Posted 03-02-2011:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=184

so much drama, this whole story sounds like it could be a sick plotline for rounders 2

No relationship at all, neither of them know me personally and I have never spoken to either of them directly or met them in real life.

My defense of them is not vouching for them, and if it is proven that they are indeed scumbags, I will apologize in humility.

However, that being said, I was simply picking on an idiot who just wants blood and is an obvious hater of DIH and JM. Instead of trying to help the situation since his friends were scammed, all he did was try to draw implications to DIH and JM. It's obvious he's jealous and wants to see them go down. I do not appreciate that type of mentality and thus defended them.

I do not believe it's irrational and nor do many other respected members of the community (I am clearly not a respected member as most people do not know who I am IRL). Read the posts above.


All I'm saying is that before everyone throws DIH and JM in prison for association, they should look reasonably at the situation and rationalize some things out.

Namely, what do DIH and JM have to gain from this (% of Griah's profit, % of Girah's marketability etc...) vs what they have to lose (their reputation, their money, plenty more in JM's case) and try to think if either would really do something like this. It makes no sense. More likely, Girah wanted to continue looking good to them by crushing people HU and making them money through backing that he resorted to this. I sincerely doubt that they had any knowledge or participated in any way because it just doesn't make sense.

But then again, I don't have the logical mind of a HSNL player like 634395647w/e does... So I could be wrong. But i doubt it...


------EDIT--------------

ftr, 6353465w/e now has two HSNL community members telling him to **** off. If my vote doesn't county, surely there's does... I'm not the only one that can spot a witch hunting hater when I see one.


The focus should be on discovering everyone who has played against any account that Girah has used to scam people and having them be paid back. That is it. Once those people have been paid back, I would like to see DIH and JM come forward with an honest account of how much they have profited from backing Girah and donate that money to charity or to paying back people if there is anyone left that Girah did not pay back.

please disregard this derailing nvg-ish pic

Did I say that?
Stick to drink-driving

deldar182 I would assume that you're no longer trying to use a friend's 2p2 account to do transfers while claiming that you didnt have your own... I have more saved in message from you if you wanna know.

so next time dont tell me to STOP POSTING and dont speak as if you dont use other accounts ok? bye.

Don't worry, you're obviously right. DIH and jungleman had no idea he was scamming people. Sure, we don't know this for 100% certainty, but it is very very very unlikely that they would have knowledge of this.

However, whether or not they were multiaccounting and doing shady stuff like that...well, that's up in the air.

I plan on it, and you implied it.

Stick to thinking there's no luck in poker or in life, and that just because YOU can't do something like text and drive, or drink and drive, means other people can't. You're not nearly as smart as you think you are

I dont want blood, I just want Haseeb to explain why he has played hands under girah's account, why he's given his own password to girah, and why he's offering to pay girah's victims only if they dont go public. These are the same questions that the victims want answered. I am also very curious as to why you are trying to stop anyone from getting these answers to the point of initiating personal attacks in order to turn any focus away from Haseeb.

fwiw I have nothing against Haseeb nor do I have against jungleman, but their poker celebrityhood and skill as great players do not excuse them from the need to explain themselves, which they have refused to do citing "travel" which is not an excuse at all.

So stop trolling. Like I said, some of us know some of the actual victims.. and there are more victims who havent spoken up yet but are just putting together their case before going public. I'm not trying to fuel the fire but that is the truth.

I thought you were being sarcastic in the first paragraph till i read the second, but essentially yes, i can go out on a limb and say that it's possible that they were multi accounting, however, I still think a logical explanation is that since DIH and JM were backing Girah, the account was in DIH's name so that he has full access to it and could never be scammed by Girah in any way.

FTR is that against the rules? Lets say I'm backing someone and want to be sure that I always have access to their account and they can never claim that the money is theirs or try to screw me in any way. Is it against the rules to have an account in my name and allow someone i'm backing to play on it as long as they're the only person that plays on it?

Yeah I'm not... because now I have my own account... comprende?
The date of those messages would precede this accounts registration I presume
I think it's time to put down your magnifying glass and tinfoil hat

I'm fairly certain you started the personal attacks on me by stating that i do not have a logical HSNL poker mind (to which my invitation to play you remains open) and that i should stop posting and blah blah... Nobody else has told me to stop posting and most respected people agree with me. You on the other hand, not so much.

I am not diverting attention, I am not trying to insult you less you insult me. I am actually trying to revert focus to outting all of the account names that were used for scamming and getting everyone that has played those accounts to come forward so we can see what is owed. Once every is paid back, I then want DIH and JM to come forward with their story and the amount of money they've made off of Girah and find an acceptable outlet to disperse that money.


