Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > Other Topics > History

Notices

History Discussion of History up to Circa 1990

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-15-2011, 08:42 AM   #31
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

This book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sniper-Easte.../dp/1844153177



The most brutal, honest and grotesque account of what actual combat was like on one of the most disgustingly violent battles the world has ever seen. I highly highly recommend this book. It's probably the best anti war text I have ever read, just went the realities of battles are detailed in such a matter of fact way. Granted it was written retrospectively, but it is considered an accurate account. I've read the recently released Russian sniper on eastern front book, and Zaitsev's book, but this one trumps them all.

Also it is interesting to note, there were a lot of fake books circulting just after the war. For example:



I always considered this one of the defining combat books as well, but was disappointed when I did some research and it's is regarded by many academics to be a total fake.

Other truly excellent books, anythnig by Antony Bevoir is amazingly researched, and a good balance between every dimension of the battles he focuses on, political, economic and human. Stalingrad is my favorite:



Berlin is also an excellent one.

This book by Biedermann is fascinating, but some people might find it dry:



It portrays a lot of the feeling of front line troops very well, the pointless tragedy of it all, his poetry and romanticism is really interesting, but it is quite a dry book.

Anything by Primo Levi is also superb, he was a hollocaust survivor. Probably the most articulate and intelligent writing I have ever read on it.



Treblinka is an astonishing account of an uprising in a holocaust camp as well, I highly recommend this book, but it is deeply disturbing reading (as you would probably expect).

This book about Zhukov is excellent, but very heavy reading and it's overly strategic which always loses me, but netherless an interesting read on the greatest ww2 General.



This is a gem of a book as well:



The often unknown war between Russia and Finland, detailing extrodinary resistance and acts of bravery against overwhelming odds. Truly amazing book.

Also highly recommend this book:



The brutal account, comparably disturbing as the holocaust, when the Japanese went into the city and destroyed it.

Anyway those are just the best from the ones I've read imo
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 08:51 AM   #32
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

Also in regards to chemical warfare, the Japanese were king here during WW2. I read somewhere that they dropped disease infected lice bombs in china, the bombs would have a small charge in them to disperse the lice over a large area and the disease would spread really quickly. I'll try find more info on this.

They also launched explosive balloons across the Atlantic, a few of them actually dropped onto American soil, but no injury was known to be caused by them afaik.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_balloon

Also whilst we are talking about the Japenese, read about Unit 731:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731

Note that a lot of these researchers became high up workers in US pharmaceutics companies after the war. Recently they have been coming forwards near to death in admittance of their participation in these camps, overwrought with guilt.

There is a good film on 371, I think it's a Chinese one. A lot of modern researchers refuse to reference of use any knowledge derived from research from Unit 731 on moral grounds even if the information is useful to them.
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 08:56 AM   #33
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

Also in regards to atomic weapons being developed by Germany, I think Mason is right, they did actually plan for it in the beginning, but decided not to because the research process would have taken too long and cost too much resources/money, when they were expecting the war to be over relatively quickly.
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 09:20 AM   #34
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gullanian View Post
In regards to this book, it was actually so disturbing it's sort of nightmare triggering sort of material, I've never been so sickened by a book that I've wanted to put it down before.

I actually asked why I was reading it, it seemed more like exploitative cinema where it is gruesome for the sake of being gruesome, but I had to keep reminding myself I was reading about real people, and their struggle and end had real educational value as to why we should exhaust every democratic option before engaging in war.

No human beings should ever have to go through what they have, and unfortunately war isn't cleaner or more sanitised as we would like to think it is nowadays with the aid of technology, it's still gritty and visceral, and something we should avoid at all costs. It still ends with young people who haven't started their lives dying of excruciating wounds in unknown places.
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 11:47 AM   #35
adept
 
Ahigh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ban CNN!!!! Wookie said so!!!!
Posts: 913
Re: The Second World War

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratamahatta View Post
Questions:
In what extent did Wehrmacht and Red Army used captured tanks, artillery and other heavy weapons? When reading about great battles of WWII I always see statistics which mention how many weapons were captured by winning side, but I never hear anything about their usage ?
Lighter weapons were redeployed a lot more often than heavier machinery. With captured weapons you are always running into an issue of ammo supply and parts\repair (with tanks and autos).

Quote:
Also: why didn't Wehrmacht use chemical weapons on eastern front? They were first to use poison gas in WWI, they used artillery which were originally designed to fire gas canisters and for Wehrmacht war against USSR was a war of annihilation. So why didn't they
I read somewhere that Wehrmacht considered they use for chemical weapons only as defensive option. There was also huge distaste for that option by higher command who knew first hand all the implications of using gasses during ww1.
Ahigh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 12:55 PM   #36
journeyman
 
donk007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 352
Re: The Second World War

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gullanian View Post
Also in regards to atomic weapons being developed by Germany, I think Mason is right, they did actually plan for it in the beginning, but decided not to because the research process would have taken too long and cost too much resources/money, when they were expecting the war to be over relatively quickly.
A great book = The Making of the Atomic Bomb. Its very long but excellent. Pulitzer Prize/National book award winning.

