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Old 01-17-2013, 04:14 PM   #1561
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

fyi, the $330 survival games are really picking up at Canterbury the last few months. The players are pretty competitive, about have regs. and half fish.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:11 PM   #1562
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

I was pleased to see two $2-$100 tables running at 11:30 last night...in the middle of a freakin' blizzard!

Crazy degens!
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:14 PM   #1563
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

According to Bravo there is an 8-16 Half Kill game going. When's the last time a limit game over 6-12 ran at RA? (During MSPT or SPC / MPC?)
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Old 02-15-2013, 01:22 AM   #1564
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

Ahh this can't be good....

http://kstp.com/news/stories/S2932754.shtml?cat=1
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:23 AM   #1565
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

What a shame, hope it doesnt happen.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:57 AM   #1566
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

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link doesnt work, what is that?
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Old 02-18-2013, 09:21 PM   #1567
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

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link doesnt work, what is that?


Push to Shut Down Running Aces Horse Track

A group of 1,500 thoroughbred race horse owners and trainers ask the Minnesota Racing Commission to revoke Running Aces' gambling license.

The Minnesota Horseman's Benevolent and Protective Association says Running Aces, near Forest Lake, is not in compliance with state law. The thoroughbred owners' group says it asked the Minnesota Racing Commission to revoke Running Aces's gambling license and the Commission confirmed that information with 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS.

A member of the Racing Commission says the state has taken the request under advisement and is reviewing the 200-page document submitted by MHBPA. An attorney for the group of thoroughbred owners tells 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS the state granted Running Aces a gambling license few years ago with the stipulation Running Aces give 3 percent of its card table money to the thoroughbred owners and trainers at Canterbury Park Horse Track in Shakopee. Attorney Cort Holten says Running Aces stopped making those payments last August and is no longer in compliance with state law. Holten says that's why his client, MHBPA, asked the Racing Commission to revoke Running Aces's license.

The Chairman of the Racing Commission was unavailable for a comment and Running Aces declined our request for an interview, but issued a statement. That statement says, in part, "it is unfortunate the thoroughbred owners are wasting the Racing Commission's and Taxpayers' time with a frivolous complaint." There is now information yet on when the Minnesota Racing Commission will act on the MHBPA's request. Running Aces has harness racing during the summer months and offers card gambling 24 hours a day, seven days a week. It also employs nearly 600 people.
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Old 02-21-2013, 02:22 PM   #1568
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

Here is our press release:
(Last paragraph, which has been bolded is the pertinent one)

Statement of Running Aces Harness Park

Columbus, MN - The following statement provides context and background on the decision of Running Aces Harness Park to review and renegotiate the simulcast agreement. During the period of review some simulcasting will be unavailable at Running Aces. Non-Thoroughbred racing via simulcasting will still be available.

Running Aces Harness Park, General Manager, Bob Farinella outlined the following points:

“Running Aces and Canterbury Park were permitted to offer all-breed simulcasting based in part on a mutual agreement between the two tracks. For the past five years, the annual agreement has automatically renewed without input by either party. This year, Running Aces decided to review and renegotiate the agreement.

The prior simulcast agreement provided for the following payments by Running Aces:
1. A purchase price to the originating race track for the horse racing signal (e.g. Churchill Downs and Gulfstream Park),
2. A payment to purses supporting Minnesota live racing based upon the breed involved in the horse racing signal, and
3. A net payment to Canterbury Park in the net amount of approximately $150,000 annually. The $150,000 net amount is not in any way connected to supporting horse purses. Canterbury Park provides no services or products to Running Aces for such payment. It is simply a subsidy extracted by Canterbury Park to benefit its bottom line.

As a result of this payment structure, Running Aces has paid almost all of its simulcast profitability to Canterbury Park over the past five years. Consequently, Running Aces suggested a deletion of the Canterbury Park fee, with the simulcast signal fees and breed purse payments remaining the same.

Running Aces has established a very strong and stable core business over the past four years. Unfortunately, the negative trend in simulcasting at Canterbury Park, which started well before Running Aces existed, continued at Canterbury Park, even though Running Aces business has been stable for the past four years. One could presume that the offering of all-breed simulcasting at Running Aces has contributed to Minnesota live racing purses to a much greater extent than would have been possible at Canterbury Park alone. In fact, Minnesota live racing purses will suffer without Running Aces ability to offer all-breed simulcasting.

The fairer terms Running Aces has proposed to Canterbury Park this year would continue the almost $500,000 annual benefit that all-breed simulcasting contributes to Minnesota live racing purses and continue the full service simulcasting benefit to the fan bases of each track. Running Aces should no longer have to pay Canterbury Park for races not held at Canterbury Park.

Our proposed change to the contract is sensible in light of costs and benefits and was a decision designed to better serve the horse community and guests of Running Aces. Unfortunately Canterbury Park has declined to renegotiate the contract, particularly with respect to the net fee it has been receiving.

