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Old 09-12-2013, 07:14 AM   #251
RichGangi
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

I just want to chime in and say how ****ing dumb it is for ppl to question Viffers gambling rep because he's arguing his side here. He'd be a fool not to AND he's willing to back up his stance with an escrow and knowledgeable judges.

From pool, to poker, and every bet in between, AFAIK he is a stand up guy when it comes to gambling.

Carry on....
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Old 09-12-2013, 07:56 AM   #252
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

idk how you say that.. so far itt hes tried to lay many bets, one of which was taken up on and quickly forgotten until he tried to turn the odds around because why wouldnt someone take both sides?!

seems really silly to even keep arguing it with him, esp after jungles texts basically end it all and numerous good posts have fallen on deaf ears
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Old 09-12-2013, 08:08 AM   #253
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by jungleman View Post
You've talked to me huh? You offered me a deal? I tried to negotiate with you multiple times, but you declined.

Check the dates. Texted him after this also, before he posted

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/202/a5ui.png/


Are you guys taking a few weeks to respond to each other or are these all the texts between you?
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Old 09-12-2013, 08:18 AM   #254
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

that was the recent, relevant thread. I can post the whole thread if necessary
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Old 09-12-2013, 08:45 AM   #255
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by jungleman View Post
that was the recent, relevant thread. I can post the whole thread if necessary
Yes, please post. Think it will be good to see.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:23 AM   #256
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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It is unreasonable to say he should of left his home country to play online poker
Once again, you might have a point there, except for the fact that DURRRR DID EXACTLY THAT.
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:32 AM   #257
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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viffer have you addressed the fact since black friday durrrr has spent months out of the country playing the macau live games? given than he issued the challenge getting it completed should have been his priority. Durrrr made the decision to prioritize the macau live games which cost him some money (by paying jungleman) if black friday never happened what makes you think the challenge would have finished by now? durrrr would have still been flying to and from macau for weeks at a time and avoiding the challenge ($/hr was greater in live games as he addressed on 2p2 a while back) just like he was doing pre BF.

not bothered who wins or the outcome of the challenge as i have no money on the line
As someone who bet on the side, i dont care what tom did in his free time. Its irrelevant. I guess preblack friday tom payed a fine for not playing, Great, he was trying to do the right thing and had other more important things to do. Tom was claiming to be the best at the world at the time, to be the best you have to be able to stay sharpe, practice every day, play tough competention, be challenged. The doj took that away from him and it puts him at a disadvantage now.

Just because Durr at some point went out side of his home country to play, doesnt mean he should be expected too, i say it would take 6-12 months of him playing top players to get back to a level to be able to compete, ask sports pros, He needs rehabilitation that he cant get in the usa.


Or are you going to say poker is a luck game now?







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jungleman
Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine
that was the recent, relevant thread. I can post the whole thread if necessary
Oh no, please dont post my text messages!!!!!! I have Zero to hide.
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:39 AM   #258
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I perfectly anticipated this reply, and already had a response written out, but I did not think that you would have the gall to suggest that Jungleman is somehow more popular than Durrrr. Reminiscent of Viffer making up reasons to get out of his bet.



Yes. Seriously, I would be sick to my stomach. This is a warning to really not trust ANYONE. Money gonna money.


Actually, there aren't. The reason I'm so vociferously defending Jungleman is not because I have a vested interest, but because sometimes I see an injustice so great that for better or worse I cannot keep my mouth shut. I have zero affiliation with Jungleman.

Jungleman is literally getting ****ed to the tune of 3 million dollars because Durrrr simply decided that he doesn't feel like paying anymore. Just because you backed someone that is not playing fair, it does not by proxy excuse you from honorable conduct.
Well said
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:47 AM   #259
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

This is really unfortunate. We could sit here using all the logic from all the smartest men in in the world and Viffer will continue to spew his poorly typed poorly thought out bulls.hit. He clearly does not care what anyone has to say, he's just defending his "right" to not pay - to himself. I think Viffer truly believes in his mind that he is right.

In about 40 separate posts, Viffer has conveyed approximately two points, both which have been proven to be invalid. I think there are some valuable lessons to take away here, and one of the most important ones is to have EVERYTHING in a LEGAL DOCUMENT if you are partaking in a wager involving what is to you considered a significant amount of money.

There is not much else to say other than trust NOONE (especially live players), and reputation means nothing.

Last edited by Deldar182; 09-12-2013 at 11:16 AM.
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:59 AM   #260
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by Deldar182 View Post
This is really unfortunate. We could sit here using all the logic from all the smartest men in in the world and Viffer will continue to spew his poorly typed poorly thought out bulls.hit. He clearly does not care what anyone has to say, he's just defending his "right" to not pay - to himself. I think Viffer truly believes in his mind that he is right.

