Great post and good to see that 2p2 has a place for these stories as well. A+

I have been addicted for over 10 years to weed and I saw some great weed debate going on in here so might as well chime in. I love the fact that none of these side effects have been proven and that weed is not really that bad for you (or at least not yet proven to be bad if I read some replies.. not proven does not mean that its actually not bad .. just that we cant prove it atm). Maybe physically or mentally its not that hard on a person to be addicted or to stop using when comparing to harddrugs, Ill agree to that.

I seriously doubt a teenagers life will not be harmed by smoking in the educational prime time of his life. Someone who isnt just sitting inside and smoking weed all day with the same friends is doing some different stuff. He'll probably (on average) be skipping less classes and putting in better work, both in school as at the office. As said Ive smoked weed from my 16th year till my 26th and in retrospect it has been terrible for me. Everyone is different but alot of the crowd who I used to smoke with still do that and probably could have different lifes (in a positive way) if they wernt allways looking for weed somewhere or sitting somewhere and getting wasted out of their minds.

I quit weed for the first time in january 2011 and started in august since I thought it was all good and able to handle a bit again. I never had a day where I didnt smoke since that august. Quiting was somewhat easy as I had huge psychological issue's possibly due to the weed or at least made much worse by weed. The issue's disappeared slowly after first getting worse when I quit and reappeared within days when I started smoking again. They only got real bad again last june and I quit per 1 july again. Now I know its probably not smart to start over again.

It has also been the best move I ever made financially. I was in debt for about 30k euro when I was 20 just due to not caring about anything else but weed (rent, utilities, food, anything). My money decisions on weed were also pretty stupid (eg. "rent is 300 .. I have 280 .. so ... I might as well ride it out on random stuff instead of getting that 20 extra somewhere and paying rent and not being able to smoke for a few days till the next paycheck..and Ill probably pay rent then" rinse and repeat lol). Its saving me about 20$ a day right now and loving the extra cash.

Sooo that was tl;dr but couldnt help but sharing my experiences here.

FYI.

Some studies suggest gambling has the same effect as a hit of crack cocaine.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/...4-gambling.htm

That's not what the article says. And crack isn't mentioned anywhere in there.

There is also a huge amount of vagueness in the quotes from the researchers.

Also, it should be quite evident that, if certain brain centers are active during stimulation and pleasure (sex, gambling, eating, conversation, etc) and that some people who take drugs get stimulation and pleasure from them (at least in their pre-addiction, pre-sickness phase) then some of those same brain centers ("similar" is the word the researchers used) would likely show increased blood flow or activity. That is an utterly trivial assertion, and imo not really article-worthy.

Okay, meant to say cocaine, which is the base of crack. Now on to "similar":

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/200...ling-addiction

Is this quote better for you? Or how bout this one:

http://www.centerforpublicconversati...r/20120412.pdf

http://www-psych.stanford.edu/~span/...1101press.html


You do not have to believe the studies or find little value in them but I think it is relevant to the discussion when talking addiction to drugs and gambling and subsequently treatment.

I could be wrong. Could just be "similar" and not relevant. I personally think anyone who does not see the obvious similarities between gambling and drugs, specifically cocaine, relative to addiction are just putting their head in the sand.

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/data.../3714/1127.pdf

are those too vague for you?

I tried coke the first time about a month ago July 3rd to be exact. In high school I was a pothead but I still was involved with sports and after school programs. I started smoking pot the summer before my junior year. Everyday before school, during lunch, after school, I would smoke at least a blunt, sometimes hit a bowl or a bong. Well weed had got pretty boring to me and so I decided to try something that was popular at my school, mushrooms. Worst mistake I ever did because I had a horrible trip on them and I didn't take enough to hallucinate but I felt like I was in a cartoon and my arms never had an end to them it was some weird/crazy ****. After my one time with mushrooms I was just sticking to weed. Now up till I tried mushrooms I could smoke a ton well that all changed after I did mushrooms. I couldn't smoke anymore then a little bowl pack, because my brain would feel like I was back on mushrooms and I would seriously start to freak out if I had smoked a high dosage of pot. So, I stuck to pot for about a year till the summer of my senior year where I got introduced to poker by a good friend who was making a lot of money. I don't think I went out at all my senior year I was addicted to poker and I fell in love with the game. I feel like if poker wasn't there for me I may have gone down a terrible path because school was definitely not my thing. Anyways, after high school I moved out of my parents place and got a 2 floor townhouse with a guy I worked with in VA. His name is Justin and he had to drop out of WVU because he was running from the cops and jumped from like the 3rd floor of a building and ended up shattering his lower leg. Well Justin, had pretty much unlimited oxy for his leg. I would snort them about every other weekend and mixing it with alcohol it really is a great feeling but I knew it wasn't a safe one. I decided to just stop taking them and stick to the little weed that I do smoke every now and then. After, our lease ran up in VA I found a good job in PA, and moved up here last November. I was doing great, making good money, and just doing my thing. Well, I joined the gym a few months ago and ran into a guy who I worked with. We exchanged numbers to go out and get some beer sometime and chill. On July 3rd, he hit me up to go out and have some drinks and to this day I wish I would of just stayed home playing poker on Lock/Merge like I was doing because the things I was about to do changed my life.

