Hi guys, have never posted here in programming, so im sorry if im wrong.

If i wanted some kind of poker software who looked like Full tilt poker/PokerStars, how much work does it require ?

- How many developers ?
- How much do you think it will cost ?
- I mean the software it self cant be to complicated, since it isn't a big game like Fifa, Battlefield, Call of Duty etc.

Will it be relatively simple to get someone to just make a software like this?
- If someone here are able to do so, if yes how much would you charge ?

You dont have to take anything else into consideration. So forget servers, payment modules, marketing etc. Its strictly the software im interested in.

Maybe someone has an idea of where and whom to contact for further questions. Either way i hope somebody here who knows something about programming and graphicing can help. Sorry for any misspelling etc. english isnt my native language.

You want a downloadable exe that, once installed, you can use to play poker against other-people online?

I just read through another thread where i found the issue being discussed.
But yeah it should be a downloadable version.

Its not because im trying to start my own poker site or anything. Im just very interested in this topic. I've always had the idea, that you could clone the best software out there, and then redevelop/change most of it so you wont break the copyright violations. But to have the backbone of good pokersoftware, should be possible to build out of the already existing pokersoftwares right ?

EDIT ; I cant edit the original post , so from i can read on the forum people says;

+ 5 developers
+ 500K USD
+ 1 Year
--------------

Yeah I saw the thread you are talking about.
http://code.google.com/p/pokerspot/s...base/cards.cpp

And idk, if it were that easy I think everyone would do it.

Do you work for Groupe Bernard Tapie?

Hehe i am actually Mr. Bernard Tapie himself who plays Small Stakes PLO.
With ALL the money i dont know why im only playing small stakes games, or why im asking 2p2 - I have so much money i should buy 20 developers to finish this, without even worrying ..

Seriously though would be funny if i worked for them.
If they dont get the deal with FTP done, then FTP is history and the british firm who also are interested will buy and sell the software.

BTW is there any reason why all PS, FTP, OnGame and iPoker are using the exact same cards. Gotta be someone out there earning a lot on providing them with the "cards" hehe.

I think what you'll find is that that software is a lot more complex than you think. There is a reason why no other sites come close to the quality of software that PS and FTP have.

This is talked about in another thread I believe

Yeah i believe you are right, but the graphical part can not be that difficult.
Hmm i might disagree with you at one point, the reason the other "big" sites/networks hasnt developed a quality like PS and FTP, is because they choose not to. They have chosen to become a part of the ****ty ongame software or ipoker software. It is a certainty that the big sportsbooks/pokerskins like Betfair all earn so insanely sick amounts of money, that they obviously could make the same kind of software if they wanted to. I simply believe that it isn't a high enough priority for those kind of skins/sportsbooks. These big gambling/casino/sportbooks players could compare themselves to the consol-gaming industry, when it comes to liquidity and earning money. Every year we see a lot of games to PS3 and Xbox etc. with very beautiful gameplay and graphics (yes i know that the developers behind are specialist), but the point is that the smoothness FTP had, and the graphic itself should be possible to create. And the task should be easier if you could build it from the backbone of the existing top poker softwares.

Most new sites obiously choose to become a part of a network, this saves time and money on software development and it means that the players on their site ends up in the sam player pool as the other players on the network. Meaning they will have someone to play with.

This of course doesnt explain why ongame itself isnt improving their software. The sofware is awful. Very clunky and hideous.

What you see in the other threads where people have come in and asked for estimates of what it would cost to develop something like pokerstars software, is prob +1Million dollars and +6months and probably alot more than that.

If all you want is the look and feel, and the sequrity and such is unimportant and it is only going to run locally on your ocmputer, then obiously its alot easier and cheaper

Iirc someone wanted the Full Tilt software and I believe the price range $30m to $35m was mentioned.

Yes that is true. I know the stuff about becoming a part of a network, and a there is obv. companys who earns big money by setting new skin up.

As you say, the player pool and the whole software is already there for the new skin, which makes the choice a bit more rational from an economic point of view.