In about 40 separate posts, Viffer has conveyed approximately two points, both which have been proven to be invalid. I think there are some valuable lessons to take away here, and one of the most important ones is to have EVERYTHING in a LEGAL DOCUMENT if you are partaking in a wager involving what is to you considered a significant amount of money.

There is not much else to say other than trust NOONE (especially live players), and reputation means nothing.

You are so wrong here, I have been willing to put my money where my mouth is and ask some of the smartest most knoweldgable people in the world.

You say they are telling me im wrong, Who knows what they are talking about that is stating facts that im wrong?

I am usually told im wrong on here alot, and by the end of it, viffer not so wrong.

Deldar we can bet 50-500k and goto any supreme court judge and let them decide whos right here? Lets let people who really know this stuff decide?\


You say you have no Financial interest in this, didnt we almost make a 500k bet? So you went from betting 500k to not betting a thing? Sounds like bull**** to me.


Quote:
We could sit here using all the logic from all the smartest men in in the world and Viffer will continue to spew his poorly typed poorly thought out bulls.hit.
PLease point out these people to everyone, we must of missed them?
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:36 AM   #261
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

I already said I have no vested interest. I'm glad I didn't make that bet with you. You are getting opinions from some very qualified people - the ARBITRATORS and other HIGH STAKES POKER PLAYERS. This isn't a football match, so stop calling it one.

The fact that there are no cold hard facts is what caused the problem in the first place, and that's why everything needs to be in writing, or we end up with the fiasco that we have right here.

You've made a tonne of posts which basically say:

- I will bet with you (gl ever betting with someone from here again)
- Black Friday changed everything (Except apparently Durrrr immediately moved countries to continue playing live and online poker - so in actuality it changed nothing. Not to mention he was dodging Jungleman before the challenge).

Last edited by Deldar182; 09-12-2013 at 11:42 AM. Reason: .
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:37 AM   #262
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Originally Posted by viffer View Post
.I have been put at an unfair advantage by some thing that could never have been seen. You say that im so wrong yet its just your opinion.?
Is the disadvantage because your horse is losing now? That's the only disadvantage I can see!

The sports betting analogy is so off and his only argument, my guess is he's asked his pal's in LV who sport bet and they couldn't be bothered to argue with him.

No I don't want to bet with you and your "judges" Viffer, No one wants to bet anything with you, stop defending your side with these ridiculous bets.

The bet was on 50k hands. This is going to be played. WHAT IS THE PROBLEM? There was nothing regarding time length.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:52 AM   #263
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by Deldar182 View Post
I already said I have no vested interest. I'm glad I didn't make that bet with you. You are getting opinions from some very qualified people - the ARBITRATORS and other HIGH STAKES POKER PLAYERS. This isn't a football match, so stop calling it one.

The fact that there are no cold hard facts is what caused the problem in the first place, and that's why everything needs to be in writing, or we end up with the fiasco that we have right here.

You've made a tonne of posts which basically say:

- I will bet with you (gl ever betting with someone from here again)
- Black Friday changed everything (Except apparently Durrrr immediately moved countries to continue playing live and online poker - so in actuality it changed nothing. Not to mention he was dodging Jungleman before the challenge).
Good luck ever betting anyone where, name one person i owe money to? What is wrong with adressing an issue, and offering to put your money behind it? You just want to0 throw your opinion out there? We shouyld all listen to you because you say so?


Im sorry i dont want to be freerolled or put at a disadvantage. Im sorry Zeejustins opinion doesnt mean much to me, hes biased, and has other questionmarks in his past. I like justin as a person, IM not sayingnhes a bad guy just that he shouldnt be an arbitratior. His judgement and intentions are in question.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:55 AM   #264
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

Quote:
The bet was on 50k hands. This is going to be played. WHAT IS THE PROBLEM? There was nothing regarding time length.

Some thing out of everyones control made it so one of the players couldnt continue to work at his profession. To be a top professional in any sport you have to practice, play. preform and be tested. This oppertunity was taken away.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:57 AM   #265
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Some thing out of everyones control made it so one of the players couldnt continue to work at his profession. To be a top professional in any sport you have to practice, play. preform and be tested. This oppertunity was taken away.
No it wasnt. As everyone has pointed out, Tom moved out of the country allowing him to play online as much as he wanted. It was his decision not to. This 100% voids any argument you keep trying to make but yet you seem to ignore these posts.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:01 PM   #266
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

No big surprise Viffer thinks its acceptable to offer challenges to the world then when someone takes you up on said challenge to duck and dodge when you get stuck a bunch....he's the same person that is trying to back out of all his bets.

It doesn't matter how many people post intelligent, logical, rebuttals to the statements he's making...he simply doesn't want to pay so he's never gonna give in. When 20 different people that are all smarter than him all disagree with him he realizes he's wrong.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:08 PM   #267
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by LucidDream View Post
No big surprise Viffer thinks its acceptable to offer challenges to the world then when someone takes you up on said challenge to duck and dodge when you get stuck a bunch....he's the same person that is trying to back out of all his bets.