We start at this local bar nearby, putting drinks away left and right. Well it starts getting late and he ask me if I do coke. I said I never had but I would be down to try it. (Now I have never been around coke, or ever been offered it). Anyways, back to the story so we go to his dealers house which is in the sketchiest part of philly. I'm drunk he's driving( I know already a terrible thing drinking and driving.) We end up at the house I end up doing about a line and a half and he does the rest because I'm wasted and I really can't remember how much I had done I could of done more but he says I didn't do a lot because he only bought like a $40 bag(however many grams that is.) We end up leaving like 30 mins later just chilling and talking with the dealers, and we go back to my place and crash.

I wake up the next day feeling like I have a huge hangover. I'm feeling like **** all day and just want to lay on my couch and watch tv. I go to bed hoping I feel better the next day. I wake up and everything got worse, I started having emotional thoughts, weird things going in and out of my head, shaking, my body craving more coke, excessive heartbeats( and by that I mean I'm just laying on the couch and my heart is pumping like I sprinted a mile.) I got really scared after that and I had to tell my roommate what I had done in-case I had to go to ER or something. Thankfully, it only happened that once and I was fine after that scary incident I honestly thought I was going to die on July 5th. The emotion swings and thoughts in my head happened for about another 3 days. I went online to check out side effects of coke and sure enough, what happened to me was a common mini withdrawal called the come down. To this day I will never do coke again and I advise anybody not to do it because I can see how people can get addicted to it, your body goes through so much and I only did it one time but that's all it takes and I am very thankful to say I beat coke and I won.

I don't think I have typed this much since my high school research paper but poker has really always been what keeps me going. I know I am not as successful as most of you players but poker has giving me a reason to live and I am thankful every day for it. Take care and please take my word for it stay out of drugs and stay focused on something you enjoy and you will never work a day in your life.

werd thanks for posting, our stories are very similar. Poker has given me one of many reasons to continue living a sober life. I could easily not be here right now and I'm truly on a life free roll. The come down off blow is one of the worst depressions you could ever imagine for those of you who have never used it. I will say that my detox from roxys ended up being the worst depression of my life, but the coke come down was pretty damn harsh.

Once again thanks for sharing man, take care.

I like what's said here and the distinction that drugs simply don't make you play better poker. I've always wanted to be able to develop the self discipline to be a 'responsible drug using poker player'- but that title is pretty much an oxymoron. A lot of people can get by in life with their addictions, simply because they aren't required to perform or function at a high level; being a successful professional poker player isn't one such activity.

Also, there are many famous poker players who have had known drug addiction problems, and they always win more when they're sober, straight, and focused.

haole you nailed it perfectly. It frustrates me listening to people constantly say that they play better under the influence. People are afraid of change when they are doing well and successful poker players who are constantly high when they are playing are no different. Sobriety has been the key to my success in poker and in life no doubt, and i don't look to turn back to my old ways ever again.

closing in on 9 months clean, we need it.

What was the name of the documentary? I enjoy watching drug documentaries as well but haven't heard anything about these "one stop pain shops" operating in Florida.

oxycontin express.......my boy was part of the biggest TSA seizing ever when they finally cut that **** down....10,000pills a week lol street value prob around 650K

You clearly have more first hand experience with drugs than myself, but just because youve done them and 'condone' their use doesnt make you right. The fact you mention your dopamine recpetors are ****ed should prove that drugs are for the most part ******ed, bad and shouldnt be celebrated.

OxyCodone jilted my memory, it was called the Oxycotin Express.