I said that before, in the exact post you quoted. So please read my post before asking the same question. I am keeping focused on the important things. There could be other accounts he used and other people he scammed that don't know it and wont get paid back if it is not made public

I think there should be another thread for "vouching" thing as it seems that many people here including prominent players like CaptZeeBoo, Deldar182 and FoxoodFiend have no idea what the word means and are (probably not consciously) deceiving many people but giving their "vouches" away with light heart.

Quote from Webster dictionary:

But even without it it should be clear for anybody who ever made any money transaction that if you vouch for someone and that someone screw up then you pay up.
It boggles my mind that people are questioning this. It seems that there are many victims of vouches given too lightly who ran well by not being scammed...

Jose common now, i know you're young and naive... but refunding you're friend for his lost never crossed you're mind?

I watched his poker video, it was terrible. I couldn't come out and say it at the time because I own a competing training site, but it sounds like he's reading some kind of low stakes NLHE poker book and someone taught him how to use poker stove.

I'm a little interested about the poker strategy he posted-- it seems a lot to me like he played midstakes or something and Haseeb/Jungle were able to coach/ghost/MA him into a superstar? I have no proof of this theory, but it sure seems very likely at this point. AFAIK he never talked poker strategy in interviews he did, but I didn't watch them. It's just kinda hard to trick high stakes players into thinking you actually play high stakes if you don't play well.

Though ghosting is legal afaik and MA'ing is not on the same planet as what Jose has done, it seems likely that certainly Haseeb and possibly even Jungleman engaged in both of these things with Girah.

re: vouching (although i agree this should all be moved into a new thread if someone would be so kind):

i am always just very open about my level of vouching. i say something like:

1. i coached him and have done a few trades, i have never met him in person but he seems like he's on the level in all my dealings with him.

2. i've met him in real life a few times, we have mutual friends, seems like a standup guy.

3. i know where he lives and i will slit his throat if he doesn't pay you.

I haven't seen the video he's made, nor played him/sweated him, but in the strategy chat that was made later on for the top posters/players, he was one of the biggest contributers amongst players who do very well in the high stakes games. There is absolutely no way he would 'trick' all of us into believing he didn't have an understanding for the game on that level if he didn't actually have it.

Now I don't know whether he's just theoretically very good but unable to put that into practise, but all his responses were near-instant and it's not like he could ask Dog/Jungle then paste it into the chat without us noticing.

As I wrote in the NVG-topic, I can't speak for anyone else but I personally don't think Jungle has been involved, just based on my interactions with him and what other friends of mine have told me from theirs'. His reaction after I told him Jose had admitted it was also more what I'd expect than that of Haseeb's.

your posts itt are terrible. of course it's against the rules unless you never read T&C when you sign up for pokerstars or whatever site. girah admitted that haseeb played on his account before, also girah was suspended by onGame for having haseeb log in remotely and play under his name. why are you trying to hard to stop people from demanding answers to these very basic questions?? are you friends with haseeb qureshi or have a stake in his name being kept from ongoing discussion?

we dont want to hear from girah anymore. he's proven that he will lie when being interrogated. we want to hear from his backers who used and shared accounts with him, planned to move in with him, and are now paying back his victims.

I think it's really difficult to believe that Jose and DIH were in on the cheating but the were able to hide it from JM and had the intention of continuing to hide it from JM when they all lived together. Either they were all in on it or DIH/JM were not, and I tend to believe the latter.

What is stopping Haseeb/Jungle from going onto Jose's Skype like they seem to have done with his poker accounts?

I hate to post this as I like Jungleman and Haseeb in my limited interactions with them but its going to be brought up anyway...

They have a motive to do this too...with a midstakes player...because he has access to softer euro sites that they don't have.

I think its bad to be talking about Jungle/Haseeb doing that in the same thread as one for condemning a blatant thief.

Sorry, my question was phrased wrong, you're right... I know it's against the T&C, I meant is it unethical.

Fwiw, using teamviewer to sweat people while playing is also against the T&C but everyone does it anyway whether there is real time coaching or just sweating for the energy of cheering on your buddy, using teamviewer is against the T&C....

I'm sorry you don't like my posts, but again, what you think and what you want to hear from his backers is not as important as outing all of Girahs cheating accounts and getting everyone paid back.

once again, i do not know either DIH or JM in real life, I just think that getting everyone paid back and all the accounts outed is far more important than hearing DIH/JM defend themselves at this point. There will come a time for them to explain everything and do something with the money they made from him, but that time comes after all the information about Girah has been posted in the open.

Basically I'm more interested in seeing everyone paid back than reading drama and accusations... But everyone loves sensationalism...

just thought of something, what was planning on going on with girah challenging Tom?

This is what I keep trying to stress... that stuff does not belong in this thread... this thread should be about outting all of Girahs cheating accounts and having people come forward for repayment

I spoke with Jose about this when he made the challenges and he was selling action, up to 50% I think. If Jungle was the one who would play I doubt they'd do that?