It doesn't matter how many people post intelligent, logical, rebuttals to the statements he's making...he simply doesn't want to pay so he's never gonna give in. When 20 different people that are all smarter than him all disagree with him he realizes he's wrong.
Just name the 20 people who are more qualified then me on this topic? I doubt there is 2 in this thread that have more experiance gambling then me.

Its real simple, pick someone way smarter then all of us and let them decide.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:13 PM   #268
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by viffer View Post
Some thing out of everyones control made it so one of the players couldnt continue to work at his profession. To be a top professional in any sport you have to practice, play. preform and be tested. This oppertunity was taken away.
lol
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:18 PM   #269
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

you guys should ask galfond, ivey and sauce what they think
(i have no idea if any of them have action on this).

Last edited by riverboatking; 09-12-2013 at 12:29 PM.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:20 PM   #270
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by viffer View Post
Good luck ever betting anyone where, name one person i owe money to? What is wrong with adressing an issue, and offering to put your money behind it? You just want to0 throw your opinion out there? We shouyld all listen to you because you say so?


Im sorry i dont want to be freerolled or put at a disadvantage. Im sorry Zeejustins opinion doesnt mean much to me, hes biased, and has other questionmarks in his past. I like justin as a person, IM not sayingnhes a bad guy just that he shouldnt be an arbitratior. His judgement and intentions are in question.
You twisted my words to make it look like it was only me and ZJ who are telling you you're wrong. In fact many different respected posters have chimed in here. One person has taken your side. One. Not only that, but in taking your side, he has completely ignored every post you've made.

You can do whatever you want; I'm not telling you to stop. Noone's forcing you to respect the posters' opinions here - you clearly do not. If you can't figure out why people might not want to bet with you in the future then maybe you're right, and I'm in fact wrong. I respect that you're trying to defend your position, but as far as I can see, you've not brought anything new to the table past your first couple of posts- yet somehow there are 200+ posts of debate. That is why I made a summative post.

Last edited by Deldar182; 09-12-2013 at 12:26 PM.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:24 PM   #271
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by riverboatking View Post
you guys should ask galfond, ivey and sauce what they think.
Just curious what do you think? Am i delusional? Do you think what i am saying holds any air?

Not weather im wrong or right, just weather i have a valid arguement.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:25 PM   #272
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Just name the 20 people who are more qualified then me on this topic? I doubt there is 2 in this thread that have more experiance gambling then me.

Its real simple, pick someone way smarter then all of us and let them decide.
You are the only one that thinks you are qualified. Just because you have gambling experience doesnt really mean anything at all if this is the way you have conducted yourself throughout your career. All it means is that you have more experience in dodging paying bets apparently.


Viffer: If Tom came into this thread and said everything you said was absolutely dead wrong, would you still think you are correct?
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:32 PM   #273
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by BreakYaNeck View Post
You are the only one that thinks you are qualified. Just because you have gambling experience doesnt really mean anything at all if this is the way you have conducted yourself throughout your career. All it means is that you have more experience in dodging paying bets apparently.


Viffer: If Tom came into this thread and said everything you said was absolutely dead wrong, would you still think you are correct?
I think toms less qualified to judge this then justin is.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:34 PM   #274
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Just name the 20 people who are more qualified then me on this topic? I doubt there is 2 in this thread that have more experiance gambling then me.
I'm sure you're right about that. But being a better hustler than anyone in this thread doesn't make you smarter than them or more qualified to discuss something you actually seem to know very little about. You just keep making the same irrelevant points over and over.

You really only have 1 base point and that is that Black Friday caused durrrr to not be able to keep up with his level of playing ability as it was before BF.


That has been proven not to be true because:

1) The challenge should have been over before BF anyway
2) The challenge could have been played out immediately after on Stars had durrrr not told jungle he wanted to wait until FTP came back up.
3) Once FTP came back up durrrr should have been ready to resume the challenge immediately but wasn't, has now had 10 months or so since FTP has been back up and is still not ready to resume....why?

Why do you believe he shouldn't have been ready to resume the challenge within 10 months of FTP being back up when durrrr specifically told jungle that is what they were waiting for?

You do realize Tom is the one that issued this challenge right? I don't care how much gambling experience you have, if you think Tom isn't obligated to finish this challenge in a reasonable amount of time you're either a complete moron or you're being a scumbag and trying to freeroll everyone.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:37 PM   #275
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Re: September HSNL **** Thread -- HU Challenges: WCG vs Sauce and Man vs Machine

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Originally Posted by riverboatking View Post
you guys should ask galfond, ivey and sauce what they think
(i have no idea if any of them have action on this).
can we bet on what they think?

Is there a reason viffer is still fighting this nonsense other than Alaei started it up again? Does he realize even Alaei thinks viffer is wrong?

Last edited by jungleman; 09-12-2013 at 12:43 PM.
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