I wasn't celebrating that fact at all. Its tragic actually. I didn't say once in that entire post that I could handle drug use responsibly or well enough. I just said that the idea of drug use being one huge black hole of misery upsets me. There is a lot of positives to drug use too...and every story from a recoverering/recovered addict makes it seem like drug use is bad. plain and simple.

To go furhter, the whole program makes you believe that they want you to feel completely vulnerable and that the only way you could beat this terrible affliction "drugs" is by the help of a higher being. (more bull****)

The whole system is so ****ed up and sad and I've seen people fine get put into the system and end up hanging out with more ****ed up people than their sheltered lives, and then there lives ruined. I've seen a few people go through the system and come out...welll..."off" They just don't see the same.

Me, personally, I live and I learn. I can give great advice and do so on the regular because of what I've seen. Its a "do as I say not as I do" sort of thing, as I've obviously made a lot of mistakes along the way too but hey, what the hell. I'm still young. I got many years until I'm 30 and single and online poker still isn't back in the USA for me to regret my life choices

Funny you bring that up. It actually scares me that if I were to ever get into a car crash, and I did get into one and remember frantically calling my dealer and was fine. My dad even made a joke about how quickly I went through the vicodin that they gave me at the hospital, lol. (much weaker painkiller.)

I'm pretty sure if they hook me up to a morphine IV I'll be fine. Same reason I'm scared ****less of going to dentist and my teeth aren't great. I brush them two times a day sometimes moreas best as i can but still notice signs that aren't too happy and stress me out too much, but hey aint all glitz and glamor. The things we do to get by the miserable life.


"Drugs are a natural response to insanity"

Once again, for some people they just can't take it. They just don't know how to not keep on going or how to analyze themselves subjectively and for them they should get help. However, I've seen the system, the 12 steps, hospitals, methadone clinics, god don't even get me started. For the most part I'd say that the systems the USA has in place to "heal" recovering addicts is complete and other bull****. Its basically junkie sleep away camp and will do more harm than good by far on the end and its really soulcrushing to see it happen. Naive parents "oh we'll write a check send her here and poof she'll come off healed" nah she'll meet some cute dude check herself out cuz shes 18 and before you know it she'll check herself off antipysychotic meds be doing crack/blow/h all together....kid will beat the **** out of her cuz he's ob a scumbag. Its a vicious cycle.

I've been kicked out of 3 hospitals(psychiatric/er/w/e for various bs) funny, the connections and bee

It was a terrible terrible terrible ordeal and cycle I've seen and Gregy you are so lucky with your money/support group to get the right stuff. The only thing that bothers me is people think drugs are just a blackhole of misery and stealing and just negativity. ONLY A SITH DEALS IN ABSOLUTES! lol. I'm happy for you though gregy for sure. Its just, "whatever works for you" is best. Look out for friends/others, and keep close attention.

I don't know the right solution to the problem, but it clearly isn't criminilization. I know the first time when I was like 16 or 17 or w/e I heard of "oxy 80s" synthetic heroin. I mean, for some/most today I guess that still skeeves em out and they are too pussy to go, but man I always wanted to do what was best and I had money and I just wanted to do whatever. I think educating how bad things are make me want to do them more.

The problem is, there are some amazing synthetic drugs that make people feel amazing and in turn addicts will do whatever they can do get that drug, and criminal types will procure that drug for profit. It seems to me that the only true way to ever stop the cycle of doom, is to decriminalize these pain pills and have tighter restrictions/more unabusable. (they already started with the OP 80s) and whatnot.

That won't ever happen though. Because of all the $ pharameucitcal companies control. They don't care about the epidemic. People dying everywhere. addies/weed coke/percs crack/oxy heroin/8ball degenerative line. THEY JUST CARE ABOUT MONEY. Its america. Look how many people we have locked up statistics wise vs the rest of the world. Its really a huge joke makes most rational people sick to know there is nothing to do to change of this joke and that it is just simply the norm.

Drugs really are a natural response to insanity.

Greg I read you're story and I'm glad to see your sober. My brother went through almost the exact same thing. Luckily he realized what he was doing to not only himself but the people around him and he's almost 2 years sober from everything(at the age of 22..).

I'm glad you decided to post this though. My brother has been a big inspiration to a lot of his friends going down the same path. You're story goes to show people that there is always hope. Stay strong and I hope other people realize what you're trying to say.

