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Old 05-14-2012, 07:27 PM   #16
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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Originally Posted by genher View Post
a better approach might be to calculate at what eff stack in BB you can minRaise/call a shove vs 2 or 3 typical 3 bet shoving range. something like that :



1st column is your equity, 2nd is at what stack depth (in BB b4 posting)you can minraise/ call a shove. for instance: you can minraise call a shove with K8o at 6.8BB or shallower if your villain 3 betshove any A, any pair, Any Bdway. But not any deeper than that.
Awesome tool, thanks genher.
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:34 PM   #17
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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^
nice. which tool did you use for the math? propokertools?
cardrunnersEV
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:44 PM   #18
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

Wow Genher great post! would also like to hear how you made it.

edit: Cardrunners EV just spits it out like that? or you did loads of work with excel too?
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:50 PM   #19
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

cardrunnersEV can generate the Equity for every hand vs a range then it's just a matter of copying it to the spreadsheet and input a simple formula to find out the eff stack
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Old 05-14-2012, 10:03 PM   #20
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

hmm I have code to do the equity for every hand vs any range (and fast too!), but the "simple formula" part I do not know, lol I should really. I'm sure I can work it out if I think about it, but do you mind sharing?
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Old 05-14-2012, 10:18 PM   #21
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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Originally Posted by _dave_ View Post
hmm I have code to do the equity for every hand vs any range (and fast too!), but the "simple formula" part I do not know, lol I should really. I'm sure I can work it out if I think about it, but do you mind sharing?
I have done this a long time ago. Now I kind of "know". I even had to scan a old paper cause I can't find it on my pc. I honestly can't remember too well but I think something like 1+(eq vs the range/100*2))/(1-(eq vs the range/100*2) !?? you might have to double check tho
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Old 05-14-2012, 11:07 PM   #22
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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hmm I have code to do the equity for every hand vs any range
what type of code?
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Old 05-14-2012, 11:45 PM   #23
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

hackish AutoHotkey, naturally Though it won't do individual cards, only e.g. AQo vs 22+ A2s+ A8o+ for example. but individual suitedness is irrelevant preflop imo unless you're superusering. basiclaly I've got all the individual had matchups pre-calculated/saved (this took many hours!) and can just rip through the results that make up a range, balancing according to weight. Though there's plenty of code out there to actually do the hand vs hand results, RayW "2+2 evaluator" in crazy hacker C++ (naturally) being the fastest currently known.

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I even had to scan a old paper
awesome. now you mention it it's obvious from the pic, at first I just wondered wtf compression used on this lol.

I don't understand that equation but it's a starting point, thanks no 3 or perhaps 1.5 in it confuses me lol.
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Old 05-15-2012, 12:40 AM   #24
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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I don't understand that equation but it's a starting point, thanks no 3 or perhaps 1.5 in it confuses me lol.
ya doesn't look right I'll have a bit more time later (I think...) I'll look into it
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Old 05-15-2012, 03:53 AM   #25
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

you have a screwed up column, check 3s in the bottom table
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Old 05-15-2012, 09:54 AM   #26
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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you have a screwed up column, check 3s in the bottom table
yes you are right. this old sheet is all fckedup. Originaly I just wanted to show OP the kind of thing he could do but he looks like I have just given myself a bit of extra work

Anyhow, now that I have posted this I might as well post something correct. So @ Dave formula is : (1.5+Eq vs the range)/(1-(2*Eq vs the range)) that should give you the effective stack in BB AFTER posting but BEFORE minRaising when you can call the 3 bet shove.

and here is the corrected sheet:



as before first column is the Equity vs the range and second column shows the eff stack in BB where you can minRaise/call the 3 bet shove (obviously shallower is ok too)

Should be ok now ( I have only checked 3, it's late here) let me know if there is any more bugs

if anyone want the same kind of sheet but with a different range ask quickly while I am on a roll, i'll do it.
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Old 05-15-2012, 12:22 PM   #27
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

If you wouldn't mind, chart against some more spewy/shalow 3bet jam range would be nice,
imo sth like: 22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q4s+,J6s+,T6s+,96s+,86s+,76s,A2o+,K5 o+,Q7o+,J7o+,T8o+,98o
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:17 PM   #28
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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If you wouldn't mind, chart against some more spewy/shalow 3bet jam range would be nice,
imo sth like: 22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q4s+,J6s+,T6s+,96s+,86s+,76s,A2o+,K5 o+,Q7o+,J7o+,T8o+,98o
ROFL. bro, the guy has already been nice enough to go out of his way to post the corrected chart and has also given the formula and the website that he was able to do this at. its not something that just take a minute. if you want him to expand the 3bet/calling range either offer him money or do it yourself IMO. jeesh. ty to OP that actually really came in handy to me.
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:19 PM   #29
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

*not OP, but genher i ment.
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:57 PM   #30
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Re: 3 Bet Calling Ranges

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if anyone want the same kind of sheet but with a different range ask quickly while I am on a roll, i'll do it.
DUCY?
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