**Rainbow Flops: The GLBTQ Discussion Thread**

[SGT RJ]

Originally Posted by CalNaughtonRipken

Two time NFL Pro Bowl Tight End, 13 year member of the Washington Redskins and honoree of their Ring Of Fame, Jerry Smith took no action to hide his homosexuality during his career. He played from 1965-1977. Other gay NFL players of that era speak admiringly of the courageous way that Jerry Smith chose to live his life during an era where public hostility was likely far greater than today.

I was unaware of this. Was this ever covered at all? I mean, was it widely known to the public at the time (I was born in '76, so of course I have no memory of that time period)?

Interesting, though. I think given the current media and social attention on the LGBT community we are going to see an openly gay major sports athlete sometime relatively soon, and it's going to be all over the news. ESPN will have a seizure just covering this one thing.

And there have been gay athletes we knew about before, but there has yet to be an openly out gay male athlete in one of the "big three" American sports (baseball, basketball, and handegg). You can probably throw hockey in there as well.

There are openly lesbian WNBA players, but that doesn't tweak people as much, because those are women doing something "manly" anyway (playing a sport for a living!), so them being gay seems more normal somehow. This isn't my thought process, BTW, I'm just explaining the general public take on gay female athletes.

[drkamikaze]

Originally Posted by azrit1

Drkamikaze- I'm a femme who is into butches. But I'm spoken for. We are on the tables but people don't "see us" because they assume we are straight. I have faced plenty of discrimination at the tables for being a woman or being a person of color. Last month a guy called me a "****** bitch" after I took a series of pots off of him. But even as an "out" femme, people at the tables don't know.

Yes, I know what you mean. Femme visibility is frequently an issue. Personally, I think I can spot a femme tho, even amongst a straight crowd.

Originally Posted by azrit1

Guess I should have known that "derogatory name for Blacks" would be edited out. I'm sure everyone understands anyway.

That really sucks. Seems like sometimes the worst in people comes out at the poker table. I hear you, I have been called a lot of derogatory names over the years. The only thing we can do is do our best not to let them get under our skin.

[AAmaz0n]

Originally Posted by CalNaughtonRipken

Jerry Smith may not have "come out" formally but he didn't hide either. Many people in the DC area during his career were aware of Mr. Smith's lifestyle. For people under the age of 40 it may be difficult to believe that most celebrities lives weren't scrutinized remotely near the level that they are today. People could live a very public life yet maintain significant privacy.

Yeah, it was a very different era where folks private lives actually had a chance to remain private. It just wasn't considered "real journalism" to go after dirt on people, and mainstream papers wouldn't print a lot of stuff that they knew about because it wasn't really hard news.

According to the book "When Pride Still Mattered", Vince Lombardi knew about Jerry Smith when he took over the Redskins and wouldn't let him be harassed by players or staff. Lombardi had a gay brother, and apparently was sensitive about discrimination. He also encouraged his staff to work with another player who was gay, Ray McDonald.

"I want you to get on McDonald and work on him and work on him - and if I hear one of you people make reference to his manhood, you'll be out of here before your ass hits the ground," Lombardi said, according to biographer David Maraniss.

Shauna

[SGT RJ]

Wow, that's pretty great. I had no idea about any of that, and I doubt many current sports fans do either. Someone should write an article or something highlighting this.

Gay players have been here as long as there were sports (just like there have always been gays in the military). There's zero reason that sexual orientation should have anything to do with stuff like this. Hopefully society in general and male dominated cultures like sports and the military will start to catch up.

FWIW, I think that gays serving openly isn't a big deal even in a lot of military sectors. I think it depends a lot on the unit - direct combat units tend to be more cliquish - but the military actually has a decent track record, once they decide to stop discriminating, of integrating fairly quickly. There are times when the "that's the way it is, this comes from the top, so just do it and STFU" mentality is a good thing.

[venice10]

Originally Posted by AAmaz0n

Lombardi had a gay brother, and apparently was sensitive about discrimination.

I don't know if Lombardi was sensitive to the issue, but the story about a reporter asking a black player in the early 1960's is instructive. When asked if Lombardi discriminated against blacks, the player responded, "Oh no sir. He treats everyone like a ******."

It was probably more of a, "if you can help me win, I don't give a **** what you do in your off hours." In some senses, that is the most enlightened position of all to take.

[Protential]

http://news.yahoo.com/why-gay-parent...131902676.html

[Protential]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg6Jrsjq7zw

[ftn_chris]

Originally Posted by Protential

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg6Jrsjq7zw

such a great scene, and aaron sorkin/jed bartlet is the perfect vehicle for the rhetoric.

i miss the west wing

[Protential]

Originally Posted by ftn_chris

such a great scene, and aaron sorkin/jed bartlet is the perfect vehicle for the rhetoric.

i miss the west wing

+inf, such an amazing tv show.

[DarkMagus]

Originally Posted by Protential

http://news.yahoo.com/why-gay-parent...131902676.html

cool article

[Rcwillie1]

Anyone living in the SF Bay Area? Anyone play live around here?

Thanks for the info Rupert. I played in a WSOP PLO with Keston this summer, but I couldn't figure out who it was until your post (I figured he was a pro - gay though?!).

[bluffer232]

Wow how did i just find this thread? Thanks protential for starting it!
Anyway, anyone here play in the Chicago area? Just wondering if other gay poker players actually do exist in this city lol

[ftn_chris]

Originally Posted by Rcwillie1

Anyone living in the SF Bay Area? Anyone play live around here?

bay 101 most wednesdays and fridays

[Rcwillie1]

Unfortunately, I play at Lucky Chances due to being carless. I'm there on most weekends and a few nights during the week. You live in SJ then?

[ftn_chris]

Originally Posted by Rcwillie1

Unfortunately, I play at Lucky Chances due to being carless. I'm there on most weekends and a few nights during the week. You live in SJ then?

finishing up at UCSC. i went to LC for some series they ran at the end of last year, but bay 101 has sort of become a habit for any standard day of feeling like playing some live poker. also hearing about some stabbing in the parking lot of LC wasn't a plus.

edit: nvm i was thinking of garden city. never been to lucky chances.