All the people quoting studies and linking to wikipedia are *******s. Sorry that probably comes off more harsh than I meant it to. But really. If you are quoting studies it probably means you don't have first hand experience. Maybe the way you think most people are supposed to live their lives isn't the best way for every single person. Ever consider that?

There are as many perspectives of the world as there are people who exist. Everyone sees things a little differently. Sure, these studies can give people without experience a general idea, but this can't possibly be reflective of how ALL people experience these substances.

Even people who can't quit are saying stuff like "drugs are tragic", blah blah blah. This is such nonsense to me. If it's so tragic and sobriety is such a gift, then stop being a bitch and quit. If you really can't quit, then your problem lies beyond drugs themselves.

IMO, life/consciousness is tragic ... thank god I've found some things that allow me to experience it in a way that I can actually enjoy the time I've been forced to accept.

.....

Let the flaming begin.

Saw you on ESPN tonight man, haha.

wow.

I think for the most part this can be true for some people. People have different values and different views of life and success, etc. I think there are a couple of major problems that are overlooked with a view like this. First, often times a person's view on life can change after taking drugs, and as I said before, it is human nature to rationalize things, therefore someone that is using can basically lie to themselves and tell themselves that they enjoy life more while using. Second, drug users do not just use drugs in solitude and never talk about drug use; they use infront of others and they talk about drug use a lot and glorify it and talk about all of the "great things" that come along with drug use, and this pushes other, non-users to try it and start using. Because of this, drug use is often not just a personal choice in many cases. Drug use can affect a lot of people around the user, family and friends who worry about the user, as well as family and friends who are pushed to start using themselves. These are 2 of the worst consequences imo.

"An alcoholic loses his job when he drinks. A junky loses his when he can't score any more junk" -William Burroughs

I have no experience with opiates at all myself or those around me (afaik), but from reading/documentaires i've seen you'd be surprised how many pill addicts are out there wasting away their lives and somehow still functioning at their jobs (and how many famous artists/writers/musicians were junkies that somehow kept it together). Compare this to alcoholics (true alcoholics, these are people who wake up in the morning and start drinking all day finishing a handle a day and have done this for 10+ years, not younger guys who go out every night drinking, from witnessing family members there is a pretty big difference) who severely degrade their brains to the point where communication becomes unintelligible (think ozzie osbourne), ruin their lives through multiple dui's, etc.

If you have a problem with alcohol to the point that you're drinking every day, you really need to go and get help and I urge you to go do this. Its going to require making new friends, finding new ways to enjoy life and have fun without alcohol/maybe move to a new environment, but alcohol is one of the worst things for your brain long term if you binge drink daily, and as a poker player you really need to be concerned about that. Just because there are examples of functional alcoholics and you yourself are a self-admitted one now does not mean it will remain like this forever.

Also, I think your perspective on life/drugs in general will change eventually marshall (referring to your last post here). I agree that some people with no experience/contact here don't really understand a lot, and I group myself into this category when it comes to opiates since I have 0 experience with them. You're right that some people are perfectly happy with the lifestyle they lead and are allowed to have a different perspective, but we are also allowed to tell an addict that is convinced he loves the lifestyle that there is more out there to life and that some people may have a better time in life. In fact my opinion is different than many people in this thread (I am very against alcohol consumption and think our casual view towards "you're only young/in college once" leads to a huge amount of problems in peoples lives, I am so happy to get my dui off my record this year and my brain feels so much healthier now that I don't drink hardly at all. In addition some people are so against weed in here that its extremely surprising considering this is a poker site, but I myself am trying to be open to their opinions and realize that something I love and feel i enjoy responsibly could actually be harmful.), but you are right that there tends to be a group effect of people that think the same way about drugs and think only their way of thinking is the right way (mainly influenced from social stigma's/education/family background/the media)

uhhhh, yeah.

If those neuroscientists seriously cannot see any difference between a brain on cocaine and the brain of a sober person gambling... then either their tests are far too narrow and their subjective conclusions are incredibly biased toward there thesis, or they are just flat out wrong.

For one thing, obviously, the brain chemistry must obviously be radically different. So... they're not taking blood samples or measuring neurotransmitters, are they? It's impossible that they could be chemically analyzing the brain processes, otherwise they couldn't be saying they see no difference.