Ongame and iPoker has several of hundreds skins combined, and have been in the poker business for quite some time now. With all these millions, it shouldn't be a big deal for them to improve the general software. If it was a high priority they could probably develop an even better software compared to FTP and PS. But they doesn't care, and especially the top and executives of iPoker has been rumoured and found in a lot of shady spots and situations.

When FTP was at its highest the software was like Apple's software versus Windows software.

FTP was Apple - the rest was windows. By that i mean the overall smoothness, and general comfortness you where experiencing at FTP was 100 x times better than every other. Now PS has with zoom poker + nova themes almost cloned the FTP software (but they arent there yet)

Sorry for my bad explanation. The point was to give a good metaphor where you have Apple's very smooth and comfortable interface and software versus the more heavier Windows (but i still stick with windows to the end)

So you are saying that a local Poker software, with inspiration from FTP and Apple for instance, could be done relatively easy and cheap ?

EDIT; Yeah i did read that a British company was interested in the software for about 40 million USD. And then let the WHOLE FTP brand die. If you look at the software as a standalone product, and forget that it ever was used by
FTP, i think such software would decrease in value by 10 x times.

For 40 million USD you could make the newest top selling shooting or soccer game.

I refuse to belive that a pretty badass poker client including all transaction and security stuff couldn't be done for 2 million-ish.
I mean you get some pretty badass programmers for 150k/year and I wouldn't want a team >6 anyways. I would actually estimate this a decent clip lower tbh but that's my "reasonable" and not "**** it let's head for the garage and gogogo" estimate

2 years...done. Cut out all the crap and leave it to other sites and concentrate on doing a few things really well. I mean do STTs first, add MTTs and only stick to NL holdem. Then add cashgames later would be my route. Perfect that stuff before even thinking about adding any other kind of games.

[You could go ahead and keep the ringgames to Rush only which would remove a bunch of lobby stuff etc]

The way harder part is marketing, customer support, the banking, regulations and legal stuff etc...which is why I suspect not many people are interested in doing it in the first place

I mean you could probably rock and roll pretty hard by simply using better tools for the job than others. Yes, I'm thinking Erlang for the servers...omnomnom

Thanks for the input. But first of all i have to outline (again) that im not interested in opening a pokersite/skin.

Like i have earlier stated, all the marketing, regulations, payments modules (deposit and withdrawals) all that is not in relevant for this topic.

What we want is first of all all the graphical things to be done. I'm interested in similar but more "new" looking interface and tablelooking. So i want the very smooth and nice software (still only thinking about the graphics), where the inspiration has to be found in FTP, Apple's software, and the whole new way of making tablet software. It is all very smooth and exciting experience.

So, the graphics ALONE something like FTP (just better ) what are we aiming for in terms of costs ?

After that i would integrate PLO software as the first game available. And yes i know exactly that this means that im missing the biggest percentages of the market, but this project should just start as a local project where a couple of friends could Play PLO. After that you could try your luck and aiming for bigger goals..

With all the open source coding + all the botting, a lot of the "hard work" must already have been done, and can be implemented very quick, right ?

Hi clowntable,

I think this is possible, but unlikely. If the probability of getting a badass poker client, after spending 2mil, is about 10%, that means a badass poker client costs, probablistically, 20mil, on average. I think the probability may be even lower, for most people trying to commission a team of programmers to develop poker software.


You could get badass programmers for 150K/year but most programmers you could get for 150K/year are not badass. Assembling a badass team of programmers is even harder, not to mention that it's difficult to commission top programmers to do what you want them to do, as opposed to what they want to do themselves.

If you find a decent graphics artist and hire him for a year he could probably come up with just about everything you need.

For that part of it the cost will be pretty small compared to the cost of developing the software itself.

I agree with Clown, find 2 badass programmers and you have a very good shot. The difficulty is in regulation and bureaucracy, as well as needing someone who knows their stuff on security. If you have a highly liquid cash platform like a poker client it's going to attract some very talented hackers.