From that book, the Nazis were not interested in developing the bomb and did not have access to the materials required to develop it. The Norwegian heavy water plant was sabotaged by the Allies (The Heroes of Telemark.) Many prominent Jewish physicists fled Germany and worked on the American bomb. The Allies would bomb any suspected nuclear site although that might not be completely effective.

I don't think Germany could afford to develop the bomb after attacking the Soviet Union. The United States spent an extreme amount of money and resources developing the bomb. Hundreds of thousands of workers were employed. Billions of dollars were spent. Each bomb cost roughly $500 million. That represented a significant portion of $$$ spent on other weapons. Once Germany was in a life and death struggle with the Soviet Union and suffering from Allied strategic bombing, it was impossible to keep up with conventional weapons manufacturing never mind develop atomic weapons.

If the Nazis had seriously worked on the bomb instead of attacking the Soviet Union, the world might be a different place today.
donk007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 05:14 PM   #37
Pooh-Bah
 
Ratamahatta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Copenhagen
Posts: 3,938
Re: The Second World War

Thanks for clarification guys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahigh View Post
Lighter weapons were redeployed a lot more often than heavier machinery. With captured weapons you are always running into an issue of ammo supply and parts\repair (with tanks and autos).
I was just watching an interview with a Soviet veteran in which he said that Soviet soldiers often took machine guns from dead German soldiers because they were lighter and easier to use.
Ratamahatta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2011, 05:27 PM   #38
old hand
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,575
Re: The Second World War

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratamahatta View Post
I was just watching an interview with a Soviet veteran in which he said that Soviet soldiers often took machine guns from dead German soldiers because they were lighter and easier to use.
The primary function of a soviet soldier was not to fire bullets anyway, it was to absorb them.
smrk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2011, 07:54 PM   #39
veteran
 
bnrocks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bahston
Posts: 2,375
Re: The Second World War

As soon as I saw the thread I was going to reccommend the Hardcore History podcast Ghosts of the Ostfront, but someone beat me to it.

I thought that the podcast covered post-Kursk better than most history pieces. In my experience most, if not all, Eastern Front coverage goes "Pre-War-Blitz-Winter Counter Attack-Blitz-Stalingrad-One paragraph on Kursk-Russian Steamroller-Berlin" with little mention about anything specific after Kursk. Most books you would encounter in school were lucky to even mention one thing about the East between Stalingrad and Berlin.
bnrocks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2011, 10:39 AM   #40
rack 'em
 
Wamy Einehouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,176
Re: The Second World War

A great book for anyone even vaguley sympathetic to Holocaust denial or just interested in the day to day functioning of the Nazi party:

http://www.amazon.com/Unwritten-Orde.../dp/0752433288

The Unwritten Order
is a deep and thorough acount of just how the final solution was implemented and maintained by the Nazi's, and Hitler's explicit role in it. Very well written and a powerful and moving book.
Wamy Einehouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2011, 12:17 PM   #41
stranger
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 7
Re: The Second World War

Has anyone watched the documentary series The World at War? It was produced in Britain in the early 1970's; as such, it contains extensive interviews with people who lived through the war, both "common" people and historically significant personalities, such as Albert Speer. I found the series absolutely riveting. You can watch it at http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-w...rsary-edition/

I'd also like to highly recomend Bloodlands, by Timothy Snyder. It's a pretty recent book detailing the effects of Hitler and Stalin on the region between Germany and the Soviet Union, especially Poland. It's not entirely about WWII, as the book deals fairly extensively with Stalin's crimes in the Soviet Union prior to the outbreak of the war (like the Ukranian famine and The Great Terror), but most of the book deals with events during the war.
LBloom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2011, 12:25 PM   #42
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

+1 for World at War, I got all the DVD's, brilliant series.
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2011, 03:16 PM   #43
veteran
 
yimyammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,557
Re: The Second World War

Quote:
Originally Posted by donk007 View Post
I was fascinated by Dan Carlin's "Hardcore History" series, Ghosts-of-the-Ostfront. It's 4 free podcasts covering the war on the eastern front. The scale and horror of the eastern front is unbelievable. I don't know how accurate the series is. I would like to read some books on the eastern front. There seem to be few books written in English about the east. Any recommendations?
Concur!!!!!!! I've listened to these several times, I can't get enough. They're fantastic, IMO.

Does anyone know of some good books written about the war in Russia? Dan Carlin whetted my appetite
yimyammer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2011, 03:30 PM   #44
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gullanian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
Posts: 13,044
Re: The Second World War

Sniper on the Eastern front and Antony Beevoirs Stalingrad/Berlin are excellent books.
Gullanian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2011, 12:28 PM   #45
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
miajag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Downeyayshun, hon
Posts: 13,476
Re: The Second World War



very good book about the Eastern Front from the perspective of a Soviet journalist on the front lines. It's taken from his original notes so there's none of the typical Soviet censorship/sugarcoating of everything. Fascinating read.
miajag is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:51 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive