was calculated. Likewise, we are not at liberty to identify the specific games or players in question. Suffice to say that the offenders have been barred from the site and you will not encounter them again.

Thank you for your continued play at PokerStars. Please let us know if we can help you with any further issues or questions.

Best Regards,

xxxxxx
PokerStars Game Security Team"

Good stuff.may we ask which stakes you usually play?

I play small stakes, between 0.25/0.50 and 1/2 depending on BR and games running. Nice to know theyre watching the smaller games not only high stakes (although high stakes collusion is obviously far more serious).

This would have been 0.25/0.50 or 0.50/1

i gave up sending email to stars about this over the years.
Doesnt seem as blatant now, but 2-3 years ago it was ridiculous.
I only play stud8 midstakes to 30/60

3/6 to 10/20 was the ****ing worst. Never ever got a refund. Now they let multiple of them at the table. nice work stars

This chinese they are very organized, some of them they play in diferent countrys. Now they improve they game they do have discipline but they help heach other and share information, money, accounts and they don't need to collude to bad and medium players just sharin information about the player and playing whit him , but they do pure collusion sometimes, Exsample: when you are playing HU another chinese joins and is when they do the collusion quickly. I have names: ipukewin, Amainboard, woekpoker, China-UFO, ChuanOiAAA, jql68, Whitedentist, OK((-_-))Ko8 ,Leotiger608, supermaquin , iphone008, Bodhisattva6 , jql68 .

Have you considered the possibility that they are better players than you with, possibly, hundreds of thousands of hands more experience?

You are defending these chinese mmmm.... Any way. Yes some of them they are better than me but in most of the cases they do help heach other and do things very suspicious...
Pokerstars should clean the Stud tables!!!

PS: I'm better than most of them

sir, whats your SN on Stars?

the stud lobby is pretty ridiculous atm. looks pretty inviting...

I only moved from FLHE to Stud Hi last week (splashing around in the nanolimits for now), but watching all the bumhunting chinamen at 2/4 and higher makes me questioning my move already.


edit: HI ALL

I just read through this thread and checked Pokerstars...

and yep, all of the higher stakes tables have exactly 2 people from China sitting at them, with one person sitting out. Waiting for some sucker to come along they can scam...

This makes me sick to my stomach. Why does Pokerstars not have an employee assigned to watch these tables 24 hours a day and ban at the first sign of impropriety?! It's so frickin' obvious!

They're not waiting there to scam you. Just to take your money.

studs dead imo...no value in getting good at it...unless u r shaun deeb and plan to win 3 stud scoop high buyin events each year...so let the ****ing chinese wait...

I notice the 2 Chinese players at each table at razz at 1/2, 2/4 and 3/6. Seems like 3 guys change positions when one leaves...
These are the guys Im seeing in the afternoon north america time
Xmachine888
heyufeng
zippo520

How does the scam work, exactly?

There are always two players from the same province, usually from fuzhou or changlee doing this, but they always overplay their pocket pair or fold so how is the scam working? I read they got away with millions. I also read that no 2 players from china would be allowed to sit at the same table. I also heard that Internet poker is not a scam, but all I read about these days is scam scam scam.

I've played tens of thousands of hands against these players. I've often felt uncomfortable but not scammed. I just think they're tough opponents. Presumably PS doesn't think they're colluding either as they have reinstated their rights to play on the same tables.

It's sad that this is still an issue. I inquired about them in this forum almost five years ago.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/20...erstars-57632/

I don't want to believe they are cheating either, but I can't think of any other reason they sit all day two at a table NOT PLAYING.

And to answer how they cheat, from what I understand, they share hole cards and pick spots where they have good equity combined between the two of them and then they just jam the pot which creates a good deal of fold equity as well. Then once the mark is out, they slow play it to showdown or one of them could just fold or whatever... doesn't matter who wins at that point because they share a bankroll anyway.

Poker Stars reinstating their ability to play at the same tables just means they realized that the cheaters will make new accounts or whatever to get around the restriction anyway so they're only punishing the honest ones.

imagine stud-zoom and the chinese trying to share hole-cards, lol.
that'll teach them and clean it up.
do it like me and mail this wish to:
ideas@pokerstars.com

So are online high stakes stud games dead due to collusion?

That's one reason, yes.