On an additional note, in August, 2012 Running Aces halted purse payments from the card room to the MNHBPA, contending that the MNHBPA breached conditions of a joint agreement from 2005. This matter is now in litigation and has absolutely no bearing on the simulcasting matter mentioned above.
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Old 03-03-2013, 06:08 AM   #1569
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

I dropped by yesterday early afternoon. It has been a couple of months since I had been there - and never on a Saturday early afternoon. The place was packed - over 280 had started the morning $70 tournament.


I had to pick up some auction winnings a few miles from there, and decided to stop for a driving break, cash out my card dollars and play an hour for coupon. I signed up for 2-4 limiit and after a 30 minute wait got to a table.


I was surprised how much was pulled from the table (trying to figure out how much better than average you had to be to break even). The first dealer would turn 4 callers preflop $8, into $4 with $2 to his left (jackpot/promtion) and $2 to his right (rake) - right on top of the 10% rake card. Added to that would be the usual $1 or $2 tip and usually at least $5 / hand pulled from table. There is some sort of quads / jackpot promotion going on.


The table was mostly passives and guys that acted or actually did not know how to bet/blind. My plan was to be TAG, but VPIP on table was rather high so I turned into a tight/calling station, After 90 minutes I left for my drive home lucky to have beaten the rake and up $40.
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Old 03-03-2013, 03:32 PM   #1570
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

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I was surprised how much was pulled from the table (trying to figure out how much better than average you had to be to break even). The first dealer would turn 4 callers preflop $8, into $4 with $2 to his left (jackpot/promtion) and $2 to his right (rake) - right on top of the 10% rake card. Added to that would be the usual $1 or $2 tip and usually at least $5 / hand pulled from table. There is some sort of quads / jackpot promotion going on.
Yes, they have the highest rake I've ever seen. The rooms in europe are supposed to be worse, but I've never played there. Their method of front loading the drop makes the low stakes games brutal.

Your description doesn't sound quite right, but they pull money out fast. I believe that $2 comes out if there is a flop, and an additional $1 comes out when the pot reaches $10, $20, $30, and $40.

I played at the Venetian a few weeks ago on vacation in LV, and they use a slower drop methodology. The rake was $4 versus the $6 Running Aces rake, but they pulled $1 when the pot reached $10, $20, $40, and $60. As I was playing 4/8 limit the difference was significant. Hand where players folded to a bet on the flop or turn were often raked $2 versus the $5 that RA would take.
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Old 03-03-2013, 05:11 PM   #1571
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

We take a $2 promotional/jackpot rake on any flop. This is used to fund jackpots, aces cracked, $5 an hour, and many other promos. Most importantly, this money goes back to the players.

As for our own rake, we take 10% up to $4 for most games. So $1 at $10, $20, $30, and $40.

On 6/12 or higher games we rake 5% up to $4. So $1 at $20, $40, $60, and $80.

Hope that clears up any confusion.
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Old 03-03-2013, 08:07 PM   #1572
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

clearly the dealer I had did not know the rules (or was doing what was told). I did not feel like making an ass of myself, so if I go again and and am getting stolen from in the rake, should I make a fuss, call the racing commission, secretly video tape the dealer 'theft' and post on you-tube?


Tell me about the 10% rake (this is slot on dealers right, correct?) and does it include jackpot pulls?


PS, I do not want to get any dealers fired, but also do not like being scrued..., so what would you suggest if I see this occur in the future?
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Old 03-03-2013, 08:23 PM   #1573
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

You should get up and find a floor supervisor immediately if the dealer is incorrectly raking the pot. No one should get fired, but we want to make sure to fix any errors and prevent them from occurring again. We do not want you, or any other player, to be the victim of any inaccuracies.

The 10% house rake is on the dealer's right. It does include the jackpot pull. So on a 2/4 game, if there are 5 players in for $2 each and the flop goes out, there will be $3 total dollars raked. $2 to the promo fund and $1 to the house. If there were 4 players in for $2 each ($8 total), it would be $2 to promo and $0 to the house. A $40+ pot will have $6 total raked from it.

Thanks,

Tristan
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:29 PM   #1574
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

According to the Bravo App. there is a 6-12 HORSE game running right now. Cool to see mixed games running that aren't just holdem and omaha. Hopefully it's something that stays.
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Old 03-21-2013, 09:32 PM   #1575
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Re: Running Aces (Columbus, MN)

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According to the Bravo App. there is a 6-12 HORSE game running right now. Cool to see mixed games running that aren't just holdem and omaha. Hopefully it's something that stays.
It must have been HO, not HORSE, as they will not spread Razz.

I've seen 4/8 HO on the board recently, but it never went. I've played 4/8 HOE once, but that was a few years ago.

Anyways, it's great to hear that a mixed game was going....
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