It sounds like they're just using a form of thermal brain imaging, drawing their conclusions from blood flow and temperature differences in the brain. Literally, if these doctors can see no difference between somebody using cocaine, and a sober person playing poker, then we can easily speculate that between those two vastly different polarities, there must also be a large spectrum of other activities that are also indistinguishable for them: surfing the net, playing scrabble, doing a job interview, posting in a forum, sky diving, watching an exciting movie, having an intense conversation, picking up girls at a bar, driving, taking adderall or meth etc, playing the horses, playing blackjack, buying lotto scratchers, etc etc etc.

You get my point. This should be obvious upon reflection. Anyway, hopefully I wasn't too sharply critical at first, your post just seemed like a troll post to me. Like, people are on the thread trying to recover from speed and junk addiction and dedicate to playing poker, so you stop by "hey man, here's this jiffy study by some guys who call themselves neuroscientists, that says there is no difference between smoking crack and playing poker."

Again, I corrected you about the crack assertion, which was blatantly wrong. Beyond that, this just seems like very weak science, and a very vague and flimsy article. Obviously there is a difference in the effect, anybody with both experiences can easily tell you that. If some lapcoat with a machine tells you otherwise... fine, whatever. What if he told you that sucking **** and drinking beer are indistinguishable in the brain using their testing? Would you then just go out and find the nearest Tijuana bathroom glory hole and start using that as a substitute for beer? I mean, c'mon, use some common sense man.

ummmm, I hate to label people, but I don't suppose you mind if I refer to you as a self-medicating drug addicted narcissistic bipolar web-troll with a violently downward life trajectory, do you?

sorry for the derail, but calling weed a gateway drug is like saying porn is the gateway for rape since all rapists started out watching porn.

Alcohol is far and away the biggest 'gateway drug'

Yo gregy sick job this WSOP! Great thread I had no idea you had a drug addiction all these yrs, sick that u battled thru it. I wanted to talk about a few of the things ITT said about weed. 1st its addictiveness, its true that there is nothing physically addictive in marijuana but that doesn't mean people aren't addicted to it. Many people are. Yes you can get addicted to anything thats absolutely true . The problem is, weed is ****ing great . It makes sex better ,food better , conversations better , movies better basically anything u do on weed is going to be better.

This makes it much more easier to get addicted to than something like jogging or TV . It's great that its not physically addictive but its not like being mentally addicted to something is so easy to manage. Being addicted to weed and doing it constantly has some obv adverse consequences which have already been covered . I also believe that its never good to be dependent on anything . Think about how much easier your life would be if you wasn't dependent on things as natural and safe as eating or drinking.Every 4 hours u have to eat or u start feeling like **** and u have to make sure its good healthy **** too u cant just eat anything and be done with it.

There is also a few studies which link weed to psychosis heres a link to a harvard health blog from 2011 about it . http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/t...s-201103071676 .

I'm not saying that weed should be illegal or that its bad . I actually think its an amazing drug if used correctly . If you do it infrequently in low doses and when you dont have any obligations or responsibilities I think weed will have a very positive impact on your life. The problem is , is that this is very hard for a lot of people to do. A lot of people lack will power, have highly addictive personalities and are often depressed. Its hard to make good decisions when your really depressed and thats why you shouldnt smoke unless you got life balanced out and you shouldn't smoke to make you feel better when your sad. Thats a dangerous path to go on I think. Weed should be used to enhance experiences not to take pain/sadness away.

So I think people just need to be honest with themselves about their will power , how susceptible they are to addiction their overall happiness and well being before taking weed. Weed isnt for everyone . They should also know how much, how often, and when to smoke as well.

2nd thing I wanted to talk about was weed being a gateway drug. I'm sure some people start with smoking weed and then move onto other harder drugs but I think the number is relatively low and I think it wouldnt happen as much if it were legal. When you buy weed from a dealer he most likely isn't just selling weed often he's selling other drugs and will probably ask you if u wanna buy some if he has any clue how to deal. Also if you develop a immunity its not like developing an immunity to harder drugs there is no chance of overdosing or having really adverse sideaffects. People often just smoke more or smoke better stuff.

Cliffs -

-Weed is good
-Weed can be addictive for some people
- use weed wisely
- its a gateway drug but its due to the illegality
- weed might cause psychosis
- I <3 gregy

congrats. and good luck. (fellow MD'er..transplanted out west now) I struggled with the opiates for 10+ years (Bmore's a tough town. ****'s everywhere lol) but have been clean for a good while now. anyway, just wanted to chime in with a little support.